Bargnani Trade Idea Thread

[Maleko]

(This will work after April 22nd)

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMa...radeId=3w6njye

Toronto: Thompson, Garcia, SAC first round draft pick
Utah: Bargnani
Denver: Jefferson, Casspi, Alabi
Sacramento: Felton, Mosgov

Why do teams do this?

Utah: Bargnani is an outside shooting big to space the floor. Favors and Millsap can cover his weak areas - this of course assumes Millsap plays SF which they have experiemented with. Utah saves money immediately (luxury tax) and increases cap space going forward.

Denver: Only PF next year is Harrington. Assuming Nene resigns, Jefferson/Nene is a nice front court. Casspi is cheap and unhappy in SAC - they could let one or two of Afflalo, Chandler, or Smith go with a wing to replace him. Alabi belongs with Uriji.

Sacramento: Assuming they don't get #1 and draft Irving, they now have their PG which they have been missing. Mosgov replaces Thompson. They have said they are not looking to add more youth and would be open to trading draft pick.

Toronto: Thompson can come in and start at C. The Raps are going to be lottery bound again next year - sorry folks. Garcia is a solid veteran and defender when healthy. With the SAC pick they could draft Irving and Valanciunas or one of Barnes/Williams and Valanciunas or Irving and one of Barnes/Williams.

What about Calderon as the PG for SAC? Bargnani and Calderon for Jason Thompson, Garcia and pick? They have the cap space, but do they want the defensive liabilities?

How about making this a 3team trade:
Toronto: Thompson, Garcia, SAC pick
Denver: Calderon, Alabi, Barbosa (if needed to juice Denver)
Sacramento: Felton, Bargnani

Do a separate deal with Minny (TPE for Flynn?), or the Philly (TPE for Nocioni and pick) or both?
We then pick Barnes (or Vesely) and Valenciunas (or Kanter).

PG: Bayless, (Flynn or Nolan Smith/Matt's man Josh Selby with Philly pick) <==next year chase Myck Kabongo!! (3/3/(1.5))
SG: Derozan, Garcia (2.6/5.5)
SF: Harrison Barnes, James Johnson, Linus Kleiza (Nocioni) (2/1.8/4.5/(6.8))
PF: Ed Davis, Amir Johnson (2/5.5)
C: Jason Thompson, Jonas Valenciunas/orKanter - flipping to starter in a couple of years. (3/2)
Salary would be at $36.4-43.2M with about 13 players. Reggie Evans says he wants to be back - would he accept $3M? Cheap signings of Daeqan Cook (for Matt), or another guard? We would still be under $50M! Financial flexibility could increase with options after next year on: Bayless, Flynn, Nocioni, and Thompson, the first pass options on ED, Demar, and JJ. We could easily dump/trade one PG, Nocioni, or keep if it all works. EDIT: If we have to keep Barbosa it does not kill us $$-wise still at around $53-56M.

Of course if we get #1 pick and take Irving, use next year pick on a strong SF draft (Gilchrist?) with Johnson, Nocioni and Kleiza this year at SF.

[Maleko]

What about Calderon as the PG for SAC? Bargnani and Calderon for Jason Thompson, Garcia and pick? They have the cap space, but do they want the defensive liabilities?

How about making this a 3team trade:
Toronto: Thompson, Garcia, SAC pick
Denver: Calderon, Alabi, Barbosa (if needed to juice Denver)
Sacramento: Felton, Bargnani

Do a separate deal with Minny (TPE for Flynn?), or the Philly (TPE for Nocioni and pick) or both?
We then pick Barnes (or Vesely) and Valenciunas (or Kanter).

PG: Bayless, (Flynn or Nolan Smith/Matt's man Josh Selby with Philly pick) <==next year chase Myck Kabongo!! (3/3/(1.5))
SG: Derozan, Garcia (2.6/5.5)
SF: Harrison Barnes, James Johnson, Linus Kleiza (Nocioni) (2/1.8/4.5/(6.8))
PF: Ed Davis, Amir Johnson (2/5.5)
C: Jason Thompson, Jonas Valenciunas/orKanter - flipping to starter in a couple of years. (3/2)
Salary would be at $36.4-43.2M with about 13 players. Reggie Evans says he wants to be back - would he accept $3M? Cheap signings of Daeqan Cook (for Matt), or another guard? We would still be under $50M! Financial flexibility could increase with options after next year on: Bayless, Flynn, Nocioni, and Thompson, the first pass options on ED, Demar, and JJ. We could easily dump/trade one PG, Nocioni, or keep if it all works. EDIT: If we have to keep Barbosa it does not kill us $$-wise still at around $53-56M.

Of course if we get #1 pick and take Irving, use next year pick on a strong SF draft (Gilchrist?) with Johnson, Nocioni and Kleiza this year at SF.

