View Poll Results: Who Ya Wit? (Bernie Mac voice)

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  • Calderon

    13 43.33%
  • Jack

    17 56.67%
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Thread: Jose or Jarrett: Who Would You Start At PG?

  1. #41
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    http://www.torontosun.com/sports/bas.../15740736.html
    Looks like Jay will most likely start Jose despite his preseason defensive rhetoric and the fact that Jack has out played Jose- another case of potentially playing contracts over talent...smh Banks has arguably outplayed both Jack & Jose this preseason....smh

    Sherm mention that the line up of Bargnani, Evans, Kleiza, DD & Jose will most likely be the unit that Jay starts the season with as well. It's looking more & more like Jay says one thing in the media for fans and then does whatever BC tells him to do (player rotations) regardless of his previous stated particulars.

    Jay preaches defense all preseason (once again) then potentially throws out Jose as the front line and Bargnani as the back line of Raptor defense to start the season...smh Jose & DD will be one of the weakest starting backcourts in the NBA I'd rather see a Jack & Barbosa/Weems starting backcourt with the roster as is.

  2. #42
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    Im glad they starting Jose Calderon...this teams D is going to get massacred out the gate,wil be scrutinized hard both the decisions and the coaching and thats all i want to see....in a losing season at least have the crap and fools gold shown for all to see...so it can be fixed...

  3. #43
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    PJ basically confirms it as well (Jose starting even though Jack has outplayed him smh) in the FAN 950 radio interview:
    http://www.fan590.com/ondemand/media...19_155931_9928

    2010-11 Raptor's starting unit:

    Bargnani
    Evans (*Davis will most likely start when healthy)
    Kleiza
    DeRozan
    Calderon

    I don't see this unit getting out and pressing like Team USA or being solid on defense- just sayin'....

  4. #44
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    Outside of BC wanting Calderon to play mins so he can deal him during the season i dont get it....not only is it not the correct move for the team to compete but it will create tension in the locker room...best believe when this team is getting bullied defnesively the fingers are going to be pointed at a certain PG and your going to hear off the record remarks made by Jack and others.......

  5. #45
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    Why cant this organization ever make the right decision...on or off the court...

    How can you NOT be negative when the coaching staff makes the same stupid mistakes that the FO makes....

    I said it in August you cant start Jose anymore here OVER Jack..not after you tried to run him outta town and got him express mailed back by Larry Brown/MJ....not after last season when fans finally starting booing him...and then AFTER Jack clearly was the better guy in pre season ? I really want to here triano explain it....if its some half assed reasoning it can only be cuz they still want to move him and need him to play bigger mins..outside of that its just a completely dumb decision.....

    You cannot win with Jose starting 30-35 mins a night CAN NOT...if he isnt going to give you 15-20 PPG you cant afford it based on all the liabilities he gives your team....fact this coaching staff and organization still doesnt understand this is frustrating.....this organization stay stuck on stupid.

  6. #46
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    Quote Trife76 wrote: View Post
    Outside of BC wanting Calderon to play mins so he can deal him during the season i dont get it....not only is it not the correct move for the team to compete but it will create tension in the locker room...best believe when this team is getting bullied defnesively the fingers are going to be pointed at a certain PG and your going to hear off the record remarks made by Jack and others.......
    I actually think starting Calderon over Jack is better. And I don't know if you've noticed, but Calderon's defense is much improved in the preseason, so much so that he's not really a liability on that end of the floor. He's not great, or even good, but he's adequate so far.
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  7. #47
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    Quote Tim W. wrote: View Post
    I actually think starting Calderon over Jack is better. And I don't know if you've noticed, but Calderon's defense is much improved in the preseason, so much so that he's not really a liability on that end of the floor. He's not great, or even good, but he's adequate so far.
    So i see BC has put you on the payroll now....

  8. #48
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    and there you have it folks Calderon has regressed so bad that people want to make the case for him that he should
    start cuz he defense is "adequate"

    Forget about the rest of his game but if he defense goes from league worst to adequate were good now ?

