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Thread: Are The Raptors Poised To Fail In The 2011 Draft?

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    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Default Are The Raptors Poised To Fail In The 2011 Draft?

    Multiple NBA team executives told CBSSports.com this week they believe a significant number of college underclassmen will stay in school rather than risk losing a year of development (and pay) in a lockout. College coaches making the pitch to underclassman to stay in school will have more leverage than ever before. “They’ll have the hammer,” one exec said. “To lose a year of development at that stage of your career, that’s huge.” This could have a dramatic impact on a team like No. 4 Kansas, which in an ordinary year would have as many as three first-round picks: freshman Josh Selby (serving a nine-game NCAA suspension for accepting improper benefits); and juniors Marcus Morris and Tyshawn Taylor. Sophomore Thomas Robinson also impressed NBA execs scouting the Jimmy V Classic Tuesday night at Madison Square Garden.
    Source: CBS Sports

    I realize this is really early but let's cover it anyway. 2006, they win the lotto in a draft with no consensus number one. No only that, it was a total crap shoot of a draft. Some called it weak back then due increased uncertainty in the players... Moving along to this year, the Raptors stockpiled some picks and are probably going to be in the lotto. Only problem is now a lot of kids may stay an extra year leaving the class weak and a bigger crap shoot than usual. I could see this being an International player heavy draft because the kids outside the U.S. have nothing to lose by entering this year, in fact it might be the best strategic time to enter the draft for them. All that said do you think this sets up the Raptors for success for failure?

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    Raptors Republic Starter albertan_10's Avatar
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    There was an article on nba.com a while back about Mike Bibby. He was drafted in the 1998 lockout and he said he wouldn't have changed a thing. I believe he encouraged people to get into the draft anyway because your stock could end up going down, you could have a serious injury and never get drafted, etc. He said that if you are positive you will be a first round pick, then do it because it secures you playing for an NBA team.

    Their coaches will push it but I think it's good advice. You might not get paid while your in a lock out, but if you'rethe next big thing then you'll get sponsorships and be ok.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star DoNDaDDa's Avatar
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    Quote albertan_10 wrote: View Post
    There was an article on nba.com a while back about Mike Bibby. He was drafted in the 1998 lockout and he said he wouldn't have changed a thing. I believe he encouraged people to get into the draft anyway because your stock could end up going down, you could have a serious injury and never get drafted, etc. He said that if you are positive you will be a first round pick, then do it because it secures you playing for an NBA team.

    Their coaches will push it but I think it's good advice. You might not get paid while your in a lock out, but if you'rethe next big thing then you'll get sponsorships and be ok.
    very good points....

    knowing are luck well get the #1 pick & there wont be anyone to draft, ever since the raptors got screwed out of the first overall pick back in 95 ive not had alot of faith in the lottery.. our draft history has been terrible too so its going to be a real crapshoot..

    if there is a lockout id expect the only ones to declaire will be the scrubs who have over achieved or are 1 step away from a career ending injury...

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    Quote albertan_10 wrote: View Post
    you could have a serious injury and never get drafted, etc.
    Can the drafted rookies sign before the CBA expires? I'm not sure about that. What if they turn pro, then get hurt and never get to sign a contract? They can't even go back to school and play on scholarship at that point.

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    Raptors Republic Starter albertan_10's Avatar
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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    Can the drafted rookies sign before the CBA expires? I'm not sure about that. What if they turn pro, then get hurt and never get to sign a contract? They can't even go back to school and play on scholarship at that point.
    I believe that there are specific rules about the draft that requires a team to sign their first round picks. Getting drafted is basically a signing. THe first 5 get better contracts, the next 5 a little bit less and so on. I don't think the new CBA will change any of that. If they get drafted and hurt then they can be buds with Ed Davis.

    Let me know if I am wrong but I believe that's how it works.

    ps. the players demands are ridiculous. There needs to be some kind of cap, even if it's in the luxury tax. Teams like the lakers who pay 40 million in luxury tax is ridiculous. no wonder no one else can win

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    Raptors Republic Rookie KJ-B's Avatar
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    Default Breaking News

    http://www.sportingnews.com/ncaa-bas...r-dukes-irving

    Kyrie Irving out for the season--so the question is, will the raps get another Ed Davis special, or will Irving return for his sophmore year?

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    Quote KJ-B wrote: View Post
    http://www.sportingnews.com/ncaa-bas...r-dukes-irving

    Kyrie Irving out for the season--so the question is, will the raps get another Ed Davis special, or will Irving return for his sophmore year?
    I think the key word is 'could'. They have 3 games between now and conference play on January 2. They are also still not sure what is going on from what I've read or if they do know, they are not sure treatment or possible recovery times.