The funny thing in this scenario salary-wise is that Nocioni would be the highest paid player on the team for a couple of years (at $6.8M).

[Maleko]

How about making this a 3team trade:
Toronto: Thompson, Garcia, SAC pick
Denver: Calderon, Alabi, Barbosa (if needed to juice Denver)
Sacramento: Felton, Bargnani
.

Sorry forgot to put why teams do this:
Toronto: the SAC pick above all, salary, Jason Thompson as a stop-gap C and longer term backup, Garcia for a backup SG.
Sacramento: scoring to balance with TEvans (they need this) and a floor spreader in Bargnani, the BADLY needed PG in Felton who also cares about defense. Also marketable with young: TEvans/Cousins, international (Bargnani/Casspi).
Denver: Ty Lawson is the man at PG (Felton wants to be traded if not starting), Calderon a solid backup/mentor. Barbosa adds another ball handler and scorer (although streaky), Alabi reunites with the man who discovered him in Masai Ujiri.

[mcHAPPY]

Sorry forgot to put why teams do this:
Toronto: the SAC pick above all, salary, Jason Thompson as a stop-gap C and longer term backup, Garcia for a backup SG.
Sacramento: scoring to balance with TEvans (they need this) and a floor spreader in Bargnani, the BADLY needed PG in Felton who also cares about defense. Also marketable with young: TEvans/Cousins, international (Bargnani/Casspi).
Denver: Ty Lawson is the man at PG (Felton wants to be traded if not starting), Calderon a solid backup/mentor. Barbosa adds another ball handler and scorer (although streaky), Alabi reunites with the man who discovered him in Masai Ujiri.

The idea of the trade definitely works. I think those three teams could come to a deal that works for everyone involved. I do not see Calderon going to Denver - however one could argue with Lawson on his rookie deal for another 2 years (which is how long Calderon's contract runs) it could be do-able. Denver is going to have a pressing concern at C, PF and wings with Nene having a player option, no PF besides Harrington signed for next year, and Afflalo/Smith/Chandler all being FA's. With all those players needing to be re-signed, I wonder if DEN would be happy with getting salary cap relief and younger/cheap prospects in return? Casspi is a player that jumps to mind because i) he is really cheap, and ii) he has made his dissatisfaction in SAC known.

How would something like this look without Calderon:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMa...radeId=3zkq5fr

SAC: Felton, Bargnani
DEN: Casspi, Bayless*, Alabi
TOR: Thompson, Garcia, 1st round pick

Rationale:

SAC gets solid PG and Bargnani to spread the floor for Cousins. Felton, Thorton, Evans, Cousins, Bargnani could be a very good line up (especially with Evans healthy).

DEN saves a lot of money for re-signing their own free agents (specifically Nene and Afflalo), have some leverage with Chandler and Smith (I would say Afflalo but he is a lock to return in my opinion) allowing one to go as Casspi is there to take their place, and would then have enough money to pursue a PF or C - if they signed a true C, Nene could play PF which is better suited to his game anyways, in my opinion. In trading 1 player they receive 3 who would fill out the roster while saving them around $2M off the cap number allowing them to offer free agents more money (very important to consider if a true hardcap comes in).

TOR gets a C for the short term, gets out from the long term commitments of Bargnani's contract, and has a veteran player on the wing coming off the bench who is a good defender and has been plagued by injuries and bad luck recently (exploding exercise ball?). The key would be the draft pick of course - 2 top 5 picks might allow them to get a couple of nice pieces as the top of the draft does have some good players. The * meant that Bayless is only included if Irving or Kemba (or possibly Knight but top 5 would be a bit much for him) was drafted. Calderon would be a good mentor to any young PG and back up minutes might help him prevent the injuries (or he could also be traded in another deal).

[Maleko]

The idea of the trade definitely works. I think those three teams could come to a deal that works for everyone involved. I do not see Calderon going to Denver - however one could argue with Lawson on his rookie deal for another 2 years (which is how long Calderon's contract runs) it could be do-able. Denver is going to have a pressing concern at C, PF and wings with Nene having a player option, no PF besides Harrington signed for next year, and Afflalo/Smith/Chandler all being FA's. With all those players needing to be re-signed, I wonder if DEN would be happy with getting salary cap relief and younger/cheap prospects in return? Casspi is a player that jumps to mind because i) he is really cheap, and ii) he has made his dissatisfaction in SAC known.

How would something like this look without Calderon:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMa...radeId=3zkq5fr

SAC: Felton, Bargnani
DEN: Casspi, Bayless*, Alabi
TOR: Thompson, Garcia, 1st round pick

Rationale:

SAC gets solid PG and Bargnani to spread the floor for Cousins. Felton, Thorton, Evans, Cousins, Bargnani could be a very good line up (especially with Evans healthy).

