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Thread: Chad Ford Mock Draft 1.0: Raptors select Enes Kanter (Enes v Jonas starts post #139)

  1. #101
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    Quote grindhouse wrote: View Post
    listen I am not saying don't draft the kid period under no circumstances, I am just extremely concerned about 1. drafting a 18 year old 2. drafting someone that hasn't played in a year for *cough* taking money he is not suppose to 3. has whispers about knee issues and 4. "may" end up having conflicts with the core group we are trying to build around.
    1. How does his young age play negatively? Do you see teams going after 22 year old college seniors because they're older and have played longer? I get the sense of what you're trying to say here, but it's not his age but lack of playing time/experience. As long as he has the ability, who cares how young he is?

    2. I don't know why you're coughing like Kanter did something immoral or taboo. Kanter's ban was purely a technical point that because he had been paid more than the minimum living expenses back when he was playing for a professional club, he was considered a professional player and ineligible for the NCAA. It was different from the majority of cases where a player accepted money to play for a certain school or to provide an NBA team some kind of advantage over another. Would you make as big a stink had he made the money mowing lawns all year at age 16? It was a job, and he was paid for it, and unfortunately it was basketball-related so it made him a professional.

    3. I think you're old enough to know the difference between rumor and fact, right? I'm not saying he definitely doesn't have knee issues, but instead of relying on "whispers" like some high schooler listening to Monday morning rumors about who put what in whose hooha over the weekend, why don't we just wait for when the draft prospects go through their medical checkups.

    4. You must be an unusually sensitive individual to care so much about such potential conflicts. There's a big difference between not wanting a player (i.e. Beasley) because he's a nut case, and not wanting a player because he might not end up best friends with our myriad of non-franchise players.

    Quote grindhouse wrote: View Post
    Whether you guys like it or not there has been problems in the locker room when it comes to culture, I didn't put it there so don't get upset at me for bringing it up as a concern BC was the person who came out and said there were/are issues.
    We're not getting upset at you, just rolling our eyes because you take one piece of information and completely blow it out of proportion. It's no different from if I inferred from your parents not being 100% happy their entire lives, that it was because you were a mistake. See what I mean about blowing things out of proportion? The only concern we have is with our losing culture. As long as Kanter is a hard worker, who gives a rat ass about anything else?

    Quote grindhouse wrote: View Post
    Also we have had one of the worst cases of bad luck I have seen when it comes to injuries it's getting pretty stupid at this point so forgive me for being critical.
    Really? You must not have seen much. In fact, what bad luck have we really had? Bosh getting his face broken. Reggie getting injured both years. Davis getting injured before the season. What else? TJ Ford and the other Bosh injuries don't count. It's not so much bad luck as much as it is the players themselves. Heck, Milwaukee has it even worse if you consider that they constantly lose Bogut to injury, and Redd hasn't been the same since his injury. Or if you want real bad luck, how about Portland losing their intended new franchise player (Oden) for the entire first season, as well as much of the following seasons, then finding out their new franchise player (Roy) no longer has cartilage in his knees? Or even worse, look at the Clippers' history, and I don't mean just the last couple seasons. If you've ever heard about the Clipper's curse, it's because their injury history makes a very strong case for there being a curse. I think most people were betting on Griffin getting injured as a result, and look, he was out for a year! The Raptors' injuries only seem like a big deal to you because you're not following all the other teams.

  2. #102
    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    That was a great post.
    "I just dunked. Got a little dunk. Thatís nice." Terrence Ross

  3. #103
    Raptors Republic All-Star grindhouse's Avatar
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    Gm's in the beginning took young player's because they were freaks of nature, like with any business organization tried to copy business models to replicate success. After the Iphone was created how many companies tried to copy their success and failed. There are those who set trends and those who follow.

    don't over hype the young man because the reality is he has not played for a entire year. There has been players in this draft who have improved from the previous season which makes its impossible to judge his progression or lack there of against his peers, kentucky played uconn twice and obviously kanter was not there so you can not know how his help side defense equates vs a guard like kemba. Hoop summit is good for seeing prospects but quite honestly it is a pick up game.

