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Thread: Calderon To Bobcats Rumors Heat Up Again? - Will Jose Calderon be a Bobcat Monday?

  1. #41
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote JoePanini wrote: View Post
    Been there, done that. No way I'm taking Ford back. No way.
    I would tend to agree. However, when you consider he is an $8.5M expiring contract he adds some trade value come February and if worse comes to worse and he gets on with his B.S. about playing time, then they can just buy him out as he will not be the key to the Raptors success. The thing to remember, and I wonder if Ford does, is this could be his last contract in the NBA given the difficulty the Pacers are having trading him. And while he is not a top tier PG, he isn't dogsh*t either. With him, his problem is playing within a team and attitude. He may have something to prove.

    The benefits of the trade far outweigh the downside, in my opinion.

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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    I would tend to agree. However, when you consider he is an $8.5M expiring contract he adds some trade value come February and if worse comes to worse and he gets on with his B.S. about playing time, then they can just buy him out as he will not be the key to the Raptors success. The thing to remember, and I wonder if Ford does, is this could be his last contract in the NBA given the difficulty the Pacers are having trading him. And while he is not a top tier PG, he isn't dogsh*t either. With him, his problem is playing within a team and attitude. He may have something to prove.

    The benefits of the trade far outweigh the downside, in my opinion.
    His attitude. He just ruins a team. Kinda like Monta Ellis, but can't score or do anything much actually. He's "ok" but he would just destroy us. 8M expiring or not, I just don't feel comfortable with him joining us again. His first stint wasn't so pleasant But anyways I don't see this trade working... Oh, and he already said he wouldn't accept a buy-out, Indiana already tried, and his trade value is as high as Rodney Carney's. Maybe worse.

  3. #43
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    Quote JoePanini wrote: View Post
    His attitude. He just ruins a team. Kinda like Monta Ellis, but can't score or do anything much actually. He's "ok" but he would just destroy us. 8M expiring or not, I just don't feel comfortable with him joining us again. His first stint wasn't so pleasant But anyways I don't see this trade working... Oh, and he already said he wouldn't accept a buy-out, Indiana already tried, and his trade value is as high as Rodney Carney's. Maybe worse.
    All very true points you raise. But I still think the pro's outweigh the cons. The only way the cancer ruins the team is if others buy in to it or listen to it. With the young guys the Raptors have, I'm not too sure they'll give TJ too much time of day.

    He did say he would not accept the buyout, but my understanding was the buyout was for only $5M so he was leaving $3.5M on the table - I wouldn't accept that either especially knowing I would not be able to sign somewhere else for at least $3.5.

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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    All very true points you raise. But I still think the pro's outweigh the cons. The only way the cancer ruins the team is if others buy in to it or listen to it. With the young guys the Raptors have, I'm not too sure they'll give TJ too much time of day.

    He did say he would not accept the buyout, but my understanding was the buyout was for only $5M so he was leaving $3.5M on the table - I wouldn't accept that either especially knowing I would not be able to sign somewhere else for at least $3.5.
    You know what would work... if we do the trade. Then just waive him, yes we'll be paying his full 8.5 million, but it will only be for this year, and we won't have to deal with him! Then we can waive Dampier, and for next year we'd have almost 20M off the books!

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    Quote JoePanini wrote: View Post
    You know what would work... if we do the trade. Then just waive him, yes we'll be paying his full 8.5 million, but it will only be for this year, and we won't have to deal with him! Then we can waive Dampier, and for next year we'd have almost 20M off the books!
    Exactly - I never thought of the waiver but the end result is the same - especially for next year. I had my head stuck on buyout. Either way, if the guy does not tow the party line, he is gone.

    Even with the argument of we'd be thin at PG, we'd still have Jack, Augustine, Barbosa could play limited minutes, and they could sign a third string for a minimum contract for this year only (Bobby Brown?).

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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Exactly - I never thought of the waiver but the end result is the same - especially for next year. I had my head stuck on buyout. Either way, if the guy does not tow the party line, he is gone.

    Even with the argument of we'd be thin at PG, we'd still have Jack, Augustine, Barbosa could play limited minutes, and they could sign a third string for a minimum contract for this year only (Bobby Brown?).
    Well either way, I don't think the trade will happen. But them giving up Ford makes the trade ALOT more attractive on their side, they might actually like the trade... They get rid of Ford (finally, and it would make Bird like the awesomest GM ever, gets Collison for nothing, and gets Calderon and an expiring for Ford) and they get a pretty decent player in Diaw (who was pretty good for Charlotte, but they might not want to give him up as they want to be a playoff team) and Charlotte get the PG they want, btw, do you know how long Jose's injury is for?

