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Thread: Biyombo as a starting PF - make the case

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    Super Moderator thead's Avatar
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    Default Biyombo as a starting PF - make the case

    I'm asking the republic to think outside the box a bit and make the case for Biyombo to start and be resigned

    What would we have to do offensively?

    Is it worth the tradeoff in order to have JV and Biyombo both protecting the rim?

    I know the reasons it can't work.

    What are some of the reasons it could.

    What obtainable improvements would the team need to make around such a starting lineup given that it would be

    Lowry/DeRozan/Carroll/Biyombo/JV/Joseph/Powell/Patterson playing the majority of the minutes

    I agree we can't sign him to a 14m dollar deal as a backup...so what if he starts?
    For still frame photograph of me reading the DeRozan thread please refer to my avatar

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    Super Moderator thead's Avatar
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    It reminds me of a 90s style team. We would own the paint and win the rebound battle every single night
    For still frame photograph of me reading the DeRozan thread please refer to my avatar

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    Raptors Republic Starter Maury's Avatar
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    He really has to get that midrange jumper down. As long as he cant be totally left alone it could work. I just feel like JV would be in a tough spot to produce more like we think he could. He would probably be doubled every time he got the ball, and Bis couldn't catch a big to big pass very often.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star SkywalkerAC's Avatar
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    Not going to fly with Casey and the modern NBA in general. And it's more like 15-18 mill.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star ogi's Avatar
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    I think the lack of spacing would be scary particularly for this team which drives a ton. Only way I see this happening is if Biyombo suddenly gains the ability to hit mid range shots or JV turns into a stretch 5 lol

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    just will not work

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    Raptors Republic Veteran Barolt's Avatar
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    Can't do it if DeMar is the starting 2.

    With DeMar and JV, you need the other 3 guys to shoot. If DeMar isn't the answer, Biyombo at the 4 might be doable.
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    Raptors Republic All-Star charlesnba23's Avatar
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    Quote ogi wrote: View Post
    I think the lack of spacing would be scary particularly for this team which drives a ton. Only way I see this happening is if Biyombo suddenly gains the ability to hit mid range shots or JV turns into a stretch 5 lol
    What if both happens? It's true that we have something special in Biyombo. Maybe even them really want to play together next year and they will shoot all summer long... Who knows?

    This would certainly be amazing. I mean long term, Bismack would probably be a better signing, than say, Al Horford.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star charlesnba23's Avatar
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    Quote charlesnba23 wrote: View Post
    What if both happens? It's true that we have something special in Biyombo. Maybe even them really want to play together next year and they will shoot all summer long... Who knows?

    This would certainly be amazing. I mean long term, Bismack would probably be a better signing, than say, Al Horford.
    And to add (sorry cannot edit on the phone), Bismack has prove he can guard forwards. He was our best player guarding LeBron in the last series.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran Barolt's Avatar
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    Quote charlesnba23 wrote: View Post
    What if both happens? It's true that we have something special in Biyombo. Maybe even them really want to play together next year and they will shoot all summer long... Who knows?

    This would certainly be amazing. I mean long term, Bismack would probably be a better signing, than say, Al Horford.
    Still not a great idea. Bismack, DeMar and JV on the floor means that JV can't operate in the post, won't have the space to do it.

    JV is insanely efficient in the post. You're taking away his most effective weapon so you can have Bismack on the floor?
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    Raptors Republic All-Star ogi's Avatar
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    Quote charlesnba23 wrote: View Post
    What if both happens? It's true that we have something special in Biyombo. Maybe even them really want to play together next year and they will shoot all summer long... Who knows?

    This would certainly be amazing. I mean long term, Bismack would probably be a better signing, than say, Al Horford.
    Hell of a thing to bet on happening though

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    It's very difficult to train someone to do something that they are not comfortable in doing. I love the kid, but I don't think BB is that smart. He'd get in JV's way and JV is the more dangerous post weapon.

    But for this to work.. we need BB to be able to hit the 3. We need more than just a mid range game from him. We need a guy that can stretch the floor.

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    Super Moderator thead's Avatar
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    keep in mind that space can be created not just through shooting but solid screens. I wish I could draw up a play right now but basically you run a DeMar/JV pick and roll on the left side and have Biyombo screen off the ball for Lowry to hit his sweet spot on the right side from 3.

    1.) If DeRozan shoots the midrange. JV and Biyombo are both crashing the boards
    2.) If DeRozan passes to JV, you have a layup or if they help off Biyombo a dump off to Biz or a kickout to Lowry
    3.) If DeRozan drives, two offensive rebounders
    4.) If everyone sucks in open 3 for Kyle

    in San Antonio neither Aldridge or Duncan can shoot 3s and they get the space they need off screens/cuts etc.

    GRANTED Biz does not have the 20ft shot like Aldridge.

