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Thread: ESPN Insider: Hollinger's Raptors Outlook (Revisited 2010/11 Season)

  1. #21
    Raptors Republic Starter Raptorsss's Avatar
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    So, Golden, if the Raptors defense improves you'll still think that PJ was a bad hire? I'll take a 12th place to 7th every single day.

  2. #22
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    Quote Raptorsss wrote: View Post
    So, Golden, if the Raptors defense improves you'll still think that PJ was a bad hire? I'll take a 12th place to 7th every single day.
    I don't think PJ was a bad hire. Just because I'm not fawning over PJ and calling him the key to the off-season, it doesn't mean he isn't an improvement over Iavaroni. He is an improvement, which makes it a good hire. However, remember that the Raps were 30th overall in team Drat, so there really is no place to go but up. Getting rid of Jerkoglu will improve the D. If Amir gets more minutes, that will improve the D. A year of experience under DD's belt will improve the D. If Jack starts over Jose, that will improve the D. If Ed Davis gets significant minutes, that should improve the D.

    The point is, we should EXPECT improvement in Raps defense this year, regardless of PJ, and even if Iavaroni stayed on. If PJ's a huge part of that improvement, then heck yes, full kudos and props to him. If PJ can help Jay stick to his guns when Jay has to discipline guys who can't or won't do what their supposed to do, then he's worth full value and more.

  3. #23
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    I keep telling this to people but despite the lack of action on the trade and TPE front, the biggest, most important, and least discussed move this off-season was bringing on P.J. Carlesimo.
    PJ Carlesimo aka Yosemeti Sam
    is a very foul mouthed egomaniac and the last that I checked on him OKC took off as soon as he left........PJ is a coaching cancer in my mind....

    Plus, what's he going to do? Yell, curse at the players where as Jay couldn't or wouldn't? The player's will tune out PJ's rhetoric in a very quick minute, truss.... So many other coaches out there that could have been much better additions to TO's staff ie Paul Silas, in my mind.

  4. #24
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote golden wrote: View Post
    Held his own? LMAO. We're supposed to get excited about taking a team from 12th to 7th defensively? Heck, even KO took the Raps from 26th to 7th (with VC on the roster) and he got fired. Sorry, but I still can't get all worked up over PJ's resume to the level of calling it the "most important off-season move" like you do. If that's the best you can muster then we'll be going in circles for quite a while. I acknowledge that PJ does have some 'sandpaper' in him, which might be the best attribute to help the team. That's about as much due as he'll get from me, for now. His NBA resume is a whole lotta 'meh' and less.
    The "most important off-season move" made in a summer where adding Kleiza and Barbosa was basically it - unless you want to count the draft pick of Davis. Maybe the statement is a little strong but I still think it is an under-discussed and under-appreciated move.

    You said he ruined a .700 team before he got there - wrong.

    He took over a team that won 47 games then took that team that lost its franchise player in Drexler and had a supporting cast of aging players in 1995 to 44 wins, 44 wins in 96, and 49 wins in 97 finishing the same as the previous season in 4th, 4th, and 3rd. Kind of similar - minus the aging players - as the current Raptors and the competitive team.

    Not only did he take the team from 12th to 7th but when he left they were 5th in the league. The Raps finished dead last, think about it.

    While you say his coaching career is a whole lotta 'meh' or less, it is better than ANYONE else on the current Raptors bench. If you want to start trashing coaching careers, lets look at the Raps.

    Your 'meh' or less implies that:

    Winningest coach in Seton Hall history
    NCAA final apperance
    numerous NCAA tournament appearance
    1992 gold medal winning asst. coach for the orginal DREAM TEAM (because they'd let just anyone coach there)
    3 playoff appearances in first nba coaching gig
    assistant coach 2 NBA championship teams (if you knock the team, lets knock Phil Jackson too).

    Supposed negatives then:
    choked by a less than respectable NBA player but VERY talented
    Not a good go in GS - but seriously, GS?
    coached a team that was in ownership transition and relocation plans with little financial backing due to old vs. new ownership.
    coached a young, talented team that less than 2 years after are one of the most exciting teams in the league led by an MVP-calibre player in Durant with an all-star calibre point guard and Jeff Green.

    Awful man, just awful!

