Everything Derozan

[stooley]

Really? So you're that confident that Mozgov is that much better than JV?

well then every one of our players could be starters on a contender lol.

you could put me with lebron and we'd be a contender lol

[Uncle_Si]

well then every one of our players could be starters on a contender lol.

you could put me with lebron and we'd be a contender lol

Lol

[Axel]

3) Deamr was a All-"STAR" and if healthy he would have probably been an All-"Star" this year and im 95% sure he'll be a All-"Star" next year

6) The way lowry played to end the season a pylon would add more wins then him. He was a non-factor in teh playoffs.
And he's not getting any younger. Trade him to teams like Houston, NYK or Lakers, we can probably get some value for him

All-Star isn't the same thing as "Star" when discussing trades. All-Stars get traded fairly frequently, while Stars do not.

Also the list of players who have made the All-Star team is filled with non-stars. John Starks, Magloire, Theo Ratliff, Wally Szczerbiak, Mo Williams, and Gerald Wallace to name a few. Demar is clearly more in this group than the group of Durant, Curry, Harden, James, Davis.

Demar wasn't necessarily going to be an all-star this year before his injury. He was struggling then too. His shot wasn't falling (39% compared to career avg of 44%) despite his High Usage and FGA.

Yes, the playoff Lowry was terrible. But you have to take the entire season average if you want to talk about the impact on wins per season.

In closing, you are not willing to trade Demar because he is a "star" and it would look bad, but are more than happy to trade Lowry, who is probably closer to actually being a star (he was an all-star starter) and has a bigger impact on W/L than DD. Complete nonsense.

[Primer]

I do believe DeRozan is not a first option, but I'm shocked at the amount of people that want to trade him. Like we can simply add better players around him like pat Riley did. If we do shit this like and trade stars, no one will come here and Toronto won't probably get pass the first round for a long long long time.
There are so many free agents this year MU needs to throw the max at them.

And if we thinking about trading anyone it should be
1- tross
2- lowry

My favorite part of this post is where you suggest we add players around DD like Riley did with Wade. First off Wade is infinitely better than Demar at every aspect of basketball. Secondly, Wade recruited Lebron and Bosh to come play with him. You think DD has any pull to recruit a top FA to come here, cause I sure as shit don't. Comparing Demar to Wade is just laughable, a sure fire hall of fame SG versus a guard who barely made the all star team once largely due to being on Canada's only basketball team.

[Bear]

I do believe DeRozan is not a first option, but I'm shocked at the amount of people that want to trade him. Like we can simply add better players around him like pat Riley did. If we do shit this like and trade stars, no one will come here and Toronto won't probably get pass the first round for a long long long time.
There are so many free agents this year MU needs to throw the max at them.

And if we thinking about trading anyone it should be
1- tross
2- lowry

You dont add better players to a third banana, you add a third banana to hetter player.

[Bear]

3) Deamr was a All-"STAR" and if healthy he would have probably been an All-"Star" this year and im 95% sure he'll be a All-"Star" next year

6) The way lowry played to end the season a pylon would add more wins then him. He was a non-factor in teh playoffs.
And he's not getting any younger. Trade him to teams like Houston, NYK or Lakers, we can probably get some value for him

Demar was barely an allstar last season and if not for key injuries to somr guards in the east he would not have gotten selected.

And that was a career best anamoly season.

[Bear]

All-Star isn't the same thing as "Star" when discussing trades. All-Stars get traded fairly frequently, while Stars do not.

Also the list of players who have made the All-Star team is filled with non-stars. John Starks, Magloire, Theo Ratliff, Wally Szczerbiak, Mo Williams, and Gerald Wallace to name a few. Demar is clearly more in this group than the group of Durant, Curry, Harden, James, Davis.

Demar wasn't necessarily going to be an all-star this year before his injury. He was struggling then too. His shot wasn't falling (39% compared to career avg of 44%) despite his High Usage and FGA.

Yes, the playoff Lowry was terrible. But you have to take the entire season average if you want to talk about the impact on wins per season.

In closing, you are not willing to trade Demar because he is a "star" and it would look bad, but are more than happy to trade Lowry, who is probably closer to actually being a star (he was an all-star starter) and has a bigger impact on W/L than DD. Complete nonsense.

Find it funny guy deflects criticism of demar causrle he was "injured" this year but does not give same deflections to lawry in the playoffs.

[Other Scott]

I don't think you have to make the decision on whether you are trading DeMar or Lowry up front. You evaluate offers for each, and then make the trade that gives you the most value back in comparison to what you feel their value is.

