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Thread: Was The Botched Moves Over The Offseason, The Tale Of The Tape?

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    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Default Was The Botched Moves Over The Offseason, The Tale Of The Tape?

    Just A Consensus to me, looking back do you feel that the botched moves over the off season(Chandler, Diaw trade, and Barnes signing) were basically the tale of the tape for this season.

    and by that i mean, if this was a review of the history of the raptors this chapter would be titled

    "THE JOKE".






    note:feel free to vent all that your feeling about this team right now.

    also note: don't feed garbage about the good and such, crap like well, the future looks bright, i mean, derozan will be in the dunk contest for the second straight year, ed davis looks good down the road, or amir johnson has had three straight double-doubles.

    just straight honesty about what you're feeling about this team right now, with a win basically meaning it just halted temporarily the bottomless pit that the raptors are plummeting in. give you're feeling about the 13 in a row.

    just feel free to vent.
    If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    Just A Consensus to me, looking back do you feel that the botched moves over the off season(Chandler, Diaw trade, and Barnes signing) were basically the tale of the tape for this season.

    and by that i mean, if this was a review of the history of the raptors this chapter would be titled

    "THE JOKE".

    note:feel free to vent all that your feeling about this team right now.

    also note: don't feed garbage about the good and such, crap like well, the future looks bright, i mean, derozan will be in the dunk contest for the second straight year, ed davis looks good down the road, or amir johnson has had three straight double-doubles.

    just straight honesty about what you're feeling about this team right now, with a win basically meaning it just halted temporarily the bottomless pit that the raptors are plummeting in. give you're feeling about the 13 in a row.

    just feel free to vent.
    So you're looking for ONLY negative things? This will be a wonderful thread.

    And why "THE JOKE"? I'm curious as to your thinking behind that.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    well, i knew i was obviously going to get ripped on. but, i mean come on, the reason for the joke is our biggest star left dissed us up, our mangement looks dumb as hell with the boitched trade and not realising they couldn't sign barnes.

    we signed amir johnson to a 5 year, 35 million contract, now hes actually starting to shut up the critics with his stats, but, i mean i don't think that contract was necessary, as he wasn't in high demand.

    we had a point in whcih if it weren't for cleveland we'd have the longest losing streak this season and analyzers would basically been calling us a joke.

    i may be coming on douchey, but, i'm being honest and that's what i want you to do.

    they can be positive but, i'm expecting most of them to be negative as that's what most of the season has been.
    If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?

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    I think Chandler would have helped us in the rebounding area, but that's what we have Reggie for. I honestly don't think Barnes or Diaw would have helped us at all. Both are really just mediocre players. Remember this team is always going to be labeled a joke because of the fact that they play in Canada. All the losing doesn't help either ...a few years ago when we finished 4th we at least garnered some respect. I think if we still had Bosh we'd probably be in the playoffs or at least close. This franchise has never been spectacular and it might be a while before we can be a playoff team on a regular basis. Esentially we need a saviour to guide this franchise to success something that Carter and Bosh were only moderately able to do.

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    See thats what I don't understand. It wasn't that we couldn't sign him. Its that Orlando couldn't sign-and-trade him. It had nothing to do with us and everything to do with Orlando screwing up. So again I don't really understand how this makes us look all that bad.
    The Chandler was looking to be a GREAT deal for BC, until MJ decided he'd rather save money than be competitive. Thats all that was.
    Bosh was leaving no matter what. I don't think we've ever been referred to as a 'joke', though we get bashed in the media, its most based on ignorant assumptions. If the Raps were healthy all year we'd be up there with Charlotte for sure.
    So whatever, I guess I'm in the minority as seeing this season as not nessesarily a 'negative' season, but more a nessesary building block.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran Bendit's Avatar
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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    See thats what I don't understand. It wasn't that we couldn't sign him. Its that Orlando couldn't sign-and-trade him. It had nothing to do with us and everything to do with Orlando screwing up. So again I don't really understand how this makes us look all that bad.
    The Chandler was looking to be a GREAT deal for BC, until MJ decided he'd rather save money than be competitive. Thats all that was.
    Bosh was leaving no matter what. I don't think we've ever been referred to as a 'joke', though we get bashed in the media, its most based on ignorant assumptions. If the Raps were healthy all year we'd be up there with Charlotte for sure.
    So whatever, I guess I'm in the minority as seeing this season as not nessesarily a 'negative' season, but more a nessesary building block.
    Iam with you Mr. Hesketh. While I was upset about the Bobcat transaction not going thru at the time Davis and AJ would be fighting for minutes with Diaw. We would have won more games but enough to make any splash...I think not. I believe we are in a better place now because of the xtra pt for the young guys. Chandler was in his last year and could have scooted and we'd be on the treadmill...again. I am looking forward to the draft now rather than be at a plus 15 pick otherwise...and c'mon next season!

