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Thread: Raps "Second" youngest team.

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Default Raps "Second" youngest team.

    Matt and Jack were discussing during the game, how as the roster stands, the Raptors have the 8th youngest team in the league.
    However; if you take out Peja and Reggie, both of whom aren't playing, (and also both of whom are on Expiring deals) then the Raptors are the SECOND youngest team in the league.
    I've always thought we had to be up there, but this just proves it.
    Let's just hope it turns into something positive.
    And at this point, are we 'young' enough? Is it now time to just start developing the young talent we have and looking for solid vets to chip in?
    Or do get younger and younger? Which is what seems to be pitched around these parts.
    Last edited by Joey; Sun Jan 9th, 2011 at 03:51 PM.

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    Raptors Republic Starter pesterm1's Avatar
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    I tihnk we asses the young talent this year and next year possibly add the more add the final touches, good calln being the 2nd youngest team tough, Id rather be a raptor then a F'ckn cavalier! lol

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    Sad to be a Cavs...when their team was 1st in the conference than dead last...but at least they have many playoffs then us in the last 6-7 years >_<

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    Raptors Republic Rookie Jordan-Drexler's Avatar
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    Quote KakashiPrince wrote: View Post
    Sad to be a Cavs...when their team was 1st in the conference than dead last...but at least they have many playoffs then us in the last 6-7 years >_<
    They Say the past is History, the future is a Mystery but today is a gift, thats why its called the present.
    I bet Cleveland fans wish they could regift this present for something else
    What if... Blazers had drafted both Drexler, Jordan?

    From 1992 Beginner's Guide to the NBA Finals, The Oregonian's special section. Published 6/3/1992.

    Michael Jordan was the #3 pick in the 1984 draft, after Portland selected Sam Bowie second.

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Quote Jordan-Drexler wrote: View Post
    They Say the past is History, the future is a Mystery but today is a gift, thats why its called the present.
    I bet Cleveland fans wish they could regift this present for something else
    hahaha Very deep and philisophical look at a Cleveland team doomed to be the exact same as they were before he came along. Shit.

    But this post is not about how glad we are we don't live in Cleveland. Though that wouldn't be a bad one for someone to start.......

    I think on a scale of 1 to 10, in terms of outlook we have to be a 9 or 10. Not forgetting about the pieces we have, I say the Raptors Organization and Fanbase should be very excited for the future. Bryan Colangelo has done a commendable job getting pieces and setting us on the right course. He's taken some odd moves to get us here, but he has.
    Now what he does with those pieces is a new Chapter.
    But a 'Youth Movement' has to be deemed successful once you are in talks to be the youngest team in the league, and still not the worst team in terms of output on the court.

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    hahaha Very deep and philisophical look at a Cleveland team doomed to be the exact same as they were before he came along. Shit.

    But this post is not about how glad we are we don't live in Cleveland. Though that wouldn't be a bad one for someone to start.......

    I think on a scale of 1 to 10, in terms of outlook we have to be a 9 or 10. Not forgetting about the pieces we have, I say the Raptors Organization and Fanbase should be very excited for the future. Bryan Colangelo has done a commendable job getting pieces and setting us on the right course. He's taken some odd moves to get us here, but he has.
    Now what he does with those pieces is a new Chapter.
    But a 'Youth Movement' has to be deemed successful once you are in talks to be the youngest team in the league, and still not the worst team in terms of output on the court.
    In terms of outlook, I put us at 7 out of 10. There is a lot to look forward to but, IMO, what BC does between now and the trade deadline and at the draft is going to shape this team for seasons to come. The TPE, cap space, multiple 1st round picks one of which will be high, and expiring contracts are all great to have but he has to do something with it all. I'm waiting to see how it plays out but I am optimistic.

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    In terms of outlook, I put us at 7 out of 10. There is a lot to look forward to but, IMO, what BC does between now and the trade deadline and at the draft is going to shape this team for seasons to come. The TPE, cap space, multiple 1st round picks one of which will be high, and expiring contracts are all great to have but he has to do something with it all. I'm waiting to see how it plays out but I am optimistic.
    Which is fair. However I think Bryan Colangelo has shown an above average 'knack' for getting a deal done when he wants it. I think it'll turn out just fine.
    But yes, you are right. It could also... not. haha

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    Raptors Republic Rookie Jordan-Drexler's Avatar
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    But the question is should Colangalo, who has a history of going for home runs, swing for the fences or hit a line drive for the single and try to steal 2nd.
    What if... Blazers had drafted both Drexler, Jordan?