  7. #47
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    Quote JoePanini wrote: View Post
    Well either way, I don't think the trade will happen. But them giving up Ford makes the trade ALOT more attractive on their side, they might actually like the trade... They get rid of Ford (finally, and it would make Bird like the awesomest GM ever, gets Collison for nothing, and gets Calderon and an expiring for Ford) and they get a pretty decent player in Diaw (who was pretty good for Charlotte, but they might not want to give him up as they want to be a playoff team) and Charlotte get the PG they want, btw, do you know how long Jose's injury is for?
    The last I read, Calderon was going to be ready for training camp. I think the seriousness of the injury was overstated initially.

    No, this trade most likely will not happen but I don't think anyone can argue it does not make sense for all teams involved.

    For the Raptors with nearly $30M in cap space, a possible high draft pick, and another first rounder they could really be back in the second tier of the East (below Boston, Orlando, Miami) very quick. Imagine the current roster with Jeff Green at the SF, Marc Gasol at the C, and a top rated draft PG - the players were just off the top of my head but similar players with similar abilities/impact and the draft pick could be interchanged with either the PG, SF, or C position and free agency used for the other positions.

    And depending on when deals are done, the Raps would still have the $14.5M TPE but not the full amount of cap space.

    Oh yes, and don't forget the new CBA and possible lockout.

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    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Wasn't there a rumors earlier in the summer about Ford being traded here in a package for Calderon? This, prior to Collison going there. Just saying...

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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    Wasn't there a rumors earlier in the summer about Ford being traded here in a package for Calderon? This, prior to Collison going there. Just saying...
    Yes. The rumour was Charlotte was trying to get in on that trade with Calderon going to CHA, Ford to TOR, and Dampier to IND. I do not know how that would have worked out with the other teams involved or which team would not have been a part of the trade (Houston, Indiana, New Orleans, New Jersey).

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    I think that most likely due to his FIBA injury Caldy starts the season it TO- as who wants to trade for a potentially injured player before the regular season has even begun?

    Charlotte can just release Dampier as well and delete his salary off of their books w/o receiving any salary in return if he's traded for a player(s). I think that's what they might do if they don't get a mind blowin' offer ie Carmello, starting pg or some future #1's.

    @ Matt 52
    One thing that I have learned since following Jose in the NBA is that with Jose aka The Spanish X Ray the seriousness of any injury can never be overstated.
    Last edited by SirChillyMost; Sat Sep 11th, 2010 at 09:13 PM.

  11. #51
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    This is a pretty complicated trade (13 players and 3 teams) but it does solve everyone's problems, and no one goes in to the luxury tax - or in Charlotte's case, comes out of it.

    IND: Evans, Diaw, Henderson, Banks, Diop
    CHA: Calderon, Dunleavy, Rush, Dorsey, S. Jones, $2.1M TPE
    TOR: Dampier, Augustine, Ford

    Indiana gets front court depth and rid of two headaches (Ford and Rush).
    Charlotte gets depth at PG, SG, SF, a cheaper centre, and Dorsey can stay or go as his contract is non-guarateed, and a payroll of about $69M.
    Toronto gets a lot of flexibility.

    @SirChilly
    For sure on Calderon and the simply waiving. The thing about simply waiving Dampier though is it leaves them thin at PG, SG, and SF - and they will still be over the soft cap with only $2.2M in MLE left to sign players. After making the playoffs for the first time in franchise history, I"m sure they do not want to go back to the lottery so soon.

    I am going to stop obsessing over this and wait for Monday with as much anticipation as Christmas - only to be disappointed I'm sure!

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    Quote Pele wrote: View Post
    I was thinking of Kobe's 81pt effort against the Raps in 2006. I believe that they will not do well until they rid themselves of anyone who was playing that day. That means that both Bargs and Jose have to go. So be it.
    Bargnani wasn't a member of the Raptors. I'm sure that game took place in January 2006. Bargnani was selected in June 2006.

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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    This is a pretty complicated trade (13 players and 3 teams) but it does solve everyone's problems, and no one goes in to the luxury tax - or in Charlotte's case, comes out of it.