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    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    If Barnes and Chandler are here right now then they might be in the same place. They would have had no depth at the PG spot.

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Fully agree. But for me its not really how many wins they would have brought this year.
    Having guys like Chandler and Barnes is crucial to young players seeing the right way to do things.
    Both are extremely dedicated to their craft and both think defense before offense. Having these kinds of personalities around guys like Demar and Sonny and almost especially Andrea, would be priceless. Win or Lose.

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    as others have said, Charlotte and Orlando need to be looked at for the Chandler and Barnes deals that didn't work out (and while Chandler being here would be nice, losing Jose would have been costly... )

    People complained about Amir's contract at the time... but others said it was a good deal. He is really proving to be worth every dollar. He is likely the best 'value' on the team right now. Hard to put that one up as a botched move. In fact I think its the exact opposite.

    Bosh was leaving... that was a given. The minute he didn't sign an extension he should have been dealt, that was more or less a 2 year long mistake. But then again, you are never getting value in return when you try to trade a 25 year old perennial all-star.

    Wright for Belli is, I personally think, turning into a real deal for the Raps.

    The biggest botch is Andrea. Deal with that nonsense.... then you are moving in the right direction.

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    Hmm... You want honest venting? I've got two complaints.

    (1) What is up with these injuries? It seems like the entire team is either unable to play, or playing hurt. Thank goodness for the All-Star break giving the Raps time to heal and put themselves back together a little bit.

    (2) What is up with all the fair-weather fans? I didn't grow up in Toronto, but was shocked to see how quickly people here start to complain and bitch when things don't go well on the court. The Raps are a bad team right now, but I've still seen them play with pride on the court. Instead of dwelling on losses from the recent past, either focus on what's positive at the moment or look at the potential for a bright future - take what is good, support your team, and appreciate the fact that we've got a team fighting out there night after night.

    Honestly, our Raps team is fun to watch and should only get better over the next couple of years - even if they don't win anything notable. Part of being a fan should be about love for the game. If you get so discouraged by losses during an injury-plagued season that everyone knew would be a low point for rebuilding anyway, then maybe you need to take a second and get your head on straight... or request a trade to the fanbase for another team. I hear that the Wiz are looking.

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    Super Moderator MangoKid's Avatar
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    Would the moves for Chandler and/or Diaw and/or Barnes make this team a contender? We might be fighting for a playoff spot..maybe. But it's not like we lost out on something amazing. The moves were meant to be a stopgap measure. Chandler is a FA at the end, Diaw is a possible one too. Instead of a pure PG in Jose, we'd be having Jarrett Jack running around at the point. The only move I was a bit upset at that didn't materialize was Barnes. I think his mindframe would have instantly rubbed off on some of the younger guys.

    Everything happens for a reason, and it's not a big loss that the deals didn't go through. Let's rebuild this team right.

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    Raptors Republic Starter matt's Avatar
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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    Fully agree. But for me its not really how many wins they would have brought this year.
    Having guys like Chandler and Barnes is crucial to young players seeing the right way to do things.
    Both are extremely dedicated to their craft and both think defense before offense. Having these kinds of personalities around guys like Demar and Sonny and almost especially Andrea, would be priceless. Win or Lose.
    I don't know what was BC thinking when he signed Kleiza, we didn't need any offense, so what was the point to bring him here.

