Everything Derozan

[rocwell]

[Chr1s1anL]

#12

[S.R.]

#12

Yeah, being a stable and consistent generator of points under a heavy workload while maintaining good health has definitely helped the team. Look at any number of teams with fragile key players and you'll see how hard it is to progress as a franchise while trying to depend on guys like that. But moving forward hopefully they spread the pts around a bit and DeMar can be a bit more selective and a improve his efficiency. Short of discovering a 3 pt shot, that's the next step forward I'd like to see from him.

[Chr1s1anL]

Yeah, being a stable and consistent generator of points under a heavy workload while maintaining good health has definitely helped the team. Look at any number of teams with fragile key players and you'll see how hard it is to progress as a franchise while trying to depend on guys like that. But moving forward hopefully they spread the pts around a bit and DeMar can be a bit more selective and a improve his efficiency. Short of discovering a 3 pt shot, that's the next step forward I'd like to see from him.

Pretty much agree with everything you just said. If he ever gets to 35+ from 3 he will essentially be unguardable.

[Sinbad]

Pretty much agree with everything you just said. If he ever gets to 35+ from 3 he will essentially be unguardable.

This is wishful thinking at its finest. He has had success shooting corner threes, but his poor shooting mechanics will hold him back from ever being a consistent deep threat. The further away he is from the basket, the more his shooting motion resembles a slingshot from behind his head, and the guide hand comes over the ball too much instead of staying at the side. The result is a shot that he seems to be aiming instead of releasing naturally. 7 years in, his shooting form is what it is, and while thousands of repetitions might coax out some improvement, he'll never be the three point shooter that Ross or even Lowry is. The less moving parts in a jumper, the better. But there are anomalies like Reggie Miller who had convoluted shooting mechanics, but he has admitted that much of it can be attributed to habits he formed in his formative years since Cheryl would always block his shot.

I would rather DeMar put more effort into being a consistent defensive presence than become a long-range gunner, but there really is no incentive for him to buckle down on that end other than pride.

[Chr1s1anL]

This is wishful thinking at its finest. He has had success shooting corner threes, but his poor shooting mechanics will hold him back from ever being a consistent deep threat. The further away he is from the basket, the more his shooting motion resembles a slingshot from behind his head, and the guide hand comes over the ball too much instead of staying at the side. The result is a shot that he seems to be aiming instead of releasing naturally. 7 years in, his shooting form is what it is, and while thousands of repetitions might coax out some improvement, he'll never be the three point shooter that Ross or even Lowry is. The less moving parts in a jumper, the better. But there are anomalies like Reggie Miller who had convoluted shooting mechanics, but he has admitted that much of it can be attributed to habits he formed in his formative years since Cheryl would always block his shot.

I would rather DeMar put more effort into being a consistent defensive presence than become a long-range gunner, but there really is no incentive for him to buckle down on that end other than pride.

He doesn't need to be Lowry/Ross type of shooter. Just needs to be respectable. I don't think that's wishful thinking. He made the right strides last year.

[GLF]

This is wishful thinking at its finest. He has had success shooting corner threes, but his poor shooting mechanics will hold him back from ever being a consistent deep threat. The further away he is from the basket, the more his shooting motion resembles a slingshot from behind his head, and the guide hand comes over the ball too much instead of staying at the side. The result is a shot that he seems to be aiming instead of releasing naturally. 7 years in, his shooting form is what it is, and while thousands of repetitions might coax out some improvement, he'll never be the three point shooter that Ross or even Lowry is. The less moving parts in a jumper, the better. But there are anomalies like Reggie Miller who had convoluted shooting mechanics, but he has admitted that much of it can be attributed to habits he formed in his formative years since Cheryl would always block his shot.

I would rather DeMar put more effort into being a consistent defensive presence than become a long-range gunner, but there really is no incentive for him to buckle down on that end other than pride.

Yea his form on the 3 point shot has to be what is holding him back. Because it makes no sense that Powell can improve his 3 point shot as quickly as he has and Demar is still struggling so hard 7 years in. I will not be holding my breath at all for that. I hope he can improve his playmaking like he said he was working on. Defense would be good too but as you said he has no incentive to improve that. And that is hard to work on over an offseason. I think if he can become a better playmaker that will help him take a big step forward. The 3 would obviously be amazing but I don't see it happening. He couldn't even shoot the European 3 point shot consistently much less the NBA 3.

[Sinbad]

He doesn't need to be Lowry/Ross type of shooter. Just needs to be respectable. I don't think that's wishful thinking. He made the right strides last year.

You said that if he reached 35% he would be unguardable. His form is still as poor as it has ever been, but he took a higher volume of shots from the corners. If and when opposing defenses adjust to this, his percentages will drop back to where they've commonly been, sub-30%, as he's a woeful 3PT shooter from everywhere else. Lowry is a 35% 3PT shooter for his career [coming off a career-high season of .388], and Ross is a 37% 3PT shooter for his career [having never shot below .332]. What makes them dangerous is they can shoot respectable percentages from everywhere and be a consistent threat, not just the corners. I say its wishful thinking for DeMar to reach 35% because he would have to increase his percentages from everywhere other than the corners-- and if his current shooting trends continue, it will not happen.