DEN saves a lot of money for re-signing their own free agents (specifically Nene and Afflalo), have some leverage with Chandler and Smith (I would say Afflalo but he is a lock to return in my opinion) allowing one to go as Casspi is there to take their place, and would then have enough money to pursue a PF or C - if they signed a true C, Nene could play PF which is better suited to his game anyways, in my opinion. In trading 1 player they receive 3 who would fill out the roster while saving them around $2M off the cap number allowing them to offer free agents more money (very important to consider if a true hardcap comes in).

TOR gets a C for the short term, gets out from the long term commitments of Bargnani's contract, and has a veteran player on the wing coming off the bench who is a good defender and has been plagued by injuries and bad luck recently (exploding exercise ball?). The key would be the draft pick of course - 2 top 5 picks might allow them to get a couple of nice pieces as the top of the draft does have some good players. The * meant that Bayless is only included if Irving or Kemba (or possibly Knight but top 5 would be a bit much for him) was drafted. Calderon would be a good mentor to any young PG and back up minutes might help him prevent the injuries (or he could also be traded in another deal).

I could get behind that one as well. I think right now I would prefer keeping Bayless to Calderon because of money and longer term potential, and it does depend upon what Denver would want, and that could be $, but since their performance ex. Melo went strongly who knows. Calderon would also be a change of pace to Lawson, where as Bayless may not be. Calderon COULD be traded in a follow up to another team so we have options, which could net us another pick this year or future. Nene I think is a no danger loss for Denver, but they do need to extend him. He has indicated strongly he wants to stay with the birth of his first child now, and his strong ties in the community. He even hinted in Feb that if he got traded he might either go back to Denver or retire. As for PF there they do have a pick they could draw out a Faried, Tristan Thompson (if he drops), perhaps Biyombo so along with Harrington they should be good. I also agree they prioritize Aflallo, and Chandler is an also ran gonna go. Casspi would be a strong shore-up for them, but they also love Gallinari.

[Maleko]

The key of course is the two top picks, and a backup C (stopgap starter). Backup SG is a nice to have, but if keeping Barbosa then less a priority for one year.

[e2thed]

I say keep Bargs but make him the new Alabi.

[Maleko]

I say keep Bargs but make him the new Alabi.

Ha! If only that wouldn't punish the rest of the team.

[planetmars]

How about a trade with the Nets - Bargs for Lopez & Outlaw. I believe this has to be done after July 1, but Lopez had a bad year, but can be a reliable 18/8 guy for your team. He's not an ideal defensive center, but cannot be as bad as Bargs.

Outlaw's contract is horrible (21mil for next 3 years), but you would need his salaries to work with Bargs, and he could be used as depth for the 3 which we desperately need (especially if we do not sign Weems).

Lopez is young, and when he was a Rook and a Sophomore he was great. I think that whole Carmelo trade saga must have really hurt Lopez's game. I'm not sure if NJ would go for this, but NJ had the 3rd worst offense this year, and could use someone like Bargs. Also the new NJ owner is European and may have seen Bargs game when he was getting interested in the NBA, and could use Bargs to market NJ outside of NA. Could be a stretch, but it might work.

[pesterm1]

[QUOTE=Apollo;73890]I think if Mayo came here one of two scenario's would play out. Either DeMar would switch to the 3 or Mayo would play the point. Mayo has a great handle and has been working on his PG play. Mayo is far more effective when he starts. I think his rhythm is a lot better.

Arthur plays PF and center. He's a good all round player. Like I said, him being in the deal would be about maximizing the value in the deal. You move him later if need be. The team isn't a couple pieces away from a title or anything and so they can afford to do such things.QUOTE]

a trade like this is very likely IMO. were giving up bargnani (1 asset) and gaining Mayo and Arthur (2 assets) thats what this is all about gaining as many assets as we can so that hopefully they improove their value and either keep 1 and/or both of them . if not we have 1 or 2 trading assets later on.

[Maleko]

Ok let's go on assumption that BC truly does not want a 2nd 1st round pick based upon his press conference, and same would therefore go for next year's potential draft picks we can get, and that he does not want to pick a C in the draft (as he stated and as we would want to pick), then two different scenarios assuming we get either DWilliams or Kyrie Irving/Kemba Walker etc.:

Scenario #1:
Draft: Kyrie Irving/Kemba Walker
Sacramento: Bargnani (again spreads the floor, paired with Cousins, 2nd scorer to help TEvans, don't give up much)
Toronto: JThompson and SAC pick (serviceable big and salary)

Memphis: Sac pick, Barbosa (how badly do they want rid of OJ? This might be pick for OJ)
Toronto: OJ Mayo (solid backup 2, can play emergency PG)

Minny: Calderon (HO connections, ties to Rubio, want rid of Flynn)
Toronto: JFlynn and future pick. (salary, outside potential in Flynn, his contract can be gone after next year)

FA Signings: Chase DJordan, MGasol, TChandler at C and Jamaal Magloire as a backup. Chase Wilson Chandler, Thaddeus Young, Afflalo for SF. (can probably get one of Chandler/Afflalo as Denver maybe keeps one, more likely Chandler is the one to get).