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    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    One more thought. I don't think Colangelo "botched" the Chandler trade. He did all he could at the time. That being he got a verbal agreement and kept quiet. Someone from the Bobcats camp spilled the beans and then Jordan broke his word when the chips were down. Not sure Colangelo made a mistake in that process besides trusting Michael Jordan's professionalism.

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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    One more thought. I don't think Colangelo "botched" the Chandler trade. He did all he could at the time. That being he got a verbal agreement and kept quiet. Someone from the Bobcats camp spilled the beans and then Jordan broke his word when the chips were down. Not sure Colangelo made a mistake in that process besides trusting Michael Jordan's professionalism.
    Precisely.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star slaw's Avatar
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    Not sure you can label this season a joke. Any right-thinking person knew that this team was going to be rebuilding when Bosh left and rebuilding means being bad. The off-season deals fell through but it's hard to blame BC for Orlando's and Charlotte's actions. If you want to be mad, be mad about the 4 wasted years prior to this one where management screwed up the rebuild starting in 2006 and left the organization worse than they found it.

    One other thing: why is everyone so high on Matt Barnes? How many teams has this guy played for in the last 5 years? If he was such a great character guy and so effective on the floor, why is no one locking him up long term? I have nothing against Matt Barnes but this idea that somehow he would have been a great veteran presence and helped change the culture in Toronto just doesn't ring true.

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Quote matt wrote: View Post
    I don't know what was BC thinking when he signed Kleiza, we didn't need any offense, so what was the point to bring him here.
    Fully agree. But at the same time Kleiza was a Top 3 Performer at the Worlds this summer and if we didn't sign him, then someone else would have. I would have been FINE with someone else signing him, but you can't blame the guy. Kleiza opened alot of eyes this summer.

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    And I would just like commend everyone for not jumping onto this 'Negative Angle' which has been blatantly attempted here.
    Raptors fans are in fact quite reasonable and intelligent, and understand the situation at hand. Unfortunately there are those who do not.
    We call them Fair Weather. Only show up when the Sun is shining.

    As a Basketball team we are just not very good. Plain and simple. But as in most Business' or Stock Markets; one must make an initial sacrifice, or investment, in order to see future returns. We have finally realized this to be our reality. Thank God.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    See thats what I don't understand. It wasn't that we couldn't sign him. Its that Orlando couldn't sign-and-trade him. It had nothing to do with us and everything to do with Orlando screwing up. So again I don't really understand how this makes us look all that bad.
    The Chandler was looking to be a GREAT deal for BC, until MJ decided he'd rather save money than be competitive. Thats all that was.
    Bosh was leaving no matter what. I don't think we've ever been referred to as a 'joke', though we get bashed in the media, its most based on ignorant assumptions. If the Raps were healthy all year we'd be up there with Charlotte for sure.
    So whatever, I guess I'm in the minority as seeing this season as not nessesarily a 'negative' season, but more a nessesary building block.
    i see it as a building block for sure. but, not a necessary one, i mean had we signed barnes got diaw and chandler. we still had jack who is perfectly capable of starting.

    Chandler
    Bargnani
    Barnes/Diaw
    Derozan
    Jack

    that's playoff contention to me that could be a fifth or sixth seed, maybe quarter/mid season we could have picked up nash for diaw, a pick or two and maybe a prospect in there.

    i mean what's done is done and i get what your saying but, i'm just thinking had we have got those guys...

    btw, colangelo didn't think barnes was going to leave orlando, so he pursued kleiza, signed him, then realized barnes was basically on the way out, and realized he couldn't sign him for the amount of money he was looking for, so then looked to orlando with out realizing they couldn't sign him either.

    I don't know he seems smarter thna that to me.

    and rumour has it that m.j. was just covering his players asses because info leaked that suggested that chandler didn't want to come here and that he made up that story about calderon.

    then again the media was saying calderon will drive larry brown nuts with his disability to play d, but larry brown is currently without a job anyways.

    it just seemed to me alot was shielded from the public eye with those trades.
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    Raptors Republic Rookie WBG416's Avatar
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    In hindsite the raps could have handled many things differently. but get over it

    chandler is playing so well because he has kidd setting him up, and guys like dirk and terry getting defenders out of the post.

    Barnes' would also have little to no impact, he is basically a more polished julian wright.

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