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  1. #41
    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    doesn't help we don't really have a shot blocker behind him to clean up.
    @jerboat

  2. #42
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    I can see it now, "finally, we've gotten rid of Bargnani and now the defense can thrive around the rim. No, wait a second, Vesley can't keep up with his shadow... Damn it."

    I think they need to take the best player available and it looks like the Kanter, Walker, Knight and Leonard are all better players right now and they all have high upside.

  3. #43
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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    Trying only gets you half way. My worry is that, as you mentioned, he's not going to be fast enough on his feet to defend the 3. If he's getting ISO'd and exposed in Europe then he's going to get crushed in the NBA. Then on the flip side he can't handle the ball that well and he can't shoot that well. He's going to need others to get him opportunities. That's a really big problem considering they have few guys already who can handle well and they already have a bunch of forwards who can't shoot and need somebody to set them up to get points other than put backs, tips and other choppy stuff around the basket. If they draft him there will be "Trade Vesley" threads and new "fire Colangelo" threads before the end of November. Book it. He's on the other end of the spectrum in terms of "instant gratification". Dude looks like a project.
    Oh yeah, he's definitely not a good fit for the Raptors. I can see him being a very good pick for another team but not for us.

  4. #44
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Does anyone else think Chad Ford is pinning him on the Raptors at #5 because of this "the Raptors always draft international players" American bias?

  5. #45
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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    Trying only gets you half way. My worry is that, as you mentioned, he's not going to be fast enough on his feet to defend the 3. If he's getting ISO'd and exposed in Europe then he's going to get crushed in the NBA. Then on the flip side he can't handle the ball that well and he can't shoot that well. He's going to need others to get him opportunities. That's a really big problem considering they have few guys already who can handle well and they already have a bunch of forwards who can't shoot and need somebody to set them up to get points other than put backs, tips and other choppy stuff around the basket. If they draft him there will be "Trade Vesley" threads and new "fire Colangelo" threads before the end of November. Book it. He's on the other end of the spectrum in terms of "instant gratification". Dude looks like a project.
    Agreed, and the same concern I would have with Derrick Williams.

  6. #46
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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    I can see it now, "finally, we've gotten rid of Bargnani and now the defense can thrive around the rim. No, wait a second, Vesley can't keep up with his shadow... Damn it."

    I think they need to take the best player available and it looks like the Kanter, Walker, Knight and Leonard are all better players right now and they all have high upside.
    But at least his Wins Produced stat would look much better than Bargnani's.

    I'm not sure how high I should be on Leonard. He benefited greatly from all the players electing to return to college; he was pretty much a mid-first round/late lottery pick before that, and now he's considered as high as 4th overall. If we did pick Leonard 5th, I have a feeling people are going to forget how weak this draft is and expect him to be the next Gerald Wallace or bust.

  7. #47
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Well, I think he's more ready to roll than Vesley is. I think there will be a much more polished player there than both those guys. At least one of Walker, Knight and Kanter will be there at #5.

  8. #48
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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    Does anyone else think Chad Ford is pinning him on the Raptors at #5 because of this "the Raptors always draft international players" American bias?
    Perhaps. It's a really stupid bias but can you really blame them for this "American bias", considering the crazy number of Canadians who perpetuate the over-exaggeration as well? I actually thought there was a vast difference between Canadians and Americans (I've spent considerable time in both countries), but that gap seems to narrow quite a bit amongst sports fans. =P


    And pleeeease, let us have Kanter. Even if he disappoints, I'd be fine with it; if you're going to take a risk, might as well be at the toughest position to fill.

  9. #49
    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    I'd take singleton over leonard
    @jerboat

  10. #50
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    Quote ceez wrote: View Post
    I'd take singleton over leonard
    I'd trade down for two lottery picks to do that. =P

  11. #51
    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    Well yeah
    @jerboat

  12. #52
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    Quote Quixotic wrote: View Post
    I'd trade down for two lottery picks to do that. =P
    Yup agree.

  13. #53
    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    Malcolm Lee and Singleton
    @jerboat

  14. #54
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Quote Quixotic wrote: View Post
    I'd trade down for two lottery picks to do that. =P
    Not me. This draft is tricky enough as it is. At least at #5 they have a strong chance of getting the pick right.

    I wouldn't be against them buying a later pick to take a guy like Tyler Honeycutt but beyond that, no thanks. I don't think Colangelo will add another pick given he traded his other #1 away for JJ.

  15. #55
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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    Not me. This draft is tricky enough as it is. At least at #5 they have a strong chance of getting the pick right.

    I wouldn't be against them buying a later pick to take a guy like Tyler Honeycutt but beyond that, no thanks. I don't think Colangelo will add another pick given he traded his other #1 away for JJ.
    Oh, I'm not saying we should trade down. I've actually been quite adamant that we not trade down or out of this draft. I only meant that between Leonard and Singleton (if for some reason we could only pick Leonard or trade down), I'd be okay with going for quantity and more chances to find gold in this draft.

    And I don't think trading away our 28th overall for JJ necessarily means we won't want to add another pick. I see value in adding a late lottery/mid-first pick or an early 2nd rounder (but I bet lots of teams prefer those too).

  16. #56
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    If they go after a second rounder I'm crossing my fingers for Isiah Thomas. He would be a first round lock if not for his size.

  17. #57
    Raptors Republic Superstar heinz57's Avatar
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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    If they go after a second rounder I'm crossing my fingers for Isiah Thomas. He would be a first round lock if not for his size.
    i know its unfounded because there really is no connection between the two other than being named after him, but i cringe at the thought of that name being connected to the franchise ever again.

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