View Poll Results: What should Jose's role be once he returns?

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  • Numero Ocho should start! Ole!

    1 6.67%
  • Ocho should come off the bench until he gets his legs back then start

    4 26.67%
  • Ocho should come off the bench for the remainder of the season

    6 40.00%
  • Trade him. JJ and Banks are handling PG duties just fine

    4 26.67%
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Thread: Should Jose Start or Come Off The Bench?

  1. #1
    Super Moderator .40 Cal Flakes's Avatar
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    Default Should Jose Start or Come Off The Bench?

    Triano has said that Numero Ocho will most likely return for Wednesday's game against the Magic. The big question on everyone's mind is will he start or not? A question as of yet unanswered by Triano. I'm really liking how JJ and the team are playing with Jack starting. I feel Ocho should come off the bench with limited minutes until he gets his legs back. And even after he gets back into game shape I think it's best that he backs up JJ. The team is playing it's best ball so far this season. Why not stick with what seems to be working? What do you guys think.
    Last edited by .40 Cal Flakes; Mon Jan 4th, 2010 at 04:23 PM.

  2. #2
    Administrator Dr. James Naismith's Avatar
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    I think at least until Jose's 100% he'll be coming off the bench for the next couple weeks. Until this team goes through a drought and struggles badly the starting PG spot should be Jack's to lose now. Contracts shouldn't dictate who starts and who comes off the bench. I'm sure Jose wouldn't complain being the back-up either because at the end of the day he's still making his $8 million whether he starts or comes off the bench.

    If Triano decides to tinker with the chemistry right now with our starting five, I'll really start doubting his ability as a coach. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

  3. #3
    Raptors Republic Rookie A00715890's Avatar
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    should Jose come off the bench? Yes
    will he come off the bench? No

    edit: iam talking about the season...hes probably gonna come off the bench against th magic.

  4. #4
    Super Moderator .40 Cal Flakes's Avatar
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    Quote Doc Naismith wrote: View Post
    I think at least until Jose's 100% he'll be coming off the bench for the next couple weeks. Until this team goes through a drought and struggles badly the starting PG spot should be Jack's to lose now. Contracts shouldn't dictate who starts and who comes off the bench. I'm sure Jose wouldn't complain being the back-up either because at the end of the day he's still making his $8 million whether he starts or comes off the bench.

    If Triano decides to tinker with the chemistry right now with our starting five, I'll really start doubting his ability as a coach. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
    My sentiments exactly. With the exception of Friday's game against the Celtics, the Raps have been playing at a high level, specifically their D has been great. So the Dinos are playing good ball, why mess with it right now?! Like you said Doc, unless the raps go through an extended offensive drought, I don't think it would be wise for Triano to even consider inserting Jose into the starting lineup. I say keep Jose's mins limited off the bench until he gets back into the groove of things.

  5. #5
    Raptors Republic Starter James Ballswin (Realizar)'s Avatar
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    Jose should come off the bench until Jack loses the starting job (which he's clearly won).

  6. #6
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    I believe its been clearly demonstrated (while Jose has been out) that when Turk has been handling the ball (Jack gives up the ball early) the team has had more fluidity to its offence apart from making Hedo more involved. I hope Jose has recognized this. If he has not or unwilling then it will be on JT's coaching resume when he makes the call who the crunch time/lead point guard will be.

  7. #7
    Raptors Republic Rookie JibbaJabba34's Avatar
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    Jose's defense is suspect, the whole league knows this. Jack is hard-nosed, takes it to the rack, is a good assist guy, but he is tough on defense. Jack's numbers when he starts are pretty close to Jose's numbers from last year. Jose used to have an amazing assist to turnover ratio last season (first in the league for most of last season) but this year he's been making much worse decisions with the ball. Aside from him shooting the ball so well, he has been a far worse player this season than he was over the past 2 seasons. I personally feel that we are better without his overinflated contract and we should trade him while we can. Great guy, but he actually hurts us when he's on the floor.

  8. #8
    Super Moderator .40 Cal Flakes's Avatar
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    Quote Bendit wrote: View Post
    I believe its been clearly demonstrated (while Jose has been out) that when Turk has been handling the ball (Jack gives up the ball early) the team has had more fluidity to its offence apart from making Hedo more involved. I hope Jose has recognized this. If he has not or unwilling then it will be on JT's coaching resume when he makes the call who the crunch time/lead point guard will be.
    I think a lot of that has to do with the fact that Jack is actually moving without the ball in his hands. He is good at it, not great. But still, he shows a willingness to try and create offense without the ball in his hands. Jose on the other hand is terrible at moving around the floor without the ball in his hands. He just stands pat for the most part, waiting for the ball to come back to him, which frustrates me to no end. To his credit Jose has gotten better at allowing Turk and others to handle the offense and at pushing the ball up the court. He needs to continue to improve in these areas.

  9. #9
    Super Moderator .40 Cal Flakes's Avatar
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    Quote JibbaJabba34 wrote: View Post
    Jose's defense is suspect, the whole league knows this. Jack is hard-nosed, takes it to the rack, is a good assist guy, but he is tough on defense. Jack's numbers when he starts are pretty close to Jose's numbers from last year. Jose used to have an amazing assist to turnover ratio last season (first in the league for most of last season) but this year he's been making much worse decisions with the ball. Aside from him shooting the ball so well, he has been a far worse player this season than he was over the past 2 seasons. I personally feel that we are better without his overinflated contract and we should trade him while we can. Great guy, but he actually hurts us when he's on the floor.
    You can't blame Ocho for that though. Triano's offense (specifically transition and fastbreak) calls for pushing the ball up the court a lot quicker and taking more riskier chances. So having a few more turnovers comes with that, it can't really be helped. Last year people were complaining that Jose tended to slow down the offense and control it too much. I think he is doing a better job this year in loosening up the offense. I can live with a couple extra turnovers as long as that means more transition and fastbreak points and more fluidity in the offense.

  10. #10
    Raptors Republic Rookie JibbaJabba34's Avatar
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    Forty Cal, I agree that it's better that Jose pushes the ball more and with that comes a few more turnovers. We are a better team running as we have a very athletic team (especially our 2nd unit) with no big, slow center to bog us down. If Jose continues to push the ball up, by passing it up the floor instead of dribbling the air out of the ball, he will be more useful to us on offense, but he still needs to play some defense. That's his biggest drawback. I can think of 3 possessions in a row that Mike Bibby shot the ball in Jose's grill in their big loss in Atlanta. He didn't even attempt to stop Bibby from getting the ball, nor was he close enough to close him out and take away his shot. Bibby isn't even a great shooter and he had no problem putting it up on Ocho 3 times in a row! Unacceptable! That's just one instance that comes to mind. There are many, many others.

  11. #11
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    Start him or trade him -- I'm happy with either of those options.

  12. #12
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    Great, now some people think Banks is better than Jose. Can't there ever be a balanced view of the situation?

  13. #13
    Super Moderator .40 Cal Flakes's Avatar
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    Quote JibbaJabba34 wrote: View Post
    Forty Cal, I agree that it's better that Jose pushes the ball more and with that comes a few more turnovers. We are a better team running as we have a very athletic team (especially our 2nd unit) with no big, slow center to bog us down. If Jose continues to push the ball up, by passing it up the floor instead of dribbling the air out of the ball, he will be more useful to us on offense, but he still needs to play some defense. That's his biggest drawback.
    That's the key right there. The Dinos are a much quicker and more athletic team than last year. With new guys like Weems, Belli, DD and Amir all able to push and/or finish on the fast break and transition, it makes sense to push the ball up the court quickly and take a few more "risky" chances. Jose is slowly getting better at letting go of the ball and pushing it up court-which all started last year out of necessity when Marion came into town. Like you said though, my biggest concern with him is his D, his ability to keep his man in front of him and recover on screens.

  14. #14
    Raptors Republic All-Star brothersteve's Avatar
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    It would be hard to imagine that Jose Calderon can take a month off the schedule and just step back into a starting role. And if starting, playing starterís minutes seems very unlikely at first.

    But the numbers support a return of Jose Calderon to the starting line-up as soon as he is able. Jose Calderon certainly has the highest upside of any Raptors point guard.

    And the supposedly better defense by Jack and Banks is not supported by the numbers.
    Checking out the stats at Basketball-reference.com indicates Jose, in his worse year, is still the superior player to Jack.

    The Raptors have to either start Calderon, play Calderon starters minutes, or find a trade that returns his full value - which is high!
    The best Raptors discussion board is at Raptors Republic.

    Stephen Brotherston, Pro Bball Report

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