    If players can not play due to constantly injury that is a problem to say anything otherwise is absurd.
    Last edited by grindhouse; Wed May 11th, 2011 at 09:48 PM.

  4. #104
    Raptors Republic All-Star grindhouse's Avatar
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    at the end of the day everyone has their own opinions

  5. #105
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    Quote grindhouse wrote: View Post
    listen I am not saying don't draft the kid period under no circumstances, I am just extremely concerned about 1. drafting a 18 year old 2. drafting someone that hasn't played in a year for *cough* taking money he is not suppose to 3. has whispers about knee issues and 4. "may" end up having conflicts with the core group we are trying to build around.

    Whether you guys like it or not there has been problems in the locker room when it comes to culture, I didn't put it there so don't get upset at me for bringing it up as a concern BC was the person who came out and said there were/are issues.

    Also we have had one of the worst cases of bad luck I have seen when it comes to injuries it's getting pretty stupid at this point so forgive me for being critical.

    forgive me once again, "fundamentally sound (which makes up for a lot)" this is the NBA, not college (which he didn't play in), not high school, or nike hoop summit for someone who is not very athletic at 6'10 in the NBA he better be able to create separation.
    Maybe we think differently but, to me, the fact that he's only 18, yet has the build he does and is as polished as he is is a big, big plus.

    The issue with Kanter "taking" money is a complete non-issue, as some basic investigation will discover.

    His "knee issues" have NEVER seemed to been backed up by any evidence. The best I can seem to figure out is he suffered from some tendonitis one year in high school, which is very little to be concerned about.

    As for the lockeroom issues, if anyone has a problem with drafting Kanter because he's European, then THEY should be traded because obviously winning is not paramount to them. Winners don't care where you're from, as long as you can help them win.
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  6. #106
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    Quote grindhouse wrote: View Post
    Gm's in the beginning took young player's because they were freaks of nature, like with any business organization tried to copy business models to replicate success. After the Iphone was created how many companies tried to copy their success and failed. There are those who set trends and those who follow.

    don't over hype the young man because the reality is he has not played for a entire year. There has been players in this draft who have improved from the previous season which makes its impossible to judge his progression or lack there of against his peers, kentucky played uconn twice and obviously kanter was not there so you can not know how his help side defense equates vs a guard like kemba. Hoop summit is good for seeing prospects but quite honestly it is a pick up game.

    If players can not play due to constantly injury that is a problem to say anything otherwise is absurd.
    Your first paragraph is just... yeah, enough said.

    As for the second, I'm definitely not over-hyping him. I've been all about seeing how he does in workouts and medicals. I haven't made up anything in my head to argue for him (cough "but he might not be BFFs with the Young Gunz" cough), as you have in yours to argue against him. And I don't think I have mentioned even once the Hoop Summit.

    And your last bit... "If players can not play due to constantly injury that is a problem to say anything otherwise is absurd"... again, I really don't know where you are pulling these things out of. Where has Kanter not been able to play due to constant injuries?

    BTW, if players can not play due to being in jail, that is a problem and to say anything otherwise is absurd.

    Yeah, I know it's completely off-topic and irrelevant but it seems to be the theme of the day.

  7. #107
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    Quote grindhouse wrote: View Post
    listen I am not saying don't draft the kid period under no circumstances, I am just extremely concerned about 1. drafting a 18 year old 2. drafting someone that hasn't played in a year for *cough* taking money he is not suppose to 3. has whispers about knee issues and 4. "may" end up having conflicts with the core group we are trying to build around.

    Whether you guys like it or not there has been problems in the locker room when it comes to culture, I didn't put it there so don't get upset at me for bringing it up as a concern BC was the person who came out and said there were/are issues.

    Also we have had one of the worst cases of bad luck I have seen when it comes to injuries it's getting pretty stupid at this point so forgive me for being critical.

    forgive me once again, "fundamentally sound (which makes up for a lot)" this is the NBA, not college (which he didn't play in), not high school, or nike hoop summit for someone who is not very athletic at 6'10 in the NBA he better be able to create separation.
    You facts are all speculation sorry.. the money taken was like 400 bucks his dad received to pay basic expenses from the source i saw. you make it sound like he did something horrible and sneaky. Look at the video of Capilari a few pages back. he was digusted at the NCAA decision to not let Enes play.