Personally, I'd be more inclined to trade Lowry because my subjective opinion is that I'm more worried about how he fits into a team culture and ultimately with a new coach from a long term basis, but if teams are offering peanuts for him but something substantial for DeRozan then you trade DeRozan.

[Primer]

I don't think you have to make the decision on whether you are trading DeMar or Lowry up front. You evaluate offers for each, and then make the trade that gives you the most value back in comparison to what you feel their value is.

Personally, I'd be more inclined to trade Lowry because my subjective opinion is that I'm more worried about how he fits into a team culture and ultimately with a new coach from a long term basis, but if teams are offering peanuts for him but something substantial for DeRozan then you trade DeRozan.

I more inclined to trade Derozan because Lowry Has proven to be a positive towards win totals every year of his career, only posting one sub .100 WS/48 in his entire career, in his second season. Whereas Demar has posted a sub .100 WS/48 Every single year of his career except 2014-14. Lowry makes the team better and generates more wins, Demar doesn't. The comparison is as fair as can be considering they play for the same team. If we move Demar and replace him with a SG who posts positive WS/48, we will get better.

[JimiCliff]

I more inclined to trade Derozan because Lowry Has proven to be a positive towards win totals every year of his career, only posting one sub .100 WS/48 in his entire career, in his second season. Whereas Demar has posted a sub .100 WS/48 Every single year of his career except 2014-14. Lowry makes the team better and generates more wins, Demar doesn't. The comparison is as fair as can be considering they play for the same team. If we move Demar and replace him with a SG who posts positive WS/48, we will get better.

What's, like, average WS for a rotation player?

[Axel]

What's, like, average WS for a rotation player?

For guards (both PG and SG) who started at least 25 games last year, Demar ranks 32nd in WS/48. He came in between CJ Miles and Alec Burks.

He's 96th for all positions.

[Axel]

What's, like, average WS for a rotation player?

For guards (both PG and SG) who started at least 25 games last year, Demar ranks 32nd in WS/48. He came in between CJ Miles and Alec Burks.

He's 96th for all positions.

His WS/48 is 0.09. The mathematical average of all the guards (79 in total) is 0.089544. So just barely above average for 79 SGs.

If you bump the min Game Start up to 50, the average is 1.109311, and Demar ranks 24th.

[S.R.]

The contract status is key for DeMar and whatever locker room issues may or may not have happened this year are the key for Lowry. If Lowry is not an ongoing locker room problem, then his contract for an All-Star player (even borderline) is fantastic. DeMar's future is uncertain, he might not stay here, and if he does he may ask for twice as much money as Lowry gets. Is DeMar twice the player Lowry is?

My plan A would be to move DeMar for a better fit SG, but if a desperate win-now team offers a very good return for Lowry, then I would also be fine with trading Lowry to get younger, take a step back, but end up with a higher ceiling.

[Chr1s1anL]

No, 3 votes is meaningless for anyone no matter how you slice it. There's simply no way anything DeMar did this year was all-NBA worthy. There's nothing Jonas did that would merit either. The only one who really might deserve any such votes from Toronto is Lowry, and he got less than DeMar. *And that just shows you how flawed and stupid the whole process is.

We're not trying to 'put him down', we're trying to clarify his place, which is just bringing him down to the fans that deify him. To everyone else it's just making plain sense.

Winning player of the month isn't All-NBA worthy? An award that's only given to 6 players from each conference. People forget DD was playing like the best 2 guard in the east for about a 2 month stretch to close out the season.

[Other Scott]

I more inclined to trade Derozan because Lowry Has proven to be a positive towards win totals every year of his career, only posting one sub .100 WS/48 in his entire career, in his second season. Whereas Demar has posted a sub .100 WS/48 Every single year of his career except 2014-14. Lowry makes the team better and generates more wins, Demar doesn't. The comparison is as fair as can be considering they play for the same team. If we move Demar and replace him with a SG who posts positive WS/48, we will get better.

You're assuming the offers for both will be the same quality. I don't have any doubt that Lowry is a better player than DeRozan at present. But I think most other teams also know that Lowry is a better player than DeRozan, and depending on need for point guards compared to shooting guards will offer accordingly.

The issue is that I am convinced that DeRozan will not be a worse player than what we've seen the last couple of years. I believe 2014/15 DeRozan is the floor for him. I have no such certainty with Lowry, especially with how badly the last half of the year went. So if both players are being offered exactly what their value should be per what they've produced the last couple of years, I take the Lowry offer and keep DeRozan.