    Who would have thought a sprained toe could be so much trouble.

    *EDIT* Latest on Kyrie:

    http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=5903650
    Last edited by mcHAPPY; Thu Dec 9th, 2010 at 07:57 PM.

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    Quote albertan_10 wrote: View Post
    I believe that there are specific rules about the draft that requires a team to sign their first round picks. Getting drafted is basically a signing. THe first 5 get better contracts, the next 5 a little bit less and so on. I don't think the new CBA will change any of that. If they get drafted and hurt then they can be buds with Ed Davis.

    Let me know if I am wrong but I believe that's how it works.


    ps. the players demands are ridiculous. There needs to be some kind of cap, even if it's in the luxury tax. Teams like the lakers who pay 40 million in luxury tax is ridiculous. no wonder no one else can win
    Yeah but how does that play out when teams draft a guy and he plays in europe? They're not paying him to play there but they own his rights once he decides to play in the NBA.
    Eh follow my TWITTER!

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    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Quote albertan_10 wrote: View Post
    I believe that there are specific rules about the draft that requires a team to sign their first round picks. Getting drafted is basically a signing.
    Example time. Ok, so the CBA runs out roughly around the end of June... Imagine for a moment if you will that this had happened this past summer. Xavier Henry took all summer to be signed to his rookie deal. If there was no CBA in place he would currently have no contract what so ever because after the CBA expires negotiations cannot take place.

    Quote albertan_10 wrote: View Post
    THe first 5 get better contracts, the next 5 a little bit less and so on. I don't think the new CBA will change any of that. If they get drafted and hurt then they can be buds with Ed Davis.
    What you're suggesting falls under CBA rules. What if there is no CBA?

    Quote albertan_10 wrote: View Post
    ps. the players demands are ridiculous. There needs to be some kind of cap, even if it's in the luxury tax. Teams like the lakers who pay 40 million in luxury tax is ridiculous. no wonder no one else can win
    Player demands are ridiculous. My bet is on the owners crushing them if they players don't wise up.

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    It might affect the decisions of some sub-lottery players, but for the top end guys, they'd be taking a huge risk in staying another year: firstly, if this draft ends up being thin, the next draft is going to be much more competitive, and lottery-bound players who stay out this year might find themselves on the outside of the lottery (and much further down the rookie contract scale) a year later. Add to this that one of the bargaining chips that is on the table is the draft eligibility age. The players association would like to get it back to the way it was where players can enter directly out of high-school. If that happens, then that next draft becomes even more competitive and these guys drop down a few more notches. Add then there's the uncertainty of not knowing whether rookie contracts will be the same post-lockout. I'm pretty sure they're not likely to be higher.

    It also remains to be seen how a 2012 draft would be conducted following a lockout, if it wipes out the 2011-12 season. I believe the NHL went with a system where results over the last five years were combined (with the more recent years more heavily weighted) and then a 1-30 lottery was conducted based on those. If that's the case, the Raptors would likely be in line for another top 15 pick in that draft.

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    I have 1 question for clarification, then 1 comment:

    Question: When does the current CBA end? I thought it ended immediately after the last game of the finals, meaning if there's a lockout, the draft would not even happen under the current CBA. Can somebody confirm the truth about the deadline for the current CBA.

    Comment: Assuming the draft does go forward under the current CBA, I could actually see MORE young player declaring for the draft given the NBA's desire to increase the draft age from 19 to 20 or even 21. I read recently that the players' union is asking for the age to be lowered back to 18, but I'm guessing that's just a bargaining tactic to give them room to negotiate to maintain the current age level of 19. Regardless, I could see many more 19-20 year olds declaring than normal, given the uncertainty moving forward.

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    Quote CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
    I have 1 question for clarification, then 1 comment:

    Question: When does the current CBA end? I thought it ended immediately after the last game of the finals, meaning if there's a lockout, the draft would not even happen under the current CBA. Can somebody confirm the truth about the deadline for the current CBA.
    .
    I answered my own question... found this on ESPN twitter feeds (read from bottom up, stupid ESPN)

    @LarryCoon No, the draft goes on as scheduled. Remember, the draft is under the purview of the current CBA. @yj2323 24 minutes ago
    @yj2323: any chance the nba delays the draft this year b/c of the impending lockout?

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    Raptors Republic Starter albertan_10's Avatar
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    Quote KJ-B wrote: View Post
    http://www.sportingnews.com/ncaa-bas...r-dukes-irving

    Kyrie Irving out for the season--so the question is, will the raps get another Ed Davis special, or will Irving return for his sophmore year?
    Depends what his stock is like and whether he wants to go back to school for another year. I'd imagine he would still go high. It's not a like a knee injury where it will linger

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    Yeah it's amazing how many players live cheque to cheque. I know that the union has been telling players to save their money.

    I wonder if players can move to the D-league if there's a strike since Stern said it ain't goin anywhere next year.
    Eh follow my TWITTER!

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    Raptors Republic All-Star DoNDaDDa's Avatar
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    Quote Employee wrote: View Post
    Yeah it's amazing how many players live cheque to cheque. I know that the union has been telling players to save their money.

    I wonder if players can move to the D-league if there's a strike since Stern said it ain't goin anywhere next year.
    the cost of kush is crazy these days... no wonder some of these guys live cheque to cheque LOL in reality Id have a hard time believing that most players live cheque to cheque. if they do they need help(Mental) guys like beasley,west,cousins,evans are prob at money mart everyweek getting cash advances to pay for there habbits LOL
    Last edited by DoNDaDDa; Thu Dec 9th, 2010 at 09:31 PM.

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    Quote DoNDaDDa wrote: View Post
    the cost of kush is crazy these days... no wonder some of these guys live cheque to cheque LOL in reality Id have a hard time believing that most players live cheque to cheque. if they do they need help(Mental) guys like beasley,west,cousins,evans are prob at money mart everyweek getting cash advances to pay for there habbits LOL
    How is Chris Bosh gonna pay for his home if there's a lockout??!!

    Naw I wouldn't say most, but a hell of a lot of players would have a hard time going a year without a pay cheque.
    Eh follow my TWITTER!

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    Raptors Republic All-Star DoNDaDDa's Avatar
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    Quote Employee wrote: View Post
    How is Chris Bosh gonna pay for his home if there's a lockout??!!

    Naw I wouldn't say most, but a hell of a lot of players would have a hard time going a year without a pay cheque.
    id say if bosh is broke he should fire his accountant... same goes for anyone making 15mill per.... everyone keeps talking like these guys have never got paid before.... guys like KG have been getting 20+mill for the last number of years & your going to tell me that he couldnt take a year off & still have boat loads of money.... people need to stop thinking that because the NBAPA only has enough to pay 1 cheque during a lockout that these guys dont have money!!! alot of these guys are stinking rich...the rest are just rich!

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    Quote DoNDaDDa wrote: View Post
    id say if bosh is broke he should fire his accountant... same goes for anyone making 15mill per.... everyone keeps talking like these guys have never got paid before.... guys like KG have been getting 20+mill for the last number of years & your going to tell me that he couldnt take a year off & still have boat loads of money.... people need to stop thinking that because the NBAPA only has enough to pay 1 cheque during a lockout that these guys dont have money!!! alot of these guys are stinking rich...the rest are just rich!
    One would think, but a large percentage of these guys do not manage their money anywhere near where they could or should, and often are spending on their entourage etc. without even realizing what they are spending. Antoine Walker is bankrupt and playing inthe D League, Manute Bol died in debt (big shame and a lot to do with what he doled out in charities and support), Iverson is rumoured to be in trouble with money. DWade credits the business side he learned from Shaq, otherwise he would be in trouble, and a huge example is Eddie Curry. The man is making 8 figures, and is already unable to keep up with his 'payments'. Just wait until next year when he will be lucky (very) to get vet's minimum. There are many, many more examples in every league. Just because someone makes boatloads of money doesn't by any means indicate they have money. Hell even Trump went bankrupt, he just has the know-how to make it back. It's not the same when your bag comes from playing a sport - something that is short lived on the upper scale of the money spectrum.

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    Quote DoNDaDDa wrote: View Post
    id say if bosh is broke he should fire his accountant... same goes for anyone making 15mill per.... everyone keeps talking like these guys have never got paid before.... guys like KG have been getting 20+mill for the last number of years & your going to tell me that he couldnt take a year off & still have boat loads of money.... people need to stop thinking that because the NBAPA only has enough to pay 1 cheque during a lockout that these guys dont have money!!! alot of these guys are stinking rich...the rest are just rich!
    I was joking (sorta). It really is true though, most of these players come from a really poor background and saving money isn't their strongpoint. not everyone is making 17 mil a year. Eddy Curry gets advances on his cheque all the time (and he get like 14 mil a year). A lot of these players got their 15 man entourage and family (and extended family) they're looking after.

    A lot of owners can do a lockout cause they're losing money anyway so it ain't a big a deal.
    Eh follow my TWITTER!

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    Raptors Republic Starter albertan_10's Avatar
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    Quote Employee wrote: View Post
    How is Chris Bosh gonna pay for his home if there's a lockout??!!

    Naw I wouldn't say most, but a hell of a lot of players would have a hard time going a year without a pay cheque.
    He'll pay for it with his "Got Milk" ads!!! haha

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