  8. #108
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    Quote grindhouse wrote: View Post
    lol
    ... whats funny ? :S lol

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    Quote grindhouse wrote: View Post
    Gm's in the beginning took young player's because they were freaks of nature, like with any business organization tried to copy business models to replicate success. After the Iphone was created how many companies tried to copy their success and failed. There are those who set trends and those who follow.

    don't over hype the young man because the reality is he has not played for a entire year. There has been players in this draft who have improved from the previous season which makes its impossible to judge his progression or lack there of against his peers, kentucky played uconn twice and obviously kanter was not there so you can not know how his help side defense equates vs a guard like kemba. Hoop summit is good for seeing prospects but quite honestly it is a pick up game.

    If players can not play due to constantly injury that is a problem to say anything otherwise is absurd.
    Who won rookie of the year this year? he missed a whole year and preformed amazing, so did ed davis. Kanter wasnt out becfause of injury so i dont think its a big deal. he still played and practiced and is staying in shape. a training camp and he will be fine.

  10. #110
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    Quote pesterm1 wrote: View Post
    Who won rookie of the year this year? he missed a whole year and preformed amazing, so did ed davis. Kanter wasnt out becfause of injury so i dont think its a big deal. he still played and practiced and is staying in shape. a training camp and he will be fine.
    Very good point. I had not thought of it in those terms i.e. no injury.

    I am very impressed by the shredding to 258lbs with the goal of adding another 7-12 pounds of muscle to play at 265-270. The guy already has an NBA body.

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    I also like the fact that he said "I can play center and power forward"....center came first, so I think he knows that may be his listed position, but will have opportunities to slide over with his range and mobility.

  12. #112
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    Quote WJF wrote: View Post
    I also like the fact that he said "I can play center and power forward"....center came first, so I think he knows that may be his listed position, but will have opportunities to slide over with his range and mobility.
    To put him in a little more perspective:

    Imagine Al Jefferson could dunk from the foul line.

    Both are around the same size.
    Both have polished post game.
    Both have range on their jumper.
    Kanter can dunk from just inside foul line.

  13. #113
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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    Did you watch those Videos of him posted above? You're saying this guy is non-athletic? Not sure I agree with that at all.

    What do you mean by 'existing seperation' in the locker room?
    People, people. Kanter could indeed turn out to be a solid pick but don't let some independant workout video's make you think he's the next coming of K. Jabbar. lol

    He's not playing against anyone. Many players look like superstars when they are shooting around in the gym. I actually do like the way his shot looks and that he can dunk from inside the ft line but there's no KG in front of him while he''s trying to do those things. We gotta temper the enthusiasm sometimes.

  14. #114
    Raptors Republic Starter jeff_hostetler's Avatar
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    To put him in a little more perspective:

    Imagine Al Jefferson could dunk from the foul line.

    Both are around the same size.
    Both have polished post game.
    Both have range on their jumper.
    But Jefferson is not very good defensively. I would hope that if the Raps drafted Kanter he'd be a significant upgrade over Jefferson at the defensive end. He doesn't have to be elite, but I'd want him to be good.

    People, people. Kanter could indeed turn out to be a solid pick but don't let some independant workout video's make you think he's the next coming of K. Jabbar. lol

    He's not playing against anyone...
    I think everyone realises that and is focusing not on the fact that his shots are going in, but on his form, size and mobility, which remain the same regardless of defensive presence.

    As I said before, I'm actually not that impressed with his mobility. He seems all kindsa slow and deliberate, which could be because he's focusing on his form, or could just be because he's all kindsa slow and deliberate.

    One thing's for sure: the Raps need a big solid dude to close the lanes, and Kanter is most definitely a big solid dude.
    Last edited by jeff_hostetler; Thu May 12th, 2011 at 10:09 AM.