    *sends paiella with chlorine to 40 bay street C/O Mr Calderon*

  9. #49
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    Quote Trife76 wrote: View Post
    So i see BC has put you on the payroll now....
    I've been saying this for a year now.

    Quote Trife76 wrote: View Post
    and there you have it folks Calderon has regressed so bad that people want to make the case for him that he should
    start cuz he defense is "adequate"

    Forget about the rest of his game but if he defense goes from league worst to adequate were good now ?

    *sends paiella with chlorine to 40 bay street C/O Mr Calderon*
    Offensively, Calderon a very good PG. His defense is what has limited him. By playing adequate defense, rather than bad defense, it simply means he's that much more valuable to the team.
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  10. #50
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    Quote Tim W. wrote: View Post
    I've been saying this for a year now.



    Offensively, Calderon a very good PG. His defense is what has limited him. By playing adequate defense, rather than bad defense, it simply means he's that much more valuable to the team.
    10 and 6 is not very good
    neither is 12 and 8

    and i believe those number will be about 12 and 6-7 this year....its called average at best...

  11. #51
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    Quote Trife76 wrote: View Post
    10 and 6 is not very good
    neither is 12 and 8

    and i believe those number will be about 12 and 6-7 this year....its called average at best...
    Well, you can't simply take stats without looking at how many minutes the guy played. Per minute, Calderon was the 8th best passer in the NBA last season, and it was an off season for him. As it is, he was still 12th in the league in assists- only one of two players to be in the top 20 while playing less than 30 mpg (Darren Collison was the other)- , was among the top ten PGs in the league in field goal percentage, and was the 9th best PG in 3 point percentage. Plus, he's always among the league leaders in assist to turnover ratio. Calderon does have his weaknesses, but offensive output is certainly not one of them. He's not a big scorer, but he's a PG, so it doesn't really matter. I'd rather have my PG averaging 12-8 than 20-5.
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  12. #52
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    Quote Tim W. wrote: View Post
    Well, you can't simply take stats without looking at how many minutes the guy played. Per minute, Calderon was the 8th best passer in the NBA last season, and it was an off season for him. As it is, he was still 12th in the league in assists- only one of two players to be in the top 20 while playing less than 30 mpg (Darren Collison was the other)- , was among the top ten PGs in the league in field goal percentage, and was the 9th best PG in 3 point percentage. Plus, he's always among the league leaders in assist to turnover ratio. Calderon does have his weaknesses, but offensive output is certainly not one of them. He's not a big scorer, but he's a PG, so it doesn't really matter. I'd rather have my PG averaging 12-8 than 20-5.
    im not taking stats i have watching him for 5 seasons i just get bored of this argument since i been doing it so long...
    Imma lay it out here...i think assists is a way overrated stat in the NBA because you dont really need to make plays to get one...and i think its foolish to judge things on PER min scales because second tier dont play upper mins for a reason that they cannot maintain those numbers over a high PCT...its a foolish argument,its like saying Kris Humphries would average 20 and 10 as a starter cuz he does 9 and 6 in 19 mins...foolish argument...

    He could easily be top FG % or 3pt % because he doesnt take a high volume of shots like most elite PGs do his shot attempts are down compared to most starters,again its another context argument thats folly....same as turnover ratio....its backup PG stat reference....most starting PGs turn the ball over 3.5-4 times a game cuz they handle the ball the most against the other teams top line players..i think thats the most ridiculous compliment given to Calderon....he never turns it over cuz he never does anything with it.....hence he plays similar to a backup not taking chances...and never turning it over,hard to turn over the rock when you never drive into the paint to shoot or make plays....

    id rather have a 20/6 guy who D's up and creates shots for himself and his team inside and keeps defenders off balance and can create his own shot and can dominate games in stretches and even take some over in the 2nd half like most "very good" to elite PGs can do....

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