View Poll Results: Grade Bargnani's game.

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  • A

    8 6.50%
  • B

    47 38.21%
  • C

    29 23.58%
  • D

    18 14.63%
  • F

    21 17.07%
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Thread: Everything Bargnani: The Legend Continues

  1. #8821
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote TRX wrote: View Post
    @ Matt52:

    My bad, I did misinterpret. If I'm reading correctly now, you meant Chicago has more garbage time in games. Of course... but how is that relevant? I have already accepted that Boozer is an upgrade over Bargnani. Will he contribute to Toronto being more competitive? Only if the Raptors insist on giving Bargnani significant minutes. But that's not conceding anything since there is a third option which I already mentioned.

    Oh, that's impressive. So instead of seventh, he's been upgraded to essentially their worst starter and somehow, this is a point in his favour. Even if he were on the Raptors, there are players that should get playing time ahead of Boozer. I hope you realize you're advocating trading the worst player on the Raptors making $10 million a year for a bit player making $15 million a year. Neither player is really significant at all in the grand scheme of things, but one makes a more significant amount of money than the other. In a vacuum, of course I'd rather have Boozer than Bargnani. Nobody has really argued that one for one, Boozer is not a better player. But when neither player should really be seeing significant minutes on the floor, how does that help at all? You're acting like anybody wants to hold onto Bargnani; they (and I) would just rather not have a more expensive outcast instead.

    Just because Bargnani makes eight figures does not mean the Raptors are obligated to give him time on the court. If he's hurting the team, logically, he should be seeing no floor time. If Boozer is a below average contributor, plug in an average contributor - and this is the key - that is already on the Raptors. No need to pay an extra $4+ million to bring one in.

    And lol. Who's comparing "2 guys off court production across two different teams"? For someone who says facts are key, you sure do like to misrepresent and twist them. All I've said is Boozer is a consistently significant detriment defensively (yes, much like Bargnani), while not improving teams enough on offence to make up for it on both the Jazz and the Bulls.
    First bold:
    He is the leading scorer and rebounder per36 on the #5 seed in the east missing their franchise player and recent MVP. He is also one of just 9 players averaging over 9 rebounds and 15 points. Yeah, garbage that guy.

    Second bold:
    Yeah, lets just sit 19% of the salary cap because at least he won't make us lose.

    Third bold:
    What player are you going to sign for $4M that scores more and more efficiently and gives you more than double the rebounds? Remember you are sitting Bargnani so you are paying him $11M but now you have $4M to find a player to make up Boozer's production.

    Fourth:
    On/Off court net? Isn't that what you were going on about prior? Didn't you repeatedly refer to the play of Chicago and Toronto with each player Off the court and how much better Chicago was?


    Conclusion:
    This is getting tiring.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  2. #8822
    Raptors Republic All-Star Puffer's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    ...Conclusion:
    This is getting tiring.
    Conclusion: Time to bow out. Somebody let somebody else have the last word. ;-)

  3. #8823
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    Linus Kleiza on the trading block: http://www.lrytas.lt/-13611714541360...klub%C4%85.htm

  4. #8824
    Raptors Republic Veteran white men can't jump's Avatar
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    Doug Smith's latest Bargs update...hopefully something changes this week.

    The Raptors?

    Word from the executives I talked to over the weekend here and by electronic methods, all suggested there’s not an awful lot of trade activity percolating right now, which we all know can change at the drop of a hat.

    The big one, of course, is Bargnani and one note I got this weekend simply said:

    “Looks like the summer.”

    Now, I know Bryan pretty well and I would say he’ll do something small this week, it’s like second nature to him, to make a deadline-week deal just to be in the fray.

    But, at this minute, there’s nothing serious going on for anyone, which is good since I have an hour of work and then a three-hour flight to deal with.
    http://thestar.blogs.com/raptors/

  5. #8825
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote white men can't jump wrote: View Post
    Doug Smith's latest Bargs update...hopefully something changes this week.



    http://thestar.blogs.com/raptors/

    *FacePalm*

    followed by

    *BangingHeadOnDesk*
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  6. #8826
    Raptors Republic Superstar Rapstor4Life's Avatar
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    Fuck! ........ Bargs value can only get better right? Right???????????? :|

  7. #8827
    Raptors Republic Rookie GoldenBaller's Avatar
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    Quote Rapstor4Life wrote: View Post
    Fuck! ........ Bargs value can only get better right? Right???????????? :|
    That's what I'm hoping... It can only go up or down, considering all the offers rumored to have been on the table, I think it's a good idea just to wait. But as soon as a decent offer comes up, take it!

