View Poll Results: Grade Derozan's Season.

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  • A

    1 1.49%
  • B

    18 26.87%
  • C

    40 59.70%
  • D

    8 11.94%
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Thread: Everything Demar Derozan

  1. #1121
    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    Awful long slump for a third year player who's as talented as DeMar. Concerning.

  2. #1122
    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Quote ceez wrote: View Post
    Awful long slump for a third year player who's as talented as DeMar. Concerning.
    In his last seven games, he's had a 27 point outing on 8-12 shooting and getting to the line 16 times.
    Two games before that he had 17 points on 6-11 with 8 rebounds.
    Two games before that he had 15 points and 8 rebounds while getting to the line 8 times.

    He's battling with consistency and having the Full Force of an NBA teams defense Solely focuses on him.
    Not Depression or anything else. He's a 22 year old kid Learning the NBA and learning how to the #1 scorer. Theres going to be a learning curve and consistency issues.
    Look at Bargs for fucks sake. Apparently he's doing fine now.
    Last edited by Joey; Fri Feb 3rd, 2012 at 05:43 PM.
    In Masai we Trust.

  3. #1123
    Raptors Republic Veteran NoPropsneeded's Avatar
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    LBF you just released the trolls... I'm with Joey it's just inconsistency and still learning the new D case system

  4. #1124
    Raptors Republic Superstar planetmars's Avatar
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    The biggest difference between this year and last year with Demar is the change in coach. Demar actually excelled in Triano's system. The fast pace offense worked because he's quick, young, athletic and didn't have to work as hard for his 2 points. However in a deliberately slow paced offense it is much harder.

    He was never good in those other intangibles like passing, rebounding or defense primarily because of his IQ. That should change when he matures as he's athletically gifted and a lot of that should come naturally to him as his instincts become sharper.

    The biggest issue I have is his ball handling skills as has been pointed out numerous times in other threads. I don't think this will ever improve to a satisfactory level, IMO. I think Demar needs to change his game and model it after someone like Ray Allen, Rip Hamilton or Reggie Miller.

    Being so athletic and quick, Demar should easily be able to lose his man, curl off screens and hit a quick jumper. Allen started his career as a slasher, and adapted to becoming the jump shooter that he is now. Demar seems to like to shoot the ball, and because he's a gym rat, perhaps that's what he needs to continue to do. If Demar turned into an Allen-lite, I'd have no problems with that. But he's not going to be our 'Kobe', that's for sure.
    Last edited by planetmars; Fri Feb 3rd, 2012 at 05:59 PM.

  5. #1125
    Raptors Republic Veteran NoPropsneeded's Avatar
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    Patience is key in this painful season...

  6. #1126
    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    Quote Nilanka wrote: View Post
    If it is a case of DeMar missing Weems' presence, then I don't want DeMar on this team. That kind of mental instability/insecurity is downright startling.
    Another good reason to make these guys stay in NCAA for at least 2 seasons, so they don't come out and become disgustingly rich, get-their-ass-kissed kids!

  7. #1127
    Raptors Republic Superstar Puffer's Avatar
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    Quote planetmars wrote: View Post
    ...The biggest issue I have is his ball handling skills as has been pointed out numerous times in other threads. I don't think this will ever improve to a satisfactory level, IMO...
    Just a technical skill, like any other. If he works on it he will get better. People aren't born great ball handlers. They may be gifted with skills that make it easier for them, but a lot of these incredible ball handlers you see grew up as kids who were always bouncing the ball. little tougher to learn as you age, but 300 hours of dribbling practicve would do DeMar a world of good.

  8. #1128
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    He's just in a slump and has lost confidence in his abilities. He's had to make probably the biggest adjustment of any Raptor this year.

    In year one he was asked to do nothing more than hit the baseline jumper when the ball was swung to him and finish the occasional fast break/set play oop in a Bosh-dominated system. In yeah two Triano loosened the reigns and he played in a free wheeling system that gave him plenty of transition and early offence opportunities along with a diet of well designed set plays where Jose got him the ball for easy elbow jumpers coming off of screens or back-door oops. In year 3, his role is....what exactly?