    I think you can get open looks if you tailor the offense to what you have. Also Patterson is still gonna get his 36 minutes, so you can factor that into the rotation.
    For still frame photograph of me reading the DeRozan thread please refer to my avatar

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    Super Moderator thead's Avatar
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    Randolph and Gasol is another example. Gasol and Bynum.

    It seems to me that either JV or Biyombo need to be able to hit from 15 - 20 ft consistently.
    For still frame photograph of me reading the DeRozan thread please refer to my avatar

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    Super Moderator thead's Avatar
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    another improvement would be that our wings can play a little tighter D knowing that BIZ and JV are locking down the paint
    For still frame photograph of me reading the DeRozan thread please refer to my avatar

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    Raptors Republic Veteran Barolt's Avatar
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    Quote thead wrote: View Post
    keep in mind that space can be created not just through shooting but solid screens. I wish I could draw up a play right now but basically you run a DeMar/JV pick and roll on the left side and have Biyombo screen off the ball for Lowry to hit his sweet spot on the right side from 3.

    1.) If DeRozan shoots the midrange. JV and Biyombo are both crashing the boards
    2.) If DeRozan passes to JV, you have a layup or if they help off Biyombo a dump off to Biz or a kickout to Lowry
    3.) If DeRozan drives, two offensive rebounders
    4.) If everyone sucks in open 3 for Kyle

    in San Antonio neither Aldridge or Duncan can shoot 3s and they get the space they need off screens/cuts etc.

    GRANTED Biz does not have the 20ft shot like Aldridge.

    I think you can get open looks if you tailor the offense to what you have. Also Patterson is still gonna get his 36 minutes, so you can factor that into the rotation.
    In your situation, if Bismack is screening for Lowry off-ball, why does the defense respect Bismack at all? They already have JV's defender moving back to cover the paint, because DeMar's shot isn't good enough to respect anyways.

    1) DeMar's midrange game is kinda awful. 35% from 16-23ft this year. If you don't get the rebound, you have two slow bigs crashing the offensive boards, leading to a likely odd-man transition opportunity for the other team.

    2) If DeRozan passes to JV, they collapse on the paint with Bismack, JV and DeMar's defenders, forcing JV into a tough situation.

    3) DeRozan can't drive, because he'd be driving into his defender, as well as Bismack and JV's.

    4) The defense has no reason to sag off Lowry at all, it's the other 3 defenders who will suck in.

    It's DeMar's lack of a shot that kills this whole set. San Antonio runs with 3pt threats at the 1/2/3 positions to make up for their big's lack of a 3pt shot, and they also won this year mostly on their insanely efficient defense with key defenders at all positions, something which again, DeMar isn't good at.

    Can't run Bismack at the 4 with DeMar.
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    Imagine the death lineup of JV Biyombo and Demar we will rain treys from the havens. Jokes aside that's a terrible idea demar will have no room to drive making him useless and team's will ignore Biyombo and double JV so there is no way we can make it work.

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    Ya as everyone else says, it's not going to work.

    Love Biz. Actually wanted us to draft him, but obviously we got Jonas instead.

    But in all likelihood he's not coming back. Too much money, not enough offensive balance.

    We need a 4 who can score. Especially with Derozan who can't space the floor from beyond.

    OTOH, if DeRozan is gone, we have Ross, who can, and a whole lot of cap space, in which case we can probably afford him.

    If DeRozan stays, Biz and Ross are gone for sure.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran iblastoff's Avatar
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    Quote Barolt wrote: View Post
    In your situation, if Bismack is screening for Lowry off-ball, why does the defense respect Bismack at all? They already have JV's defender moving back to cover the paint, because DeMar's shot isn't good enough to respect anyways.

    1) DeMar's midrange game is kinda awful. 35% from 16-23ft this year. If you don't get the rebound, you have two slow bigs crashing the offensive boards, leading to a likely odd-man transition opportunity for the other team.

    2) If DeRozan passes to JV, they collapse on the paint with Bismack, JV and DeMar's defenders, forcing JV into a tough situation.

    3) DeRozan can't drive, because he'd be driving into his defender, as well as Bismack and JV's.

    4) The defense has no reason to sag off Lowry at all, it's the other 3 defenders who will suck in.

    It's DeMar's lack of a shot that kills this whole set. San Antonio runs with 3pt threats at the 1/2/3 positions to make up for their big's lack of a 3pt shot, and they also won this year mostly on their insanely efficient defense with key defenders at all positions, something which again, DeMar isn't good at.

    Can't run Bismack at the 4 with DeMar.
    Lol wtf is this shit?!? Yes we get it. You hate demar. But to name him as the ultimate reason as to why an already outlandish plan won't work is just silly.


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    Quote charlesnba23 wrote: View Post
    And to add (sorry cannot edit on the phone), Bismack has prove he can guard forwards. He was our best player guarding LeBron in the last series.
    i really like the biz patterson combo off the bench

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