Page 3 of 10 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 ... LastLast
Results 41 to 60 of 181

Thread: Report Cards

  1. #41
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    2,183
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    You disagree?

    ADD Does ANYONE disagree with this assessment for Bargnani's Defense?
    Here we go, I'm backing out now

  2. #42
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    2,183
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Tim W. wrote: View Post
    Multipaul,

    I really don't understand what you have against Amir. The majority of fans and writers said he was the Raptors MVP at the All-Star break, and the only reason they wouldn't say so now is because of DeRozan's play of late and because of Amir's injury. He's easily the team's most productive player, and helps the team on both ends of the court. And to say the guy is overpaid is ridiculous. Just looking at his PER, he's well above average, yet he's making less than the average salary.

    No one denies that Bargnani is a very good offensive player, but even you have to admit he's only useful half the time he's on the court. So if he plays 36 minutes, for approximately 18 minutes he not only doesn't help the team, but hurts it. I don't know how you can realistically give him anything more than a C.

    Amir may only play 26 minutes a game, but he's useful and productive for all those 26 mpg. That's why he gets a higher grade than Bargnani.
    I said Amir DESERVES his grade.

  3. #43
    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    7,542
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Multipaul wrote: View Post
    Here we go, I'm backing out now
    "Here we go"?

    You can't even answer my question?

    What would you rate Bargnani's Defense?

  4. #44
    Raptors Republic Superstar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    4,942
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Multipaul wrote: View Post
    I said Amir DESERVES his grade.
    But you're bashing Amir is order to show how Bargnani deserves a better grade. Most people seem to feel that Amir is a more productive player and helps the team more than Bargnani does. And these grades backs that up.
    Read my blog, The Picket Fence. Guaranteed to make you think or your money back!
    Follow me on Twitter.

  5. #45
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    2,183
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Tim W. wrote: View Post
    But you're bashing Amir is order to show how Bargnani deserves a better grade. Most people seem to feel that Amir is a more productive player and helps the team more than Bargnani does. And these grades backs that up.
    You think Bargs deserves a C? He has been our go to guy all year, like it or not. Hasn't missed many games, still got 5.2 rebs, blocks shots, draws charges. Bad help D, pretty good man D. I think he at least deserves the same grade as Amir.

  6. #46
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    2,183
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    "Here we go"?

    You can't even answer my question?

    What would you rate Bargnani's Defense?
    Defense- C (better man to man, bad help d), average rebounder, good at drawing charges and altering shots.

    Offense- A- look at the stats, inside outside game, you name it

    Grade- B/B-, same as Amir ,like I said.

    D- on D is too harsh, sorry. That's your personal opinion, not based on fact

  7. #47
    Raptors Republic Superstar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    4,942
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Multipaul wrote: View Post
    You think Bargs deserves a C? He has been our go to guy all year, like it or not. Hasn't missed many games, still got 5.2 rebs, blocks shots, draws charges. Bad help D, pretty good man D. I think he at least deserves the same grade as Amir.
    As I said, Bargnani has been very good offensively, but poor in all other aspects. He got 5.2 rpg, which is extremely poor, he blocks some shots and draws some charges, yes, but he's still and incredibly poor help defender and below average man defender. Going by how many productive minutes each one plays, yes, I think Amir deserves a better grade than Bargnani. As I said, Amir plays 26 productive minutes per game and Bargnani about 18. I just think you're vastly underestimating how little Bargnani does outside of score.
    Read my blog, The Picket Fence. Guaranteed to make you think or your money back!
    Follow me on Twitter.

  8. #48
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    2,183
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Tim W. wrote: View Post
    As I said, Bargnani has been very good offensively, but poor in all other aspects. He got 5.2 rpg, which is extremely poor, he blocks some shots and draws some charges, yes, but he's still and incredibly poor help defender and below average man defender. Going by how many productive minutes each one plays, yes, I think Amir deserves a better grade than Bargnani. As I said, Amir plays 26 productive minutes per game and Bargnani about 18. I just think you're vastly underestimating how little Bargnani does outside of score.
    For a center, 5.2 rpg is low, BUT, I believe his scoring is much higher than most centres. How many teams in the NBA have a C who is the leading scorer?

  9. #49
    Raptors Republic Superstar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    4,942
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Multipaul wrote: View Post
    Defense- C (better man to man, bad help d), average rebounder, good at drawing charges and altering shots.

    Offense- A- look at the stats, inside outside game, you name it

    Grade- B/B-, same as Amir ,like I said.

    D- on D is too harsh, sorry. That's your personal opinion, not based on fact
    Sorry, but you can't argue that Bargnani is an average rebounder. He's one of the worst rebounding big men in the league.

    As for his defense, he blocks a shot a game, but he's not good at altering shots. He doesn't intimidate or change shots. It's just once in a while he'll block a shot, but usually he surprises a player doing that. It's also because teams tend to challenge him, which actually makes it easier for him to block shots.