    IND: Evans, Diaw, Henderson, Banks, Diop
    CHA: Calderon, Dunleavy, Rush, Dorsey, S. Jones, $2.1M TPE
    TOR: Dampier, Augustine, Ford

    Indiana gets front court depth and rid of two headaches (Ford and Rush).
    Charlotte gets depth at PG, SG, SF, a cheaper centre, and Dorsey can stay or go as his contract is non-guarateed, and a payroll of about $69M.
    Toronto gets a lot of flexibility.

    @SirChilly
    For sure on Calderon and the simply waiving. The thing about simply waiving Dampier though is it leaves them thin at PG, SG, and SF - and they will still be over the soft cap with only $2.2M in MLE left to sign players. After making the playoffs for the first time in franchise history, I"m sure they do not want to go back to the lottery so soon.

    I am going to stop obsessing over this and wait for Monday with as much anticipation as Christmas - only to be disappointed I'm sure!
    Indiana gets the short end of that stick. I can't see them going through with it.

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    Super Moderator MangoKid's Avatar
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    If the rumour is true and it's Calderon + Evans for Dampier, I take that in a second. Dampier isn't going to help much on the court, but him saving this franchise a ton of money is the greater impact.

    And no, Augustine isn't coming to Toronto.

  15. #55
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Default More Information On Dampier's Situation

    Dubbed the "Dust Chip'' because a team can trade for Dampier, then waive him and his contract will disappear like a cloud of dust, it's considered gold for teams like the Bobcats seeking salary-cap relief. The 35-year-old veteran has become a get-out-of-jail-free card, a way to achieve financial flexibility and avoid the choke-hold the luxury tax presents.
    It's all because he failed to achieve the playing-time clause in his seven-year, $73 million deal last season, making the last year non-guaranteed.
    Higgins' cell phone is busy these days. Starting Monday, 60 days after the Bobcats acquired Dampier from Dallas, the Bobcats can package his contract in another multiplayer deal.
    While saying there's no "drop dead date'' to get a deal done, they may end up simply waiving him.

    "The conversations have been had around the league,'' Higgins said. "I don't know if there's going to be anything that subsequently gets done.''
    Source: SI.com

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    Quote MangoKid wrote: View Post
    Bargnani wasn't a member of the Raptors. I'm sure that game took place in January 2006. Bargnani was selected in June 2006.
    +1

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    Dampier Deal Likely Beginning Monday
    Sep 12, 2010 5:31 PM EST

    Trade talks involving Bobcats center Erick Dampier are expected to increase beginning Monday.

    Dampier has a unique, voidable $13 million expiring contract.

    A team can trade for Dampier and then waive him without having to absorb any of his salary.

    "It is quite interesting, being with Erick on the front end and the back end of this deal," Charlotte general manger Rod Higgins said. "I've also changed teams to get that done.
    http://basketball.realgm.com/src_wir...inning_monday/

    Bobcats Uninterested In Calderon

    Sep 11, 2010 10:26 AM EST

    Despite rumors that the Bobcats are interested in Raptors point guard Jose Calderon, Marc Stein of ESPN.com writes on his Twitter page that they have none.

    "Getting tweets asking if there's any substance to internet rumbles about a Calderon-to-CHA deal involving Dampier's contract. In a word? NO," Stein wrote on Friday night.

    Charlotte has the valuable contract of center Erick Dampier to use in trades starting on Sept. 13.

    "Dampier does becomes eligible Monday to be packaged w/other Bobcats in trades. But I've been firmly told CHA and TOR not discussing Calderon," Stein added.

    Via Marc Stein/ESPN.com (via Twitter)
    We shall see.

    I wouldn't bet against Calderon starting on opening night.



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    Quote MangoKid wrote: View Post

    And no, Augustine isn't coming to Toronto.
    Why not?

    If CHA wanted Calderon, then signed Livingston, Carroll, and (reportedly) attempted to trade for Calderon again - does it sound like CHA wants to keep Augustine?

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    Dampier was just waived by BobCats.

    Raptor fans can now stop all the trade talks involving Jose.

    There is no more Takers.

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    Quote Pele wrote: View Post
    I was thinking of Kobe's 81pt effort against the Raps in 2006. I believe that they will not do well until they rid themselves of anyone who was playing that day. That means that both Bargs and Jose have to go. So be it.
    Bargs wasn't on the team yet and you don't get rid of players just because Kobe scored 81 points in one particular game.

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