    Can anyone really say? When was the last time you saw a game where he got more than 2 really well designed plays to get a shot he's comfortable making? I honestly think this is the biggest problem. In Casey's offence he's an afterthought because he doesn't provide consistent results, but somehow still expected to be aggressive and contribute. You can see it in the number of times he's forced drives, something that he actually did less in previous years than in this one.

    Now let's look at how his season has gone so far. He came out of the gate shooting really well, and had a really solid first 6 games but two of those were with bad shooting percentages. Then he had 4 straight bad games shooting the ball, followed by three really good shooting performances, then another 5 bad, then 1 good, then another bad, another good, then 3 more bad, including tonight's game. That's 9/23 games where he shot the ball well (8 were .500 or better, one was .467, 7/15). Is that really so awful? I think that's to be expected from a guy who really doesn't have that one skill to lean back on and doesn't have a really well-defined offensive role. Hell the entire team struggles to score when Bargs is out, and that just puts more pressure on him.

    And on defence, he's finally being held accountable and he's probably got Casey in his ear constantly telling him what he's got to do better, that he isn't performing well. So he's probably losing confidence on both sides of the ball and is thinking too much instead of just playing. I think that's the biggest problem: he isn't just going out there and letting it all hang out. He's playing tight. He reacts with poor body language to every call that doesn't go his way, to every missed jumper, every mistake. The kid really just needs time, and to be honest I'm kind of glad that he's been thrown into the deep end and has to figure out how to swim this year. If he does, it's going to bode very well long-term.

  9. #1129
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    I'm tired of this crap about how young he is. It's an athletic-based game. Youth helps you. It doesn't take players this long to figure things out.

  10. #1130
    Raptors Republic Veteran NoPropsneeded's Avatar
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    Quote Lark Benson wrote: View Post
    He's just in a slump and has lost confidence in his abilities. He's had to make probably the biggest adjustment of any Raptor this year.

    In year one he was asked to do nothing more than hit the baseline jumper when the ball was swung to him and finish the occasional fast break/set play oop in a Bosh-dominated system. In yeah two Triano loosened the reigns and he played in a free wheeling system that gave him plenty of transition and early offence opportunities along with a diet of well designed set plays where Jose got him the ball for easy elbow jumpers coming off of screens or back-door oops. In year 3, his role is....what exactly?

    Can anyone really say? When was the last time you saw a game where he got more than 2 really well designed plays to get a shot he's comfortable making? I honestly think this is the biggest problem. In Casey's offence he's an afterthought because he doesn't provide consistent results, but somehow still expected to be aggressive and contribute. You can see it in the number of times he's forced drives, something that he actually did less in previous years than in this one.

    Now let's look at how his season has gone so far. He came out of the gate shooting really well, and had a really solid first 6 games but two of those were with bad shooting percentages. Then he had 4 straight bad games shooting the ball, followed by three really good shooting performances, then another 5 bad, then 1 good, then another bad, another good, then 3 more bad, including tonight's game. That's 9/23 games where he shot the ball well (8 were .500 or better, one was .467, 7/15). Is that really so awful? I think that's to be expected from a guy who really doesn't have that one skill to lean back on and doesn't have a really well-defined offensive role. Hell the entire team struggles to score when Bargs is out, and that just puts more pressure on him.

    And on defence, he's finally being held accountable and he's probably got Casey in his ear constantly telling him what he's got to do better, that he isn't performing well. So he's probably losing confidence on both sides of the ball and is thinking too much instead of just playing. I think that's the biggest problem: he isn't just going out there and letting it all hang out. He's playing tight. He reacts with poor body language to every call that doesn't go his way, to every missed jumper, every mistake. The kid really just needs time, and to be honest I'm kind of glad that he's been thrown into the deep end and has to figure out how to swim this year. If he does, it's going to bode very well long-term.
    +1 very well said

  11. #1131
    Raptors Republic Rookie Regression's Avatar
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    Sorry guys, have to give a pointer on word-choice... to regress means to revert towards the normal. It has a neutral connotation. So if Demar had a horrible game yst but played well today then that would also be considered as regressing.