    From 1992 Beginner's Guide to the NBA Finals, The Oregonian's special section. Published 6/3/1992.

    Michael Jordan was the #3 pick in the 1984 draft, after Portland selected Sam Bowie second.

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote Jordan-Drexler wrote: View Post
    But the question is should Colangalo, who has a history of going for home runs, swing for the fences or hit a line drive for the single and try to steal 2nd.
    Swing for the fences. He's had a couple of homeruns snagged over the fence by the outfield. He is due. LOL

    I wanted to keep the analogy going. In all seriousness, it would depend on the deal. Personally, the single and steal sounds better. Young players on manageable contracts, draft picks, or a player (like Devin Harris) that is easily traded to net manageable contracts and draft picks.

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Quote Jordan-Drexler wrote: View Post
    But the question is should Colangalo, who has a history of going for home runs, swing for the fences or hit a line drive for the single and try to steal 2nd.
    Solid analogy, but I think some expansion on it would be nice. haha

    You are implying NOT going after an All-Star type player with our pieces, but maybe more looking for a ... Joel Pryzbilla and Nik Batum as our solution? Not a bad idea. I like your thinking.
    (I know JP is injured. But still. I like him.)
    Last edited by Joey; Sun Jan 9th, 2011 at 06:38 PM.

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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    hahaha Very deep and philisophical look at a Cleveland team doomed to be the exact same as they were before he came along. Shit.

    But this post is not about how glad we are we don't live in Cleveland. Though that wouldn't be a bad one for someone to start.......

    I think on a scale of 1 to 10, in terms of outlook we have to be a 9 or 10. Not forgetting about the pieces we have, I say the Raptors Organization and Fanbase should be very excited for the future. Bryan Colangelo has done a commendable job getting pieces and setting us on the right course. He's taken some odd moves to get us here, but he has.
    Now what he does with those pieces is a new Chapter.
    But a 'Youth Movement' has to be deemed successful once you are in talks to be the youngest team in the league, and still not the worst team in terms of output on the court.
    Nah. Sorry to bust your bubble(still drinking the BC Koolaid, Huh?), in terms of outlook, we are a 5 or 6 out of 10. We still need a franchise wing and franchise center. We do not have that now. In terms of outlook at the 9 or 10 rating you gave to the Raptors, the Clippers(franchise big man in Blake Griffin, good shot-blocking and defensive center in DeAndre Jordan and a franchise wing in Eric Gordon, consider the good teaching coach in Vinny Del Negro) or the Kings(franchise center in Demarcus Cousins and franchise wing or guard in Tyreke Evans and get a likely Top 5 pick in the 2011 draft for a franchise wing in Perry Jones or Terrence Jones) are simply better.

    However, we could notch a point up to 7 out of 10 if we draft well in getting a very good SF(Terrence Jones, Perry Jones in the Top 5; Jordan Hamilton, Tyler Honeycutt outside the Top 5) and get a good teaching coach.

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Quote smushmush wrote: View Post
    Nah. Sorry to bust your bubble(still drinking the BC Koolaid, Huh?), in terms of outlook, we are a 5 or 6 out of 10. We still need a franchise wing and franchise center. We do not have that now. In terms of outlook at the 9 or 10 rating you gave to the Raptors, the Clippers(franchise big man in Blake Griffin, good shot-blocking and defensive center in DeAndre Jordan and a franchise wing in Eric Gordon, consider the good teaching coach in Vinny Del Negro) or the Kings(franchise center in Demarcus Cousins and franchise wing or guard in Tyreke Evans and get a likely Top 5 pick in the 2011 draft for a franchise wing in Perry Jones or Terrence Jones) are simply better.

    However, we could notch a point up to 7 out of 10 if we draft well in getting a very good SF(Terrence Jones, Perry Jones in the Top 5; Jordan Hamilton, Tyler Honeycutt outside the Top 5) and get a good teaching coach.
    Ok, so you're not a fan of Demar and Andrea... clearly.
    I, and probably a few others, might disagree with you.
    If Demar were given the same amount of shots as Gordon/Evans were every night, it'd probably be a wash. Not to mention Evans has missed quite a few more games as Demar has ALREADY in their young careers.
    And I find it interesting that you classify Cousins as a 'Franchise Center' and but don't include Andrea in there... fascinating.
    Whatever. Suppose the 'grass is always greener'; for some.