  8. #8828
    Raptors Republic Superstar Rapstor4Life's Avatar
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    I was expecting at the very least some random player that we just have and get rid of by summer break and a 1st round pick for this year. I would have been happy with that, very happy with that.

    Bargs is wound that requires closing... BC is hoping to sell his golden child high I hope he isnt going to buy into the idea hes good to have around off the bench.

  9. #8829
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    This bit from Italy sums up the whole current situation with Bargnani (thanks to Google Translate):

    NBA Andrea Bargnani remains on the market. But Toronto could keep it
    Milan, February 18, 2013

    For the Magician came forward Chicago, Philadelphia, Charlotte, Golden State and Cleveland. But the Raptors, unconvinced by the offers, are considering whether to wait for the summer

    Three days to decide the future of Andrea Bargnani. The NBA market closes Thursday at 21 Italian and the Magician is always among the main suspects to change teams. At the door of the Raptors so far would have knocked in five: Chicago, Philadelphia, Charlotte, Cleveland and Golden State. But Toronto is not convinced and would be thinking of postponing the summer goodbye to what the president Bryan Colangelo called "the greatest riddle of Toronto", under contract to 22.2 million the next two seasons and in the midst of the worst season career. Here's the situation.

    Chicago - The offer of the Bulls has long been known: the Magician and John Lucas III for Carlos Boozer and Nate Robinson. The Magician Marco Belinelli find himself in Chicago (a few days ago advised him to change air), would play alongside strong defensively as a center Joakim Noah with a play like Derrick Rose (when he returns) and with a coach like Tom Thibodeau that would put him under pressure to improve defensively and ask him to give the Bulls a prank by three more. Chicago the deal can be done at any time, but the deal is in stand-by: Toronto but is not convinced to take Boozer, under contract to 32.1 million the next two seasons, as already will have to give 37.2 million until 2015 to Rudy Gay, just purchased from Memphis.

    Philadelphia - The Sixers season is not going as planned, as Andrew Bynum, great buy summer, has not yet taken the field for injury. Philadelphia travels with 22 wins and 29 lost in season and needs a long time. It would be on the trail of Josh Smith of Atlanta, the most valuable piece on the market in January, but he also talked with the Raptors Bargnani. The package that the Sixers would ship in Toronto would be focused on Spencer Hawes, 24-year old center from 10.2 points and 6.4 rebounds he still has a contract year, to 6.5 million. With another player (Royal Ivey?) And a pick in the draft the offer to the Raptors would not mind. But Philadelphia will move only after having ascertained that it can not get to Smith.

    charlotte - The Bobcats have a necessity to get rid of as soon as Ben Gordon, who could become a free agent in June whether to decline the 13.2 million that is on the payroll in 2013-14, became a burden for the team after the collision with coach Mike Dunlap last week. Michael Jordan and his executives would speak with Brooklyn of an exchange with Kris Humphries and even with Bargnani Toronto, convinced that the Wizard can give a little 'of experience to a young team. But the Raptors Gordon (12.6 points per game in 47 games this year) would serve little, because on the outside there are already DeMar DeRozan, Rudy Gay, Landry Fields and Terrence Ross.


    cleveland and golden state - Cavs and Warriors would be added in the last hour race Bargnani. Golden State could bring to the table Andris Biedrins and Richard Jefferson (both have the opportunity to become a free agent after this season), plus a future first round selection in the draft. Bargnani would reserve the Warriors in a frontcourt that has David Lee and Andrew Bogut holders irremovable. But it would be a playoff team. Cleveland instead should give the Raptors the expiring contracts of Luke Walton and Daniel Gibson, but also would be willing to sacrifice Marresse Speights, more useful in Toronto. With the Cavs, orphans for the rest of the season for Anderson Varejao, Bargnani would the holder with Tristan Thompson, second year on the rise.

    toronto - The Raptors, however, may decide to wait for the summer to give Bargnani. Because the leadership Canadian dreamed of sacrificing the Wizard to arrive at Pau Gasol, but injured for 6-8 weeks. The Lakers would find in the blue wing of the strong suits of the game D'Antoni, Toronto Gasol in a star turn in the symbol of the franchise along with Rudy Gay. But waiting is risky because Bargnani is disputed by the fans, he played 29 'in the last two games (thanks influenza) and will have to retrain as a sixth man. Keep it could still reduce the value of a former first overall pick the limits of which are known to all. Toronto still has some time to decide.


    http://www.gazzetta.it/Nba/18-02-201...67100514.shtml
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  10. #8830
    Raptors Republic Veteran white men can't jump's Avatar
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    Quote GoldenBaller wrote: View Post
    That's what I'm hoping... It can only go up or down, considering all the offers rumored to have been on the table, I think it's a good idea just to wait. But as soon as a decent offer comes up, take it!
    No, it can also stay the same

    Truth is, we have no idea what will happen with Andrea's value. Frankly some of the offers are pretty crap so I can't see it going further down, to me it will likely stay the same or go up (not likely either, but who knows).

  11. #8831
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Not that it means much but Brotherston @HoopsWorld.com is a fan of acquring Boozer.


    If MLSE & Colangelo really want to give Raptors fans hope – they’ll open their big very fat wallet and do the heavily rumored deal for Carlos Boozer – that deal takes the Bulls out of the tax and makes the Raptors a luxury tax team. It’s time for the very deep pocketed ownership in Toronto to prove they want a winner – Rogers, Bell & MLSE can afford the cost of the Raptors being a tax team – Every Single Year! The long suffering Toronto fans deserve it – it’s time to get a playoff team back in the Big Smoke

    Read more at http://www.hoopsworld.com/nba-chat-w...or8ZHJ471Ys.99

    Steve

    How come Toronto isn’t going after guys like Josh Smith, Paul Millsap, Al Jefferson? If colangelo wants his job he has to get talent like that to pair up with the core of Demar, Rudy, Lowry and even boozer might be a guy that makes immediate impact. The thought of those players not re-signing in Toronto is ridiculous because that core with them is a dangerous team in the east.

    Stephen Brotherston

    Smith, Millsap, Jefferson are all on expiring deals – sure there is a deal to be made with those teams, what should Colangelo give up to get a guy who is likely to leave the Raptors in July?

    The difference with Boozer is there is 2 more seasons on his deal.

    The thought of guys not re-signing in Toronto after playing here for 2 months is not only reasonable, it should be considered likely – that’s way too much risk to take when the team’s only big dollar trade asset is Bargnani and you can only use that asset 1 time. It is far safer to go after guys on expiring deals in the summer as sign & trades.

    Steve

    If theres absolutely no good deal for bargnani in terms of talent coming to Toronto, will they just do the boozer deal? I don’t think guys like Gordon, hawes, ilyasova will be the final piece to the puzzle.

    Stephen Brotherston

    If the fans sit on their hands and don’t start making it obvious they would love a Bargnani for Boozer deal – we might just see MLSE sit on their wallet and think they have done enough.

    Gordon does nothing for the Raptors – that’s a very bad idea. Hawes or Ilyasova aren’t bad deals, but they aren’t the impact move adding Boozer would be. Those are the kind of deals that suggest the team is doing solid basketball moves within the luxury tax cap, but maybe they’ll never actually venture beyond that level of spending.

    Read more at http://www.hoopsworld.com/nba-chat-w...or8ZHJ471Ys.99


    #tradeBargnani

    Would you trade Bargnani/JL3 for Boozer/Robinson? What about if a 1st round pick was included from Chicago?

    What do you think the odds are of Bargnani getting moved before deadline?

    Stephen Brotherston

    Other than I’d rather sub in Acy and keep Lucas – I’m doing this deal.

    A Bargnani trade – should be better than 50/50 – it should be 100%, but we just don’t know how far MLSE is prepared to go

    Read more at http://www.hoopsworld.com/nba-chat-w...or8ZHJ471Ys.99
    2. I want to see a Boozer for Bargs deal – I want MLSE to finally start spending those profits to make the team as good as it can be, legit contender or merely pretender, at this point I don’t really care

    Read more at http://www.hoopsworld.com/nba-chat-w...or8ZHJ471Ys.99

    Kuda

    If Andrea is not traded im still ok with that,but if they are going to make a push why dont they do the Boozer/Robinson trade then? Push for either Smith or Milsap.

    Stephen Brotherston

    I am okay with Bargnani not being traded as well – no deal is better than a bad or risky deal.

    I’m all-in on the idea of a trade for Boozer – becoming a luxury tax team proves MLSE is committed to winning.

    Millsap or Smith are deals that should wait until the summer as S&T – no rent-a-player deals right now

    Read more at http://www.hoopsworld.com/nba-chat-w...or8ZHJ471Ys.99
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  12. #8832
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Just hours after the news broke that the Raptors had acquired Rudy Gay in a trade with the Grizzlies, Toronto general manager Bryan Colangelo made his next move clear. While joining the Raptors’ broadcast team for some nationally televised (via NBA TV) in-game chatter, Colangelo explicitly noted that he would be shopping Andrea Bargnani and said that the disappointing forward “… would not fight or resist a [new] situation.”

    Since then, Bargnani has been connected specifically to the Bulls in a potential swap for Carlos Boozer, and mentioned in a number of hypothetical scenarios born of the trade machine. It’s clear that the Raptors have every intention of moving on, but the latest update from Doug Smith of the Toronto Star suggests that a deal may come later rather than sooner:

    Word from the executives I talked to over the weekend here and by electronic methods, all suggested there’s not an awful lot of trade activity percolating right now, which we all know can change at the drop of a hat.

    The big one, of course, is Bargnani and one note I got this weekend simply said:

    “Looks like the summer.”

    There are a million reasons not to take that comment at face value, chief among them that the Raptors are likely still trying to build some semblance of leverage after Colangelo set fire to their negotiating position in front of a national television audience. In fact, this news really changes nothing; Bargnani is still a candidate to be moved, and the Raps are undoubtedly still entertaining a number of possible trade scenarios involving him.

    This merely suggests that they aren’t happy with the offers they’ve seen so far and are gently nudging the market along with the trade deadline rapidly approaching. They may make a deal or they may not, but their preference to ditch the two years and $22.2 million remaining on Bargnani’s deal after this season hasn’t changed.

    It also doesn’t hurt that the Raptors aren’t exactly in a rush. Toronto is a full six games behind the eighth-place Bucks in the Eastern Conference standings, making their immediate playoff chances a longshot. They acquired Gay with the intent of building around him, so they can afford to bide their time as they wait for the right offer to come along rather than jump on the first halfway-decent proposal.

    Regardless, Bargnani is on his way out, and whether he’s forced to pack his backs in the coming week or a few months down the line seems to rest solely on the quality of the pitches presented.

    http://nba.si.com/2013/02/18/andrea-...ronto-raptors/
    Nothing new to see here but I definitely agree with the take on Doug Smith's blog entry today: just trying to light a fire on the offers.

    In my opinion, if the Raptors can get a 1st out of Chicago, the Boozer deal is a no-brainer.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  13. #8833
    Raptors Republic Starter saints91's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Nothing new to see here but I definitely agree with the take on Doug Smith's blog entry today: just trying to light a fire on the offers.

    In my opinion, if the Raptors can get a 1st out of Chicago, the Boozer deal is a no-brainer.
    I prefer the proposed Sixers deal (Hawes, throw in and a 1st round pick). Basically we would have traded Bargnani for Lowry and Hawes. Sixers pick will be close to what we gave away to Houston.

  14. #8834
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote saints91 wrote: View Post
    I prefer the proposed Sixers deal (Hawes, throw in and a 1st round pick). Basically we would have traded Bargnani for Lowry and Hawes. Sixers pick will be close to what we gave away to Houston.
    Sixers don't have any picks to trade unless 2017 is available.

    2013 to Miami
    2015 to Orlando
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  15. #8835
    Raptors Republic Starter saints91's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Sixers don't have any picks to trade unless 2017 is available.

    2013 to Miami
    2015 to Orlando

    Damn article reporting false trade scenarios!

  16. #8836
    Raptors Republic Rookie Mal's Avatar
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    http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap...le-Has-Changed

    Don't like the sound of that. Though I'd be happy if we could make it work with him coming off the bench. Would rather ship him off now.

  17. #8837
    Raptors Republic Superstar Chr1s1anL's Avatar
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    Quote Mal wrote: View Post
    http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap...le-Has-Changed

    Don't like the sound of that. Though I'd be happy if we could make it work with him coming off the bench. Would rather ship him off now.
    Oh my god -_-. You know What happened right? BC went to practise last night and saw AB totally dismantle Amir and every other big. We have to trade now! Everytime BC gets a chance to see Barney healthy for a bit he falls back in love.

  18. #8838
    Raptors Republic Superstar Chr1s1anL's Avatar
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    His like that girl that thinks that he can change her asshole boyfriend.

  19. #8839
    Raptors Republic All-Star Balls of Steel's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Nothing new to see here but I definitely agree with the take on Doug Smith's blog entry today: just trying to light a fire on the offers.

    In my opinion, if the Raptors can get a 1st out of Chicago, the Boozer deal is a no-brainer.
    Chicago's going to need to sweeten the pot. I almost want this to happen now for the sake of the kind of players that we have now with Gay, Dero and Lowry. They really need a post threat.
    “The saving of our world from pending doom will come, not through the complacent adjustment of the conforming majority, but through the creative maladjustment of a nonconforming minority.” - Martin Luther King

  20. #8840
    Raptors Republic Superstar Chr1s1anL's Avatar
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    Quote Balls of Steel wrote: View Post
    Chicago's going to need to sweeten the pot. I almost want this to happen now for the sake of the kind of players that we have now with Gay, Dero and Lowry. They really need a post threat.
    Too much of are offense comes from the perimeter

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