    Now aside that, Demar has been overrated as the Raptor's franchise player. Hence he's not as good as we predicted and each outlier great game is replaced by a mediocre one, leaving a relatively average result. To Demar's credit does anyone remember how raw he was at USC? He was essentially drafted because of his athletic abilities. Considering his age, he has improved significantly but he'll never be a franchise, let alone all-star player.

    Secondly, teams are finally scouting Demar which is limiting his offensive game. He was able to get to the basket a lot easier last year. It's possible that other teams have Derozan ahead of Bargnani when it comes to defensive preparations.

    Let's not place similar expectations on Jonas next year because even if he does okay we'll be disappointed.
    Last edited by Regression; Sat Feb 4th, 2012 at 12:42 AM.

  12. #1132
    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    This is RIDICULOUS. Look what you started LBF.

    He was playing great at the beginning of the season and Sonny wasn't around then.
    One should not use the term 'Depressed' lightly. Demar has shown no indication of being "depressed". I think the notion of it is absurd. He's down on himself because he's not performing the way he knows he can. That's all
    hahaha, your fucking howls. to those who are saying kick him off the team if he is seriously depressed. that's dangerous can make it worse and can result in the league and team being sued. also, to the guy who said depression means you cant handle life is a bit far considering some dont even know they have it when they do, sometimes i question if i do. It's a dangerous disease and needs close monitoring. that being said, there was a reason i tried to lighten it up with the hookers comment. i dont mean deep or "clinical" depression just an ill void that has yet to be filled. this team lacks a pick me up guy imo, that makes the guys not dwell on loses and poor performance as much, keep the ora up. kind of like all work and no play makes jack a dull boy. leandro needs to do more lionel. i just dont think demar is...
    someone help me out here. uh, he needs simeone to feed off of like he did with sonny. um, ok metaphor time he's on a swing and he's trying to get over the top of the swing set but cant seem to get over without one last push.

  13. #1133
    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Quote akashsingh wrote: View Post
    Being depressed is just an excuse for not being mentally strong enough to handle life, IMO. That being said Im sure Demar has a bunch of resources at his disposal(sports psychologists etc.) that can help him build his self-confidence/resolve w.e. issues are going on up there.

    You're overthinking this though, stop thinking about Demar so much, Im pretty sure he doesn't care what you think.


    p.s. Im in the hammer too! for school. isn't the weed here excellent!
    weed? never heard of it. but, theres some damn wet shit out in winona gets you fucked up rasta-style. there is so many grow ops in this city its insane, we are weed central ontario. fuck we got a political party all about weed cant remember the guys name. hell, we even got a fucking church that uses pot as the holy drug.

  14. #1134
    Raptors Republic All-Star Balls of Steel's Avatar
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    Demar is not depressed. His game though, is depressing.
    “The saving of our world from pending doom will come, not through the complacent adjustment of the conforming majority, but through the creative maladjustment of a nonconforming minority.” - Martin Luther King