    You're honestly trying to tell me you'd rather be a Kings fan right now? Amazing.
    I'd rather drink the 'BC Koolaid', than 'Hatorade.' :P

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    Raptors Republic Rookie Jordan-Drexler's Avatar
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    I see toronto like how Seattle was the year before Durant, or Chicago the year before Rose.
    What if... Blazers had drafted both Drexler, Jordan?

    From 1992 Beginner's Guide to the NBA Finals, The Oregonian's special section. Published 6/3/1992.

    Michael Jordan was the #3 pick in the 1984 draft, after Portland selected Sam Bowie second.

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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    Ok, so you're not a fan of Demar and Andrea... clearly.
    I, and probably a few others, might disagree with you.
    If Demar were given the same amount of shots as Gordon/Evans were every night, it'd probably be a wash. Not to mention Evans has missed quite a few more games as Demar has ALREADY in their young careers.
    And I find it interesting that you classify Cousins as a 'Franchise Center' and but don't include Andrea in there... fascinating.
    Whatever. Suppose the 'grass is always greener'; for some.

    You're honestly trying to tell me you'd rather be a Kings fan right now? Amazing.
    I'd rather drink the 'BC Koolaid', than 'Hatorade.' :P
    Andrea as a franchise center - that is laughable to all things basketball.lmao. I know you are an Andrea fan but he is at best a 6th man off the bench(if he is still here by the time, we are a playoff contender. We are still far, far away from a franchise center in my eyes as a realistic fan with no rose-colored glases or drinking BC`s koolaid(which by now is bitter, eww).

    Consequently, Cousins is a franchise center because he rebounds, blocks shots, and defends(he might be immature, but the mature version will be real scary, looking at the body of work, he has put in already).

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    Quote Jordan-Drexler wrote: View Post
    I see toronto like how Seattle was the year before Durant, or Chicago the year before Rose.
    but not with the superstar draft pick(we will likely be out of the Top 5) a la OKC or Chicago.lol.

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Quote smushmush wrote: View Post
    Andrea as a franchise center - that is laughable to all things basketball.lmao. I know you are an Andrea fan but he is at best a 6th man off the bench(if he is still here by the time, we are a playoff contender. We are still far, far away from a franchise center in my eyes as a realistic fan with no rose-colored glases or drinking BC`s koolaid(which by now is bitter, eww).

    Consequently, Cousins is a franchise center because he rebounds, blocks shots, and defends(he might be immature, but the mature version will be real scary, looking at the body of work, he has put in already).
    Ok, well like I said, we disagree.
    This post is not about whether or not Andrea is 'Franchise Center'. I think he has proven to be a VERY capable starter, whether or not it is truly a 'Center', that is fine. Move him to Power Forward.
    But for you to say he's 'at best a 6th man', is such an ignorant and silly thing to say, I wish I hadn't even justified it with a response.

    (But since you started it, :P haha, I don't think it reeeally matters whether or not Bargnani gives 6rbs and a block, or 10 rebounds and 2 blocks, if he is giving us 25+ pts a game. There is NO big man besides Dirk that can score like Bargnani. And like I've been saying, the game is still about outscoring your opponent. Bargnani offers a very unique and creative scoring ability that cannot be discounted, IF we can surround him with the right pieces.)

    Anyway, thats not what this post is about, so you can go hate on Bargs somewhere else. That's fine.

    If you are comparing the Raptors outlook to that of the Clippers and Kings, than that is just fine with me. And I'd be happy to have that discussion.

    I think the young talent that both teams have acquired is also quite commendable and can't be overlooked, however, beyond that, they have very little to work with. The Raptors on the other hand, have far more pieces with which to make the puzzle work. And that is where my optimism lies. Whether or not Colangelo does good by that optimism is yet to be seen.

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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    Ok, well like I said, we disagree.
    This post is not about whether or not Andrea is 'Franchise Center'. I think he has proven to be a VERY capable starter, whether or not it is truly a 'Center', that is fine. Move him to Power Forward.
    But for you to say he's 'at best a 6th man', is such an ignorant and silly thing to say, I wish I hadn't even justified it with a response.

    (But since you started it, :P haha, I don't think it reeeally matters whether or not Bargnani gives 6rbs and a block, or 10 rebounds and 2 blocks, if he is giving us 25+ pts a game. There is NO big man besides Dirk that can score like Bargnani. And like I've been saying, the game is still about outscoring your opponent. Bargnani offers a very unique and creative scoring ability that cannot be discounted, IF we can surround him with the right pieces.)

    Anyway, thats not what this post is about, so you can go hate on Bargs somewhere else. That's fine.

    If you are comparing the Raptors outlook to that of the Clippers and Kings, than that is just fine with me. And I'd be happy to have that discussion.

    I think the young talent that both teams have acquired is also quite commendable and can't be overlooked, however, beyond that, they have very little to work with. The Raptors on the other hand, have far more pieces with which to make the puzzle work. And that is where my optimism lies. Whether or not Colangelo does good by that optimism is yet to be seen.
    The scoring that Bargs gives back at the other end by not rebounding and displaying terrible help defense? Really? I am not gonna say much after such statement. It is obvious you choose offense over defense(the Phoenix Suns look like a good model for the Raptors to aspire to) but I would rather be a fan of defense with an average offense a la the Chicago Bulls or Celtics(who have gone to the finals twice unlike the Phoenix Suns model you seem to prefer that has won nada in the post-season).

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    Raptors Republic Rookie CB4's Avatar
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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    hahaha Very deep and philisophical look at a Cleveland team doomed to be the exact same as they were before he came along. Shit.

    But this post is not about how glad we are we don't live in Cleveland. Though that wouldn't be a bad one for someone to start.......

    I think on a scale of 1 to 10, in terms of outlook we have to be a 9 or 10. Not forgetting about the pieces we have, I say the Raptors Organization and Fanbase should be very excited for the future. Bryan Colangelo has done a commendable job getting pieces and setting us on the right course. He's taken some odd moves to get us here, but he has.
    Now what he does with those pieces is a new Chapter.
    But a 'Youth Movement' has to be deemed successful once you are in talks to be the youngest team in the league, and still not the worst team in terms of output on the court.
    A team that has an outlook of 9 or 10 would be teams like the Clippers and Thunder, or even Portland before all their injuries. I also think Colangelo has been far from "commendable" in terms of setting us up for future success. Examples include bad contracts, trading Roy Hibbert for Jermaine O'Neal, and not getting any talent back for Bosh.

    Quote smushmush wrote: View Post
    The scoring that Bargs gives back at the other end by not rebounding and displaying terrible help defense? Really? I am not gonna say much after such statement. It is obvious you choose offense over defense(the Phoenix Suns look like a good model for the Raptors to aspire to) but I would rather be a fan of defense with an average offense a la the Chicago Bulls or Celtics(who have gone to the finals twice unlike the Phoenix Suns model you seem to prefer that has won nada in the post-season).
    No doubt, I would much rather be a good defensive team. The Suns had a lot more weapons than we ever did. Part of the problem is our roster is filled with one-dimensional players. Our closest thing to a two-way player would probably be Jerryd Bayless and Amir Johnson.
    Last edited by CB4; Sun Jan 9th, 2011 at 10:42 PM.

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Quote CB4 wrote: View Post
    A team that has an outlook of 9 or 10 would be teams like the Clippers and Thunder, or even Portland before all their injuries. I also think Colangelo has been far from "commendable" in terms of setting us up for future success. Examples include bad contracts, trading Roy Hibbert for Jermaine O'Neal, and not getting any talent back for Bosh.
    Well I did point to his 'odd moves', but we are still in, arguably, a better position to acquire talent and upgrade our team than any other team in the league. And with Demar and Bargs both under 25 and showing some Serious swagger, thats is a SOLID foundation to build around.

    We've got the brick, and we've got the mortar, now its just whether or not he builds us a Gardenshed or the Louvre.

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    Raptors Republic Starter albertan_10's Avatar
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    I like where we sit. We're a young team that plays good offense. I've said it elsewhere but i'll say it again, Defense is underrated by most players when they're young. They want the glory and focus on developing their offensive moves because, as you know, points and dunks bring glory. Defense doesn't bring that. A block is the only thing cool on defense and those are harder to come by because NBA players are crafty. My point is that defense is one thing players don't focus on developing and i'm not surprised we're a bad defensive team because of how young we are. Give it a few years with this coaching staff and these players are i believe they will improve greatly. (and on the flip side the can't get worse

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