PG: KIrving/KWalker(4), Bayless(3), Flynn(3).
SG: Derozan(2.6), Mayo(5.6)
SF: WChandler/TYoung (6), JJohnson(1.8), Kleiza (4.6)
PF: ED(2), Amir(5.5)
C: Chandler/Jordan/Gasol(8-12), JThompson(3), JMagloire(2)
Bench: Alabi(.8), Dorsey resign?(1)

Assuming $12M for a big (~6-8M for DJordan) then salary looks like $56.8M ($52M with DJ) which is at about current cap (therefore we have the money in chasing/signing the free agents.)

[Maleko]

Scenario #2:

Draft: DWilliams (remember the presser: BC loves players that are versatile in their position)
Sacramento: Bargnani (again spreads the floor, paired with Cousins, 2nd scorer to help TEvans, don't give up much)
Toronto: JThompson and SAC pick (serviceable big and salary)

Denver: Sac pick, Barbosa, Alabi
Toronto: RFelton, rights to or S&T Afflalo.

Minny: Calderon (HO connections, ties to Rubio, want rid of Flynn)
Toronto: JFlynn and future pick. (salary, outside potential in Flynn, his contract can be gone after next year)

FA Signings: Chase DJordan, MGasol, TChandler at C and Jamaal Magloire as a backup. Guards: CJ Miles, Daequan Cook

PG: Bayless(3), Felton(7.6), Flynn(3).
SG: Derozan(2.6), Afflalo(5), DCook (3)
SF: Dwilliams (4), JJohnson(1.8), Kleiza (4.6)
PF: ED(2), Amir(5.5)
C: Chandler/Jordan/Gasol(8-12), JThompson(3), JMagloire(2)

Assuming $12M for a big (~6-8M for DJordan) then salary looks like $58.9M ($54M with DJ) which is still at about current cap (therefore we have the money in chasing/signing the free agents C.)

NOTE: This scenario lets Bayless look to shine/grow in the PG spot make or break. Felton will be in final year of contract and TO on Flynn after the year as well. Could draft Myck Kabongo with next year pick? Re-up Felton if he takes over b/c Bayless fails, trade Felton's expring if he doesn't, let him walk to get cap space? We have bigs versatility with Amir/Ed/Thompson, wing to big flex with DWillliams/Kleiza, etc. In Scenario #1 there is more wing/smalls flex with Chandler/Young, Mayo, DD.

Both scenarios assume we get a top 2 pick with either our slot or SAC's.

[Maleko]

PG: KIrving/KWalker(4), Bayless(3), Flynn(3).
SG: Derozan(2.6), Mayo(5.6)
SF: WChandler/TYoung (6), JJohnson(1.8), Kleiza (4.6)
PF: ED(2), Amir(5.5)
C: Chandler/Jordan/Gasol(8-12), JThompson(3), JMagloire(2)
Bench: Alabi(.8), Dorsey resign?(1)

Scenario #2:

PG: Bayless(3), Felton(7.6), Flynn(3).
SG: Derozan(2.6), Afflalo(5), DCook (3)
SF: Dwilliams (4), JJohnson(1.8), Kleiza (4.6)
PF: ED(2), Amir(5.5)
C: Chandler/Jordan/Gasol(8-12), JThompson(3), JMagloire(2)

Bigs: Both cases we get some nice punch you in the mouth defense in the paint, and depth to bolster fouls/injuries/matchups with moderate scoring, but will plug some serious holes in the team and defense.
Wings: potential for points in both scenarios, matchup choices, etc. Defensively we are strong in both scenarios with Afflalo, Chandler, Mayo. Development in DD and JJ.
3pters: SC1: Bayless, Mayo, Kleiza and maybe WChandler. DD still needs to develop this summer. Potential.
3pters: SC2: Bayless, DWilliams, DCook, Afflalo, Kleiza. DD still needs to develop this summer.
PGs: Young and dangerous (both on good side and bad) in SC1. SC2 we have some vet leadership, defense, and options.

Overall we get better in defense, salary$, ball handling, and arguably scoring with added bench depth. Importantly we improve on 3pt shooting as well.

[Mr.Grinch]

All these proposals are horrible. We shouldn't trade bargnani just for the sake of trading him.

[Maleko]

All these proposals are horrible. We shouldn't trade bargnani just for the sake of trading him.

They are hardly horrible, and would make the team better in virtually all, if not all, scenarios presented.