    As for his man defense, it's still not good. He'll have one decent game out of 20. He consistently allows his opponent to be more productive than usual. That's the most simple way of illustrating that.
    Read my blog, The Picket Fence. Guaranteed to make you think or your money back!
    Follow me on Twitter.

  10. #50
    Raptors Republic Superstar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    4,942
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Multipaul wrote: View Post
    For a center, 5.2 rpg is low, BUT, I believe his scoring is much higher than most centres. How many teams in the NBA have a C who is the leading scorer?
    Again, no one is denying his impact on offense. He's a very good offensive player. But it's only half the game. If a guy played excellent defense, but was as bad on offense as Bargnani is on defense, he'd get a C, too.
    Read my blog, The Picket Fence. Guaranteed to make you think or your money back!
    Follow me on Twitter.

  11. #51
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    11,988
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Multipaul wrote: View Post
    For a center, 5.2 rpg is low, BUT, I believe his scoring is much higher than most centres. How many teams in the NBA have a C who is the leading scorer?
    Bargnani is second in scoring among centers but 14th in efficiency. I can live with that because of his style of offense, it's to be expected. He takes more shots than any center in the league by the way; four more than the leading scorer at center, Dwight Howard. Bargnani is 24th in rebounding among centers and 32nd in double doubles. One of the worst defensive starting centers in the league. That 21PPG(.448 FG%) can only carry so much weight.

    One thing that's underrated about his offense is his ability to get to the line. Compared to anyone but D12 he holds his own.

  12. #52
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    2,183
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Tim W. wrote: View Post
    Again, no one is denying his impact on offense. He's a very good offensive player. But it's only half the game. If a guy played excellent defense, but was as bad on offense as Bargnani is on defense, he'd get a C, too.
    There is a point to what i'm saying. They lean on him to be the lead scorer, perhaps that takes some energy away from the REBS. He is not built like D Howard, and is def not a traditional C. For a C to be scoring off drives, 3 balls, etc, is atyipcal. It is also atypical for team to make their C the #1 option unless his last name is Howard.

  13. #53
    Raptors Republic Superstar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    4,942
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Multipaul wrote: View Post
    There is a point to what i'm saying. They lean on him to be the lead scorer, perhaps that takes some energy away from the REBS. He is not built like D Howard, and is def not a traditional C. For a C to be scoring off drives, 3 balls, etc, is atyipcal. It is also atypical for team to make their C the #1 option unless his last name is Howard.
    That argument might work if Bargnani was ever a decent rebounder. He's always been bad, even when he wasn't required to score.

    As for his role on offensive, I don't understand your argument. Bargnani is the #1 option because he's a good offensive player on a bad team. If a center isn't a good offensive player, you don't make him the #1 option. And when a center is good offensively, he's also had to do things like rebound and play defense. Yao Ming, Tim Duncan (if you count him as a center), Shaq, when he was younger, and then of course guys like Hakeem, Ewing and Robinson.

    Bargnani being the #1 option on offense as an excuse to why his rebounding or defense isn't good is just that. An excuse. The fact is that he's NEVER been good in those areas, so trying to say they're bad now because of his role on offensive doesn't make sense. It's like saying that the reason I'm not playing in the NBA now is because I'm too old and I've got bad knees. If course, even when I was younger without the bad knees, I still wasn't in the NBA.
    Read my blog, The Picket Fence. Guaranteed to make you think or your money back!
    Follow me on Twitter.

  14. #54
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    2,183
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Tim W. wrote: View Post
    That argument might work if Bargnani was ever a decent rebounder. He's always been bad, even when he wasn't required to score.

    As for his role on offensive, I don't understand your argument. Bargnani is the #1 option because he's a good offensive player on a bad team. If a center isn't a good offensive player, you don't make him the #1 option. And when a center is good offensively, he's also had to do things like rebound and play defense. Yao Ming, Tim Duncan (if you count him as a center), Shaq, when he was younger, and then of course guys like Hakeem, Ewing and Robinson.

    Bargnani being the #1 option on offense as an excuse to why his rebounding or defense isn't good is just that. An excuse. The fact is that he's NEVER been good in those areas, so trying to say they're bad now because of his role on offensive doesn't make sense. It's like saying that the reason I'm not playing in the NBA now is because I'm too old and I've got bad knees. If course, even when I was younger without the bad knees, I still wasn't in the NBA.
    no

  15. #55
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Burlington Ontario
    Posts
    749
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Multipaul wrote: View Post
    NO, but I think if Bargs gets a C, but Barbo and Amir get B-'s, something is messed up. He is our #1 scorer and contributes alot. He should get a B or B- too. Ed should get an A. Demar deserves that B.
    no he sucks. Alabi contributes more than bargnani and he doesn't even get playing time. Demar deserves a B? Demar in the last 7 games has put up 24+ point and has played great Defence. Bargnani isn't playing because they want to rest him for the trade. I doubt he has anything wrong with knee or whatever. Once this guy leaves you guys will finally shut up.

