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Thread: International experience will help Triano shape Raptors

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    Default International experience will help Triano shape Raptors

    International experience will help Triano shape Raptors

    Posted Sep 20 2010 11:34AM

    Chris Bosh is gone. And so are the playoff expectations and the pressure of trying to keep the franchise player from skipping town.

    Hedo Turkoglu is gone too, leaving the Toronto Raptors without anyone who's ever been the focal point of an NBA offense.

    The roster he'll take into the 2010-11 season certainly provides Raptors coach Jay Triano with a challenge. But Triano also sees the absence of a star as an opportunity.

    "We don't have anybody we have to cater to offensively," Triano said. "We're going to be a very balanced team and we're going to have different guys that are going to have to step up. And because of that, there are more things that we can do offensively."

    The playbook is being re-written in Toronto
    , and Triano is borrowing a page or two from some of the national teams he saw over the past month at the FIBA World Championship. As an assistant coach for the U.S. team, Triano watched film and prepared reports on the Americans' opponents. And he often liked what he saw.

    "I like the international ball movement," Triano said. "I thought that the way that they move the basketball and the way that they make cuts, they have to do that sometimes to overcome the athleticism that some of the other teams have. So they're very precise with their offense."
    cont here

    Motion, movement and cuts.

    Geez Golden, I guess Triano is also talking rubbish


    Lets make you the new Raptors coach, my friend the, Mr. ISO man.
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    Super Moderator .40 Cal Flakes's Avatar
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    Hmph...JT said the something along those lines last summer too (the ball movement part)after his stint with Team USA and look how that turned out.

    He's had what 3 summers with team USA now? How much has it helped him, not sure.

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    Quote .40 Cal Flakes wrote: View Post
    Hmph...JT said the something along those lines last summer too (the ball movement part)after his stint with Team USA and look how that turned out.

    He's had what 3 summers with team USA now? How much has it helped him, not sure.
    Triano was stuck with Bosh and he didn't know anything about Weems, DeRozan or Johnson last summer and what they could do. He also didn't have Kleiza who I think is better than Turk is at playing in a motion offense.

    Also see my thread that compares Bosh to Johnson on the type of plays that they score on. Not so much on what Johnson himself brings but on what the Raptors unloaded on offense when Bosh left.

    Bosh was the go to guy so Triano had to design plays to fit him and to some extent Bargnani. Bosh does not excel at running motion offense. Boy is that an understatement.
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    Also coach English is somewhat familiar with high octane offenses.

    Here is an NBA game in which there was over 360 points scored total by both teams.

    English chipped in with a 47 points.

    http://www.nba.com/pistons/news/high...re_071211.html
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    Quote .40 Cal Flakes wrote: View Post
    Hmph...JT said the something along those lines last summer too (the ball movement part)after his stint with Team USA and look how that turned out.

    He's had what 3 summers with team USA now? How much has it helped him, not sure.
    Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. Last year Jay talked about "Protecting the House" on defense as being the #1 priority for the Raps going into the season. We all know how that turned out.

    However, I do have respect for Jay Triano as an offensive coach, so maybe he can make it work and get lemonade from lemons.

    The most successful coach at implementing the pick/screen & roll playbook in the NBA is Jerry Sloan, who consistently makes his players look better than they are on offense. The last year they had Karl Malone (2002-03), they were 9th in team ORtg. The year after they plummeted to 19th, bottoming out at 22nd for a couple of years. They didn't recover until Deron Williams came into his own and Boozer was healthy. .

    Same system, same coach, different players. So, I suppose having great players trumps a great system in the NBA

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    I believe that the OP already threaded up this subject: http://raptorsrepublic.com/forums/sh...rned-in-Europe

    Anyways Triano needs to worry more about defense than implementing some crappy FIBA sets into the Rap's playbook but then again he's under no pressure being a MLSE company guy (he has a job within the Raptor organization for life) and is going down the same path of last season's Raptor defensive redundancies. Defense rhetoric under Jay aka MistaDoblina is nothing more than training camp hype- fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.

    The only really totally defensive minded players on the Rap's roster are Banks & Evans and both figure to be fringe rotation players (barring injuries) this season- if not eventually traded away. Looks like it may be another long season of watching TO give up easy baskets in the paint & open 3's- especially with Kleiza (projected starting SF) guarding the opposing wing players plus add in Bargnani as the last line of defense.... offense is the last thing that should be on MistaDoblina's mind!

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    My hopes are high that Triano lets P.J. run the defense, he should be a huge improvement over Iavaroni.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star grindhouse's Avatar
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    I am glad to see that triano is not one of those coaches stuck in one way of doing things and has the ability to continue to adept and grow. if he can find a good core group of plays and develops a system that BC can go out and find the right players to plug into that system toronto will be better as a organization going into the future. Utah, lakers, san Antonio have consistent success because they have A SYSTEM that every player walking into that organization knows they must learn.

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    Quote grindhouse wrote: View Post
    I am glad to see that triano is not one of those coaches stuck in one way of doing things and has the ability to continue to adept and grow. if he can find a good core group of plays and develops a system that BC can go out and find the right players to plug into that system toronto will be better as a organization going into the future. Utah, lakers, san Antonio have consistent success because they have A SYSTEM that every player walking into that organization knows they must learn.
    Jay aka MistaDoblina is stuck is his way of doing things ie offensive minded-no player accountability.

    How much time do you want to give him to develope a system? This will be his 3rd year as head coach in TO, preseason projected Lottery bound by experts, with another large offseason roster turnover to deal with. At least with Sam in charge you got NBA playoffs.....

    The Raptor's future should be sans Triano, Gherardini & BC. This Italian hiring nepotism shown by BC in Raptor basketball operations has lead to a full blown hybrid International/American Raptor roster experiment (ideology) where you have all the US players currrently in the TDot sans Banks while not one International player is currently in the TDot. I want a real NBA team not an experimental FIBA hybrid team in the TDot.....

    BC's, Gherardini, Jay's basketball system is str8 up bull chit rhetoric from top to bottom.....PR spins in the wind.....
    Last edited by SirChillyMost; Tue Sep 21st, 2010 at 12:18 PM.

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    Quote SirChillyMost wrote: View Post
    Jay aka MistaDoblina is stuck is his way of doing things ie offensive minded-no player accountability.

    How much time do you want to give him to develope a system? This will be his 3rd year as head coach in TO, preseason projected Lottery bound by experts, with another large offseason roster turnover to deal with. At least with Sam in charge you got NBA playoffs.....

    The Raptor's future should be sans Triano, Gherardini & BC. This Italian hiring nepotism shown by BC in Raptor basketball operations has lead to a full blown hybrid International/American Raptor roster experiment (ideology) where you have all the US players currrently in the TDot sans Banks while not one International player is currently in the TDot. I want a real NBA team not an experimental FIBA hybrid team in the TDot.....

    BC's, Gherardini, Jay's basketball system is str8 up bull chit rhetoric from top to bottom.....PR spins in the wind.....

    Once again you fail to understand the reason why the Euro players are coming into T.O a little later than the U.S players. While the U.S players were playing in sporadic pick up games or shoot arounds, the Euro's were playing in high level competitive international games (with the exception of Jose due to his injury) that finished up recently.
    THE only bullshit rhetoric comes from your nonsensical and juvenile posts that waste far too much space on this forum.

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    Triano's from St. Catherines...and Colangelo grew up in Phoenix... sounds like you got teased by some Italians in middle school and you're taking it out on the wrong people.

    As for rhetoric, what are they going to say heading into preseason? "Yeah we didn't make the playoffs last year and lost our best player, but we're just going to run the same stuff."

    We'd BETTER hear that Triano's got a new plan. The thing with motion offences in Europe is that they allow moving screens way more over there...so we'll see if the raps can get their feet planted or if we're going to have a lot of offensive fouls as guys try to get their teammates open.

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    Quote RaptorRoo wrote: View Post
    Once again you fail to understand the reason why the Euro players are coming into T.O a little later than the U.S players. While the U.S players were playing in sporadic pick up games or shoot arounds, the Euro's were playing in high level competitive international games (with the exception of Jose due to his injury) that finished up recently.
    THE only bullshit rhetoric comes from your nonsensical and juvenile posts that waste far too much space on this forum.
    I totally overstand why the International players are arriving later than most of the American players. Their basketball loyalties are with their Country 1st, Toronto 2nd (if that). I see that Kevin Durant and the rest of the USA players are in their respective NBA cities for the most part and have been since FIBA ended organizing their teams for pre training camp team facility runs.

    Also, I completely overstand how easy it is to make plans to come to Toronto after FIBA is finished beforehand and rest, relax, practice in the TDot before training camp begins with your teammates.

    While Jose is currently MIA from TO a week before training camp opens- where's Jose & his hamstring at???

    Kleiza is making bragadocious European Trio (Barg's, Jose, Kleiza) will survive without Bosh comments from abroad.

    Then you have Bargnani who was just at some European local for a GQ magazine fashion spread with some flat booty model.

    All the while you have the YG'z holding down the Rap's in the TDot on a very grass roots level.

    BC, Bull Chit is his middle name- recognize his 4 years of Raptor President/GM game, or not.

    I think that you need to stop drinking that BC flavored kool aid & jump off of the BC bandwagon:

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    Quote aintno4s wrote: View Post
    Triano's from St. Catherines...and Colangelo grew up in Phoenix... sounds like you got teased by some Italians in middle school and you're taking it out on the wrong people.

    As for rhetoric, what are they going to say heading into preseason? "Yeah we didn't make the playoffs last year and lost our best player, but we're just going to run the same stuff."

    We'd BETTER hear that Triano's got a new plan. The thing with motion offences in Europe is that they allow moving screens way more over there...so we'll see if the raps can get their feet planted or if we're going to have a lot of offensive fouls as guys try to get their teammates open.
    It's the visible nepotism- nothing more, nothing less.

    The offense wasn't the problem last season it was the defense. If the Rap's were just a middle of the pack defensive team they would have most likely made the playoffs- even under Jay's ineptness, last season. Easy offense created by aggressive stifling annoying defense! Throw all the rhetoric out the window and PLAY D!

    This is the NBA not FIBA as the FIBA regulation basketball court is smaller than the NBA court, the game ball is lighter, goaltending is allowed & the 3pt line is a shorter distance in FIBA than in the NBA. Also, more physicality is allowed in the FIBA game plus a few more regulation differences between the two basketball organizations that combine to make a difference in the actual play of the on court games.

    Triano's plan via his svengali- BC aka Bull Chit, is to Europeanize (FIBA up) Toronto Raptor basketball ideology and related practices via a front office consensus- every who agrees raise your hand. (Tony Soprano voice)

    Think DEFENSE, Jay, DEFENSE!!!!!

    The Raptor's defensive motto in 2010-11 should be: shut 'em down!!!


    As a matter of fact the Raptor's need to take a Public Enemy approach to this season and Yo Bum Rush the Show (NBA)!!
    Last edited by SirChillyMost; Wed Sep 22nd, 2010 at 01:27 AM.

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