  15. #1135
    Raptors Republic Rookie LeeZ's Avatar
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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    He wanted to develop a long range game and a better overall shot. Now while he no doubt improved his shot it's still nowhere near where it needs to be for it to be a reliable tool to be used as anything more than a last option.
    Appolo, I'm going to be kind here and assume you were in an alcoholic (perhaps coke-fuelled) stupor when you wrote this. HE NO DOUBT IMPROVED HIS SHOT????? What are you, on crack??? (o.k., we've covered booze, coke and crack to this point. Don't make me suggest you've been sniffing glue!) In year one, he had a wretched jumper. He would take the ball above his head and almost as far back as behind his neck and FLING or HEAVE the ball at the hoop. Think of a soccer player inbounding the ball, and that was DD's jumper. Then, in year two, presumably after a lot of work with Eric Hughes, his jumper became a thing of (relative) beauty. Gone was the flinging and heaving. His release point was consistent, and consistently at the right spot (just in front of his forehead). Problem solved. Except...early this year I started seeing troubling signs that the flinging had returned. Just on a few shots, mind you. When he was trying athletic moves to set up his jumper, mainly. But now, the flinging and heaving is back, baby! And it's all the time now. Even for his spot-up jumpers. I coach youth basketball, and I've told my team to watch DD in order to learn how NOT to shoot the ball. But it's not just the horrendous mechanics on his jumper that are of concern. As Chisolm noted, it's also his almost pathalogic phobia of contact when he takes it to the hoop. This guy is freakishly athletic, and yet when was the last time he took a running start, had a good plant and just soared to the hoop for a dunk? That attempt against Petro was the first one I can remember ALL SEASON! Another problem is his build. He looks frail out there compared to a lot of the two's in this league. At this point, doesn't look like he'll be able to add any bulk to that skinny frame. And defence? Oh please, don't even get me STARTED! My hope is that he plays stupendously well the rest of the season, corrects his mechanical flaws, starts playing some dee, etc. And then I'd trade him when his market value is highest.

  16. #1136
    Raptors Republic Starter jimmie's Avatar
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    Quote LeeZ wrote: View Post
    But it's not just the horrendous mechanics on his jumper that are of concern. As Chisolm noted, it's also his almost pathalogic phobia of contact when he takes it to the hoop. This guy is freakishly athletic, and yet when was the last time he took a running start, had a good plant and just soared to the hoop for a dunk?
    +100. 90% of Demar's problems could be solved if he just improved in this one area. Dude has his bread and butter and he's gone away from it to try to prove that he's a "well-rounded" SG. Demar, you're not. Not yet, anyway.

    He came in here from USC on the shoulders of his athleticism. Everyone knew he would struggle in those other areas -- long-range shooting, ball-handling, etc. But he was supposed to have Gerald Wallace potential as a slasher, and was supposed to have elite defensive potential based on that same athleticism. Well, the slashing we saw a bit in year 1, but it's been so long now since I saw that as a regular facet of his game that I almost forget he's the guy who totally dominated Blake Griffin in the dunk contest last year (I won't get into how he got screwed, we all saw it).

    He's choosing jumper over drive every time now, even when a simple pump fake would leave him with a wide-open lane for a dunk. I don't think he lacks the size, just the will. If he doesn't fix his jumper and refuses to take it to the hoop, he'll be on the end of someone's bench for the rest of his career. He just doesn't bring enough else to be on the court right now.
    Definition of Statistics: The science of producing unreliable facts from reliable figures.

  17. #1137
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    Quote Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
    We're going to lose are two top 3pointer shooters(Calderon and Barbosa). We're going to something off the bench. DeMar knows his the future at the shooting guard, if we add another young talent it will make him push himself. Prove his worth and if he fails we have a back up plan.
    Does "DeMar Derozan shooting guard" officially qualify as being an oxymoron?

  18. #1138
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    Quote NoPropsneeded wrote: View Post
    you have a point to. these are probably the last of the meaningful comments we'll get on this thread. The posts after this will all be bashes by trolls saying "trade derozan" or bench him.
    Trade Derozan or bench him... couldn't have said it better myself.

  19. #1139
    Raptors Republic All-Star Balls of Steel's Avatar
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    At this point, Demar's game badly needs props (perhaps a clown on a Llama holding a ball).
    “The saving of our world from pending doom will come, not through the complacent adjustment of the conforming majority, but through the creative maladjustment of a nonconforming minority.” - Martin Luther King

  20. #1140
    Raptors Republic Rookie The Fox's Avatar
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    Depression is a personal thing and noone on this forum, unless you no the guy personally, can even discuss whether he is or not.

    Demar is just not that good. Seriously, if he doesn't "get it" by now, he never will. You can't watch someone do the same thing night in and night out and then expect different results. Its insanity.

    If he does come around, than make it permanent. Just no point in giving us flashes and regressing again. I'm personally not a fan of his play and unless he starts attacking consistently than I never will be.

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