  15. #115
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    To put him in a little more perspective:

    Imagine Al Jefferson could dunk from the foul line.

    Both are around the same size.
    Both have polished post game.
    Both have range on their jumper.
    Kanter can dunk from just inside foul line.
    So you are comparing him to A. Jefferson at this point? lol

    Both are around the same size indeed. Jefferson has a polished NBA post up game but we are not sure what Kanter has. Jefferson has range on his jumper as he's proven in the NBA, we don't know what Kanter has. Kanter can dunk inside the foul line in practice with no body in fornt of him or during a game situation.

    Man, I hope Kanter is as good as everyone thinks he is, cause he's going to have much expectations if he gets drafted here. He has potential but he's certainly not a finished product or even tested player yet. The way things are going he'll be expected ROY by June.

  16. #116
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    Default Kanter

    NBA Comparison: Al Horford
    Source: NBAdraft.net

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    Quote jeff_hostetler wrote: View Post
    But Jefferson is not very good defensively. I would hope that if the Raps drafted Kanter he'd be a significant upgrade over Jefferson at the defensive end. He doesn't have to be elite, but I'd want him to be good.
    Jefferson, while not good, is better than the Raps current C - not saying much I know. Plus he had an ACL tear and, from what I've read, he is only starting to get his true mobility back recently so the last two seasons are not a true indication of his abilities - or lackthereof - in my opinion.

    Another issue would be the body type - Kanter appears solid whereas Jefferson came to camp last year a little plump shall we say.

    This is from last year but seems promising:

    Defensively, Kanter had some excellent possessions in practice, coming up with some blocks by being a step ahead of the play and contesting shots with his positioning, rather than his athleticism. His body helps him fight for position on the block, and his physical nature allowed him to deny penetration when his man attempted to take him off the dribble. Once the shot goes up, Kanter does a nice job of sealing off his man and pursuing the ball. Though his ability to rebound outside of his area wasn’t as apparent as it was in junior play, he’s still, more often than not, the player coming down with the ball in a crowd.

    From DraftExpress.com http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/...#ixzz1M9DIujJW
    http://www.draftexpress.com

  18. #118
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    Default Up close

    Next week all 30 NBA teams will convene in Chicago to evaluate most of the top players in this year's draft class. While the official NBA Draft Combine has been stripped of virtually all competitive on-court action in recent years, NBA teams still place great stock in the combine for other reasons.

    In addition to athletic measurements and testing, along with some light on-court drills, every player is put through an official NBA physical, which is dispersed to all 30 teams. Further, players are available for private interviews with NBA teams, which are a noteworthy part of the evaluation process for many.
    Participants List for the 2011 NBA Draft Combine:
    Enes Kanter, Kentucky
    Source: DraftExpress.com

    Next week you'll have his official up to date measurements, videos of him getting interviewed and film of him playing.

  19. #119
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    Quote sleepz wrote: View Post
    So you are comparing him to A. Jefferson at this point? lol

    Both are around the same size indeed. Jefferson has a polished NBA post up game but we are not sure what Kanter has. Jefferson has range on his jumper as he's proven in the NBA, we don't know what Kanter has. Kanter can dunk inside the foul line in practice with no body in fornt of him or during a game situation.

    Man, I hope Kanter is as good as everyone thinks he is, cause he's going to have much expectations if he gets drafted here. He has potential but he's certainly not a finished product or even tested player yet. The way things are going he'll be expected ROY by June.
    Offensively, yes I was comparing him to Jefferson. I should have mentioned that.

    Whoever gets drafted here will have expectations and they will most likely be unrealistic.

  20. #120
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Offensively, yes I was comparing him to Jefferson. I should have mentioned that.

    Whoever gets drafted here will have expectations and they will most likely be unrealistic.
    Well I hope he develops as you've planned as Jefferson is an accomplished NBA player who's had scoring seasons as high as 23ppg. Although on a bad team at the time, he's proven himself and his scoring abilities at the highest level of competition.

    Let's see what you got Enes cause your getting some hefty comparisons right now.

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