    Here is how things go down for the Raptors (and I'll most likely be wrong but whatever):

    Triano is fired
    PJ takes over for a year or two
    New coach is given the Scott Brooks opportunity with matured DeRozan, blossoming Davis, prime Andrea, and whatever major pieces they add through FA or future draft (Irving?)
    Last edited by mcHAPPY; Tue Sep 28th, 2010 at 08:40 PM.

  5. #25
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote golden wrote: View Post
    I don't think PJ was a bad hire. Just because I'm not fawning over PJ and calling him the key to the off-season, it doesn't mean he isn't an improvement over Iavaroni. He is an improvement, which makes it a good hire. However, remember that the Raps were 30th overall in team Drat, so there really is no place to go but up. Getting rid of Jerkoglu will improve the D. If Amir gets more minutes, that will improve the D. A year of experience under DD's belt will improve the D. If Jack starts over Jose, that will improve the D. If Ed Davis gets significant minutes, that should improve the D.

    The point is, we should EXPECT improvement in Raps defense this year, regardless of PJ, and even if Iavaroni stayed on. If PJ's a huge part of that improvement, then heck yes, full kudos and props to him. If PJ can help Jay stick to his guns when Jay has to discipline guys who can't or won't do what their supposed to do, then he's worth full value and more.
    How can a guy who destroyed the Blazers not be a bad hire?

    The IF's of what you say in your last paragraph is exactly what I expect PJ to bring to a Raptors team that dearly needs it. IF he does bring this, which I think he will, then that is why he will be the most-important off-season move by the Raps.

  6. #26
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote SirChillyMost wrote: View Post
    PJ Carlesimo aka Yosemeti Sam
    is a very foul mouthed egomaniac and the last that I checked on him OKC took off as soon as he left........PJ is a coaching cancer in my mind....

    Plus, what's he going to do? Yell, curse at the players where as Jay couldn't or wouldn't? The player's will tune out PJ's rhetoric in a very quick minute, truss.... So many other coaches out there that could have been much better additions to TO's staff ie Paul Silas, in my mind.
    Lots of opinions in there, little facts. Luckily I don't argue opinions, only facts.

    As for OKC taking off when PJ left, very questionable:

    1-12 PJ fired
    2-17 next 19 games
    20-30 final 50

    They still finished 23-59 with Durant/Green third year, Westbrook second year.

    I am not taking anything away from Scott Brooks but with the talent that team possessed, any coach coming in was given a golden opportunity.

    The breakout came only last year with matured, MVP-calibre player in Durant, potential All-Star PG in Westbrook, solid Jeff Green, and amazing cast of young athletic role players.

    I agree Paul Silas would be an awesome addition - to any coaching staff.
    Last edited by mcHAPPY; Tue Sep 28th, 2010 at 06:36 PM.

  7. #27
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Time to give Hollinger props guys. He called it dead on the nose.

  8. #28
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Not I.

    I was and am really let down by PJ's contribution. I was expecting improvement on the defensive end.

    Next up..... Dwayne gets a crack.

  9. #29
    Raptors Republic Superstar enlightenment's Avatar
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    hell of a prediction!

  10. #30
    Raptors Republic Starter charlz's Avatar
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    Quote tbihis wrote: View Post
    do you think the players or raptors coaching staff read articles about the team?

    i think they should, and share things like this with the organization to serve as extra motivation on the upcoming season.
    dont know about you guys but me personally, one of the worst feelings is knowing that people think you suck, so youd try to do everything in your power to change the mind of people.
    The reason the raps will do essentially what he said is not due to lack of motivation
    "I may be wrong ... but I doubt it"

  11. #31
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    I thought this was a new thread and thought it was odd reading, at first, until I realized this was Hollinger's prediction for this past season. It's funny to read all the people who thought he was so wrong. He was obviously closer than my 27 win prediction.
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  12. #32
    Raptors Republic All-Star ebrian's Avatar
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    I said 20-25, but on altraps.com forums I actually had 0.268 as the final winning percentage

  13. #33
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote Tim W. wrote: View Post
    I thought this was a new thread and thought it was odd reading, at first, until I realized this was Hollinger's prediction for this past season. It's funny to read all the people who thought he was so wrong. He was obviously closer than my 27 win prediction.
    I thought high 20's. Ooops.

  14. #34
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    I thought high 20's. Ooops.
    Well, injuries did hurt the team, so it's not like either of us were far off. I was about the same off last year, too, and you could say it was from injuries. I think this coming year I'm going to just take 5 wins off my estimate to account for injuries.
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