[Sinbad]

Yea his form on the 3 point shot has to be what is holding him back. Because it makes no sense that Powell can improve his 3 point shot as quickly as he has and Demar is still struggling so hard 7 years in. I will not be holding my breath at all for that. I hope he can improve his playmaking like he said he was working on. Defense would be good too but as you said he has no incentive to improve that. And that is hard to work on over an offseason. I think if he can become a better playmaker that will help him take a big step forward. The 3 would obviously be amazing but I don't see it happening. He couldn't even shoot the European 3 point shot consistently much less the NBA 3.

Agreed, and I'm surprised that the Raptors never brought in a shooting coach or shooting specialist a la Dave Hopla to work with him. Blake Griffin used to have hideous form, but the Clippers brought in known specialist Bob Thate and corrected issues he was having with his guide hand (similar to what DeRozan still has now) en route to reconstructing his shooting motion. It can be done, but preferably it has to be done early before the tendencies become too ingrained. Expecting DeRozan to suddenly become a respectable 3PT shooter with his current form is wishful thinking-- and that's not a shot at the guy. But as hard as he works at his game, its baffling that he has never seriously considered a shooting coach that would work with him.

[DanH]

Couple things here.

First, DeMar reaching 35% won't exactly be difficult, since he shot 34% this year. Not exactly a leap. Heck, remove his 3 full court heaves on the year (all of which missed), and he shot 34.6% from three.

Second, clearly DeMar hitting 35% of his threes would NOT make him "unguardable." Paul George didn't shut him down because he shot 1% too poorly from distance. DeRozan learning to use his teammates better could help him approach unguardable a lot faster than any realistic improvement in his shooting.

[GLF]

Couple things here.

First, DeMar reaching 35% won't exactly be difficult, since he shot 34% this year. Not exactly a leap. Heck, remove his 3 full court heaves on the year (all of which missed), and he shot 34.6% from three.

Second, clearly DeMar hitting 35% of his threes would NOT make him "unguardable." Paul George didn't shut him down because he shot 1% too poorly from distance. DeRozan learning to use his teammates better could help him approach unguardable a lot faster than any realistic improvement in his shooting.

I agree. I think him improving his playmaking will improve his game much more than a decent 3 point shot.

[Sinbad]

Couple things here.

First, DeMar reaching 35% won't exactly be difficult, since he shot 34% this year. Not exactly a leap. Heck, remove his 3 full court heaves on the year (all of which missed), and he shot 34.6% from three.

Second, clearly DeMar hitting 35% of his threes would NOT make him "unguardable." Paul George didn't shut him down because he shot 1% too poorly from distance. DeRozan learning to use his teammates better could help him approach unguardable a lot faster than any realistic improvement in his shooting.

This is what I was hinting at before, but thanks for spelling it out so flatly. It's why I initial said that I would rather see him commit to rounding out his game via playing consistent defence than chasing a higher 3PT percentage.

DeRozan's 3PT%
09-10 4-16 .250
10-11 5-52 .096
11-12 24-92 .261
12-13 34-120 .283
13-14 64-210 .305
14-15 25-88 .284
15-16 47-139 .338

You are right in saying that he could have easily reached 34% if he cut out those halfcourt heaves, though DeMar is kind of infamous for waiting until the horn blows before he launches. We know why; players are conscious of their percentages-- Durant, a far better shooter, catches a lot of flack for doing the same. Paul George made him look ordinary due to his inability to adapt under pressure when the calls don't come and inability to involve others. He made himself very guardable, almost laughably so. I would much rather see DeMar improve his decision-making under duress, commit to making the extra pass, and resisting the urge to hunt for his shot when defenses goad him into tough, contested FGA's.

Dwyane Wade still isn't much of an outside shooter, but what makes him dangerous is his all-around game, basketball IQ, passing, and defence. In his heyday, and as we just saw in the playoffs, he doesn't need a 3PT shot to be devastating, though he hit a handful of huge 3's against the Hornets and against us when the moment called for it.

[LJ2]

I agree. I think him improving his playmaking will improve his game much more than a decent 3 point shot.

He did improve his playmaking last season, but it's a mentality that doesn't come naturally to him. He has to actually try to keep that part of his game in mind because his natural instinct is to take it to the rim or take a shot. I don't know if that is a mentality he can ever change to the point he incorporates it into his game regularly.

[GLF]

He did improve his playmaking last season, but it's a mentality that doesn't come naturally to him. He has to actually try to keep that part of his game in mind because his natural instinct is to take it to the rim or take a shot. I don't know if that is a mentality he can ever change to the point he incorporates it into his game regularly.

Yea he did a good job at improving that over the regular season but in the playoffs he went back to him tunnel vision self. If he can continue it into the playoffs this year or maybe even take it to another level THEN he will be close to unguardable. As Dan H said, improving his 3 point shot by 1-2% isn't going to make him unguardable.

[Barolt]

Here's the other thing about DeMar's improved 3-pt shooting:

17 of his 47 makes on the season were during a single 14-game stretch, during which he shot 53.1% from 3.(17/32)

Outside of that stretch, he shot 30/107 from 3 on the season(28.0%), .3% below his career average.

He might've improved as a shooter this past season... or he might've just got hot for a stretch that changed the look of the season artificially.