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Thread: Why Can't Jarret Jack Be Our Point Guard Of The Future?

  1. #1
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    Default Why Can't Jarret Jack Be Our Point Guard Of The Future?

    I have been hearing a fair bit of criticism regarding our point guard situation and many people in these forums seem to feel like we desperately NEED to upgrade the position. Now, certainly we would all love to have Chris Paul or Rajon Rondo running the team but if you look at the 8 teams who made the playoffs last year in the Easter Conference, only Boston, Chicago, and you could talk me into Milwaukee with Jennings had point guards who are unquestionably more talented than Jack at this stage of their career.

    1 - Cleveland - Mo Williams

    Lebron, as a point forward, was really their main distributor but Mo Williams played the point there for the most part and I wouldn't categorize him as being superior to Jack. He can score a bit more but overall there is not much difference between the two.

    2 - Orlando - Jameer Nelson

    Definitely in the same category as Jack. A decent all around point guard.

    3 - Atlanta - Mike Bibby

    Jack takes the nod here as Bibby is on his last legs and is in a neck and neck race with Calderon for worst defensive point guard in the league.

    4 - Boston - Rajon Rondo

    Here Rondo takes the cake as he one of the best in the game. Not even close.

    5 - Miami - Mario Chalmers

    Edge to Jack here too although Wade is often the main distributor.

    6 - Milwaukee - Brandon Jennings

    They are not that far apart at this stage of their respective careers but Jennings has more natural talent and immense potential and will undoubtedly surpass Jack if he hasn't already.

    7 - Charlotte - DJ Augustin

    If I have to explain this one then you are probably on the wrong website.

    8 - Chicago - Derrick Rose

    Miles ahead of Jack.

    So my point is that Jack is a more than adequate option to run our team providing we surround him with the same talent level the above teams have. Now, getting that level of talent is the tricky part but this idea that until we get a great top ten point guard we are destined to struggle is completely nonsensical. Having a dominant point guard is great but not a necessity. If you look at the NBA champions of the millennium (Lakers, Spurs, Pistons, Celtics, Heat) only the Pistons with Billups had a point guard that they relied on to dominate the game. Parker has always been a key to the Spurs success but never more than a third option on offense. Rondo was the fourth option on that Celtics team that won and the best player on the team that lost.

    Jack is never going to be an All-Star but he is a point guard that can give you 12ppg, 6 apg, and plays average defense. That is the kind of player that can be an integral part of a championship team and not someone we should be rushing to move. At least that's how this Jerk sees it.

  2. #2
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    Default Because...

    he has reached his ceiling. On a team that struggles through free agency, the draft is our only way to get talent.
    We need Kyrie Irving. Otherwise we'll just be stuck with the mediocre basketball version of the Leafs.

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    Quote thatpeterjerk wrote: View Post
    If you look at the NBA champions of the millennium (Lakers, Spurs, Pistons, Celtics, Heat) only the Pistons with Billups had a point guard that they relied on to dominate the game. Parker has always been a key to the Spurs success but never more than a third option on offense. Rondo was the fourth option on that Celtics team that won and the best player on the team that lost.
    First option or not, Fisher, Parker, Chauncey, and Rondo are so far and away better than Jack it isn't funny. The reason PG is so important is because they dictate a great deal of what happens on both ends of the floor. Setting up plays and on the other end, disrupting the play from its start.

    Personally, my problem with Jack has nothing to do with his skills. Like you said, he gives you respectable numbers. But he's a fairweather player and I'm probably speaking for a lot of Raptor fans when I say that I'm tired of players like that. I don't want to see mister electric when they're up 20 playing the Nets and then have to sit through mister mopey when they're getting jacked (no pun) by 20 by the Thunder.

    PG is the natural leader position and I'd prefer someone more mentally strong, especially for a group that is this young. That's why I actually like Jose better. You can tell he's always intense, regardless of the score. Clapping and all :P

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    Raptors Republic Starter charlz's Avatar
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    Quote dboogie wrote: View Post
    he has reached his ceiling.
    thats it
    Effort A+
    Defense A
    protecting against turn overs C+
    Shot from range B-
    Breaking down a defense constantly and getting guys going D

    every once and a while he gets his slash-game going and it opens up the floor - but he just doesn't have elite level play making skills and quicks like the best do.

    That being said he is an NBA worthy PG and I like him.
    "I may be wrong ... but I doubt it"

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    Quote charlz wrote: View Post
    thats it
    Effort A+
    Defense A
    protecting against turn overs C+
    Shot from range B-
    Breaking down a defense constantly and getting guys going D

    every once and a while he gets his slash-game going and it opens up the floor - but he just doesn't have elite level play making skills and quicks like the best do.

    That being said he is an NBA worthy PG and I like him.
    I seriously question the A+ effort... unless he's playing a scrub team, his chin is permanently attached to his chest. And his defense is average at best :\ I think I would just give him Cs all around. Maybe a the B- on the shot.

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    Raptors Republic Rookie Jive's Avatar
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    I just want to say I feel JJ is a very capable point guard but if you are going to try to make an arguement that JJ and another point guard are "Definitely in the same category as Jack." or one gets an "Edge in this area" then you should back it up with metrics, not just on how you percieve their contributions are to their team.
    Last edited by Jive; Sun Aug 22nd, 2010 at 06:11 PM.

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    As of now I think he is. Just watched the US vs Spain game and Calderon not only sucked (as usual) but he also got injured I dont know how serious it is but he left and never returned (left in 3rd).
    Last edited by thomas1; Sun Aug 22nd, 2010 at 06:26 PM.

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    Raptors Republic Rookie Killingjoke's Avatar
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    Quote Raptor Cowboy wrote: View Post
    First option or not, Fisher, Parker, Chauncey, and Rondo are so far and away better than Jack it isn't funny. The reason PG is so important is because they dictate a great deal of what happens on both ends of the floor. Setting up plays and on the other end, disrupting the play from its start.

    Personally, my problem with Jack has nothing to do with his skills. Like you said, he gives you respectable numbers. But he's a fairweather player and I'm probably speaking for a lot of Raptor fans when I say that I'm tired of players like that. I don't want to see mister electric when they're up 20 playing the Nets and then have to sit through mister mopey when they're getting jacked (no pun) by 20 by the Thunder.

    PG is the natural leader position and I'd prefer someone more mentally strong, especially for a group that is this young. That's why I actually like Jose better. You can tell he's always intense, regardless of the score. Clapping and all :P
    What he said

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    Quote charlz wrote: View Post
    thats it
    Effort A+
    Defense A
    protecting against turn overs C+
    Shot from range B-
    Breaking down a defense constantly and getting guys going D

    every once and a while he gets his slash-game going and it opens up the floor - but he just doesn't have elite level play making skills and quicks like the best do.

    That being said he is an NBA worthy PG and I like him.
    You gave him an A for defence? Then where do you put Rondo and Billups?

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    Raptors Republic Rookie Jordan-Drexler's Avatar
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    INJURY REPORT :
    Blogger's note: Just talked to someone in Spain briefly: "Tweaked hamstring, will know more later."
    courtesy of the Star

    http://thestar.blogs.com/raptors/2010/0 ... l#comments

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    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    i feel he can be our point guard of the future in fact i know he's more than capable of it, but on a team with a bunch of young guys under 25, unless we get some other decent players in their prime.

    why should we have a soon to be 27 year old point guard, might as well just get a young one through the draft let them all grow with each other.
    If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?

    Sometimes, I like to buy a book on CD and listen to it, while reading music.

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    It's interesting that everyone has forgotten Jack coming to Vegas, connecting with the YGZ and working hard to be a leader this summer. He has addressed the sulking of last year and said that working on becoming a consistent leader on the floor and in the locker room is a big goal for this year. This team needs leadership as much as it need talent. We've had a lot of talented guys with no leadership skills... so many... like all of the past faces of the franchise.

  13. #13
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    we'll see in the season now won't we?
    If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?

    Sometimes, I like to buy a book on CD and listen to it, while reading music.

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    Jack is what I would term as a tweener pg.. not in position play so much as in talent. He is a very good backup pg and is great insurance in case of an elite pg going down. And has good trade value. For a developing team like the Raptors though, he is fine... until a pg of the future is drafted (such guys are not available in a trade...Collison might have been one but he's gone) and free agents tend to be on the downside of their careers.

  15. #15
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    Default You're Right.

    Quote Jive wrote: View Post
    I just want to say I feel JJ is a very capable point guard but if you are going to try to make an arguement that JJ and another point guard are "Definitely in the same category as Jack." or one gets an "Edge in this area" then you should back it up with metrics, not just on how you percieve their contributions are to their team.
    I see what you're saying and you're right. Showing all the numbers and going all sabremetric on everybody would have proved my point better. I actually did think about gathering all the point guards stats and doing a player by player breakdown and comparison to Jack...but then I remembered I have a life and it's a Sunday and I should be outside on a patio instead of hovering over my computer inflicting my Raptor theories on the general public. I don't think I said anything too controversial with my assessment of how he ranks next to the other point guards and I am sure most people on this site don't need me to show stats to illustrate how Jameer Nelson and Jarrett Jack statistically are very similar in most of the key categories. Anyone with general knowledge of the two would be aware of that. But you're right.

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    EDIT: nvm drunk

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    Raptors Republic Rookie Fon Riego's Avatar
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    Quote thomas1 wrote: View Post
    As of now I think he is. Just watched the US vs Spain game and Calderon not only sucked (as usual) but he also got injured I dont know how serious it is but he left and never returned (left in 3rd).
    WORST Jose I've seen in a while...


    About Jack, I agree he's a capable PG but most of the times has a lack of leadership. Anyway, I want to see him this season with this crappy team before make an statement.

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    I like jj and I like the effort he has put in this off season as well. Like was said we shall see when the season comes.

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    People have the misconception that Jack actually plays good defense. He's not that much better than Jose. Both of them get beat easily, and don't fight through screens. That, and he's not a really good ball distributor and playmaker. His assist-to-turnover ratio is poor.

    Now this isn't a knock on JJ, as he has his good points as well. But when you ask why must we need a better point guard, the simple answer is that what we have currently isn't good enough. What we have is a really good back up PG who can play extended minutes when needed.

  20. #20
    Raptors Republic Starter charlz's Avatar
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    Quote JoePanini wrote: View Post
    You gave him an A for defence? Then where do you put Rondo and Billups?
    Jack is a very good on the ball PG defender - maybe just compared to Jose's clap-defense he seemed great but I think his ability is good even great at times. Good lateral quicks and anticipation.

    The number one thing for an NBA PG is cut off the ball and contain opposing PG's Jose can do it 15% of the time JJ can do it 80%+ of the time. There are a few PG's that no one can contain (ie. Aaron Brookes).
    "I may be wrong ... but I doubt it"

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