  16. #56
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    2,183
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Raptors_ wrote: View Post
    no he sucks. Alabi contributes more than bargnani and he doesn't even get playing time. Demar deserves a B? Demar in the last 7 games has put up 24+ point and has played great Defence. Bargnani isn't playing because they want to rest him for the trade. I doubt he has anything wrong with knee or whatever. Once this guy leaves you guys will finally shut up.
    no

  17. #57
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Burlington Ontario
    Posts
    749
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Multipaul wrote: View Post
    There is a point to what i'm saying. They lean on him to be the lead scorer, perhaps that takes some energy away from the REBS. He is not built like D Howard, and is def not a traditional C. For a C to be scoring off drives, 3 balls, etc, is atyipcal. It is also atypical for team to make their C the #1 option unless his last name is Howard.
    We don't "lean" on him. If we wanted to we could stop giving the ball to bargnani soo much and give it to demar or someone else who can actually score efficiently. Bargnani is a chucker, he throws up shots and scores 20 points on 30 shots.

  18. #58
    Raptors Republic Starter pesterm1's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    768
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Multipaul, these grades should be based on a players personal developement IMO and not compared to how the toher players did. Bargs was put out there to be the number one guy and he did play well but not like the number one. bargs effort wasnt there all season and for anyone to say it was they are only kidding themselves. a preformance like we have been seeing from DD lately is getting a little closer to playing like a leader and a number one option(though he may never become the num.1 option). Based on this season bargs was probably expected to have a better season but due to injuries and toher variable that 3was not the case. in regaurds to barbosa, u have a guy with a messed up wrist who champed it out all season had some good games had some okay games but u could tell he played hard, always hustled, was a leader, and although it not his best season thats why he didint get a better grade. Bargs played well but not where i thought he could have been. he just needs to hustle more out there and people will stop coplaining i tihnk. when u see all the other players hustling and bargs looking like he doesnt care its easy to notice. something i noticed is the To loves hard working, blue collarplayers and bargs is not that. the other players on the roster show attributes of hustle and dedication and thats why fans love them. the Bargnani era is slowing down and next year it may pick up but if it keeps going the way it is i tihnk bags will be gone next deadline. right nwo raps are in a unique possition because by tnext year or the year following trade deadline we will have alot of nice young pieces to use as bait for getting players in trades. future looks
    exciting.

  19. #59
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    11,988
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Multipaul wrote: View Post
    There is a point to what i'm saying. They lean on him to be the lead scorer, perhaps that takes some energy away from the REBS. He is not built like D Howard, and is def not a traditional C. For a C to be scoring off drives, 3 balls, etc, is atyipcal. It is also atypical for team to make their C the #1 option unless his last name is Howard.
    Why doesn't it slow down Dwight Howard? Dwight is in the paint all night slugging out on offense drawing more contact than anyone else in the league, is taking four less shots per game than Bargnani but is getting to the line six more times a game. Dwight just happens to be one of the most imposing defensive forces in the league.

  20. #60
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    2,183
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote pesterm1 wrote: View Post
    Multipaul, these grades should be based on a players personal developement IMO and not compared to how the toher players did. Bargs was put out there to be the number one guy and he did play well but not like the number one. bargs effort wasnt there all season and for anyone to say it was they are only kidding themselves. a preformance like we have been seeing from DD lately is getting a little closer to playing like a leader and a number one option(though he may never become the num.1 option). Based on this season bargs was probably expected to have a better season but due to injuries and toher variable that 3was not the case. in regaurds to barbosa, u have a guy with a messed up wrist who champed it out all season had some good games had some okay games but u could tell he played hard, always hustled, was a leader, and although it not his best season thats why he didint get a better grade. Bargs played well but not where i thought he could have been. he just needs to hustle more out there and people will stop coplaining i tihnk. when u see all the other players hustling and bargs looking like he doesnt care its easy to notice. something i noticed is the To loves hard working, blue collarplayers and bargs is not that. the other players on the roster show attributes of hustle and dedication and thats why fans love them. the Bargnani era is slowing down and next year it may pick up but if it keeps going the way it is i tihnk bags will be gone next deadline. right nwo raps are in a unique possition because by tnext year or the year following trade deadline we will have alot of nice young pieces to use as bait for getting players in trades. future looks
    exciting.
    Well, right there you validated my argument. The article wasnt based on reality, it was based on the writer's perception of each person individually, and where he though they should be. Thats like saying "Amir is not as good as Bargs, so we rate him on a lower scale,cuz we dont expect him to be as good, so he gets a B-...but Bargs, he should be rated on a higher scale cuz he's better then everyone else"

Page 3 of 10 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 ... LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •