Another Min/Tor/Sac trade

[mcHAPPY]

My contribution to MIN/SAC/TOR assuming CLE/DET/MIN trade happens (same as reported but Ridnour goes to DET and CLE's #32):

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMa...radeId=3hc9nqk

Many of the ideas overlap and I may have posted this elsewhere.

TOR: Casspi, Tolliver, Pekovic, #4 (Kanter), #5 (Walker)
SAC: Bargnani, Flynn, Webster, #8 (to go along with #7)
MIN: Calderon, Garcia, Thompson

Rationale:

Minnesota are young enough especially with Rubio coming. They get 2 veterans and one young player with 3 years experience under his belt who is better than anything they have at C. They solidify their bench and add maturity to locker room and still have the #20. With Kevin Love coming up for an extension they need to stop adding youth and start adding W's.

PG: Rubio, Calderon
SG: Johnson, Ellington
SF: Beasley, Garcia, Hayward
PF: Love, Randolph
C: Thompson, Milicic

Sacramento have a good core to build around in Evans and Cousins. Bargnani opens things up for both. They reportedly have interest in Flynn (source: HoopsWorld from Boston Globe - take it for what it is worth). They can then resign Thornton and reportedly want to resign Dalembert.

PG: Flynn, Udrih
SG: Evans, Thornton, Taylor
SF: Webster, Greene
PF: Bargnani, Hassan
C: Cousins, Dalembert

Toronto gets two more pieces to add to the core moving forward through the draft (Kanter and Walker) and possibly 3 as Casspi is only just turning 23 and, like JJ, has 2 years left on his rookie deal. Pekovic and Tolliver add depth to the front court with differing skill sets (Tolliver a stretch 4/5 and Pekovic a banger and a European one at that). They shed major salary as well and would have Barbosa, Bayless, and Tolliver coming off the books next year (about $12.8M).

PG: Bayless, Walker
SG: DD, Barbosa
SF: Casspi, JJ, Kleiza
PF: Davis, Amir, Tolliver
C: Kanter, Pekovic, Alabi

I doubt the lineup wins more than 28 games but it is certainly a nice core to build around and gives them another lottery pick to add what would hopefully be the missing piece or a bonafide future star. The bolded players could be considered core pieces moving forward and the italicized players being solid role/bench players.

[Maleko]

My contribution to MIN/SAC/TOR assuming CLE/DET/MIN trade happens (same as reported but Ridnour goes to DET and CLE's #32):

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMa...radeId=3hc9nqk

Many of the ideas overlap and I may have posted this elsewhere.

TOR: Casspi, Tolliver, Pekovic, #4 (Kanter), #5 (Walker)
SAC: Bargnani, Flynn, Webster, #8 (to go along with #7)
MIN: Calderon, Garcia, Thompson

Rationale:

Minnesota are young enough especially with Rubio coming. They get 2 veterans and one young player with 3 years experience under his belt who is better than anything they have at C. They solidify their bench and add maturity to locker room and still have the #20. With Kevin Love coming up for an extension they need to stop adding youth and start adding W's.

PG: Rubio, Calderon
SG: Johnson, Ellington
SF: Beasley, Garcia, Hayward
PF: Love, Randolph
C: Thompson, Milicic

Sacramento have a good core to build around in Evans and Cousins. Bargnani opens things up for both. They reportedly have interest in Flynn (source: HoopsWorld from Boston Globe - take it for what it is worth). They can then resign Thornton and reportedly want to resign Dalembert.

PG: Flynn, Udrih
SG: Evans, Thornton, Taylor
SF: Webster, Greene
PF: Bargnani, Hassan
C: Cousins, Dalembert

Toronto gets two more pieces to add to the core moving forward through the draft (Kanter and Walker) and possibly 3 as Casspi is only just turning 23 and, like JJ, has 2 years left on his rookie deal. Pekovic and Tolliver add depth to the front court with differing skill sets (Tolliver a stretch 4/5 and Pekovic a banger and a European one at that). They shed major salary as well and would have Barbosa, Bayless, and Tolliver coming off the books next year (about $12.8M).

PG: Bayless, Walker
SG: DD, Barbosa
SF: Casspi, JJ, Kleiza
PF: Davis, Amir, Tolliver
C: Kanter, Pekovic, Alabi

I doubt the lineup wins more than 28 games but it is certainly a nice core to build around and gives them another lottery pick to add what would hopefully be the missing piece or a bonafide future star. The bolded players could be considered core pieces moving forward and the italicized players being solid role/bench players.

Interesting. I would say that either #7 or #8 would have to be with Minny in this as they are fleeced without it.

[mcHAPPY]

Interesting. I would say that either #7 or #8 would have to be with Minny in this as they are fleeced without it.

Fair enough. Maybe have Minny keep 8 and send Sacramento #20.

[mcHAPPY]

Another stab at MIN-SAC-TOR

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMa...radeId=455rmql

Assuming DET/CLE/MIN happens with some combination of player/draft pick going to DET. Minnesota would have #4 and #8 picks.

TOR: Thompson, Ridnour, Webster, #4
SAC: Bargnani, Flynn, Pekovic
MIN: Calderon, Garcia, Casspi

Rationale:

The Kings can draft a wing (Leoard, Vesely at #7) and would also have money to spend on another big man and wing to go with their lineup of:

PG: Flynn, Udrih
SG: Evans, Thorton, Taylor
SF: Greene/draft pick
PF: Bargnani, Whiteside
C: Cousins/Pekovic

The Wolves get experience and upside at backup positions and can draft Biyombo or Valanciunas at #8:

PG: Rubio, Calderon
SG: Johnson, Garcia, Ellington
SF: Beasley, Casspi, Hayward
PF: Love, Randolph
C: Darko, (draft pick - Biyombo, Valanciunas)

The Raptors ensure they have someone with experience around at the PG, a rented wing player in Webster until Kleiza returns and possible trait bait with an expiring contract next year (team option), a C and of course another a second lottery pick. Raps draft Kanter and Walker/Knight (assumes UTAH does not take Kanter).

PG: Bayless/draft pick/Ridnour
SG: DD/Barbosa
SF: Webster/JJ/Kleiza
PF: Davis/Amir
C: Kanter/Thompson/Alabi

Is this trade fair?

I think it is because:

Sacramento need a young PG and are getting one in Flynn who still has a lot of upside. Cousins is a beast and would probably be one of the few players who can compliment Bargnani in terms of skill and ability and they also get another banger in Pekovic to help with Bargnani 'defeciencies'. They are weak at SF with Casspi wanting out and they will be in a position to still draft one with their lottery pick. They will also have enough cap space to sign another wing.

Minnesota gets 2 veterans at PG and SG as well as what can still be considered a developing prospect in Casspi. They also keep a lottery pick to fill in any other hole.

Toronto takes on Ridnour's contract and gets experience at the PG spot. Webster is more cap filler and becomes the new Weems. Thompson adds more defense and rebounding which is lacking and can start while Kanter adjusts to the league if needed. The Raps also are in a position to add to the core with two lottery picks getting a C and a PG and will have cap space to add another SG (Cook?).

I am tempted to think the Raps get the better end of this deal but, excluding draft picks, they are giving up two of the best players in this trade. What do you think?

[Maleko]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMa...radeId=455rmql

Assuming DET/CLE/MIN happens with some combination of player/draft pick going to DET. Minnesota would have #4 and #8 picks.

TOR: Thompson, Ridnour, Webster, #4
SAC: Bargnani, Flynn, Pekovic
MIN: Calderon, Garcia, Casspi

Rationale:

The Kings can draft a wing (Leoard, Vesely at #7) and would also have money to spend on another big man and wing to go with their lineup of:

PG: Flynn, Udrih
SG: Evans, Thorton, Taylor
SF: Greene/draft pick
PF: Bargnani, Whiteside
C: Cousins/Pekovic

The Wolves get experience and upside at backup positions and can draft Biyombo or Valanciunas at #8:

PG: Rubio, Calderon
SG: Johnson, Garcia, Ellington
SF: Beasley, Casspi, Hayward
PF: Love, Randolph
C: Darko, (draft pick - Biyombo, Valanciunas)

The Raptors ensure they have someone with experience around at the PG, a rented wing player in Webster until Kleiza returns and possible trait bait with an expiring contract next year (team option), a C and of course another a second lottery pick. Raps draft Kanter and Walker/Knight (assumes UTAH does not take Kanter).

PG: Bayless/draft pick/Ridnour
SG: DD/Barbosa
SF: Webster/JJ/Kleiza
PF: Davis/Amir
C: Kanter/Thompson/Alabi

Is this trade fair?

I think it is because:

Sacramento need a young PG and are getting one in Flynn who still has a lot of upside. Cousins is a beast and would probably be one of the few players who can compliment Bargnani in terms of skill and ability and they also get another banger in Pekovic to help with Bargnani 'defeciencies'. They are weak at SF with Casspi wanting out and they will be in a position to still draft one with their lottery pick. They will also have enough cap space to sign another wing.

Minnesota gets 2 veterans at PG and SG as well as what can still be considered a developing prospect in Casspi. They also keep a lottery pick to fill in any other hole.

Toronto takes on Ridnour's contract and gets experience at the PG spot. Webster is more cap filler and becomes the new Weems. Thompson adds more defense and rebounding which is lacking and can start while Kanter adjusts to the league if needed. The Raps also are in a position to add to the core with two lottery picks getting a C and a PG and will have cap space to add another SG (Cook?).

I am tempted to think the Raps get the better end of this deal but, excluding draft picks, they are giving up two of the best players in this trade. What do you think?

bare bones close, but I have a hard time seeing Minny trading Pekovic, Flynn, Ridnour, Webster AND the #4 for Calderon, Garcia and Casspi. It also appears (to me) that SAC should be giving up more. What if the #7 actually goes to Minny, and the #20 goes to SAC (or is that gone in the DET/CLE trade I don't remember)? To me it would appear more balanced. The Raptors should be ok with the ins and outs (insert Heinz joke here) but that said I would be more inclined to have Webster go to SAC instead of Toronto (they would not then require the #20), and Toronto uses the money to go for a Wilson Chandler or such or another option would be to draft Leonard and go after Felton as a FA next year or further trade this year. SAC still has the money to go for FA wing if they need and definitely need another big (they have indicated they are interested in bringing Dalembert back although Houston may snag him).

[Maleko]

bare bones close, but I have a hard time seeing Minny trading Pekovic, Flynn, Ridnour, Webster AND the #4 for Calderon, Garcia and Casspi. It also appears (to me) that SAC should be giving up more. What if the #7 actually goes to Minny, and the #20 goes to SAC (or is that gone in the DET/CLE trade I don't remember)? To me it would appear more balanced. The Raptors should be ok with the ins and outs (insert Heinz joke here) but that said I would be more inclined to have Webster go to SAC instead of Toronto (they would not then require the #20), and Toronto uses the money to go for a Wilson Chandler or such or another option would be to draft Leonard and go after Felton as a FA next year or further trade this year. SAC still has the money to go for FA wing if they need and definitely need another big (they have indicated they are interested in bringing Dalembert back although Houston may snag him).

Even do a Bayless/Barbosa for Felton/#22 after, and to further entice Minny flip the 5 and 8 (Burks)?

Sorry I am bastardizing your trade here. But we could then look like:

PG: RFelton, LRidnour (Darius Morris at #22?)
SG: Derozan, Burks (Marshon Brooks at #22?)
SF: KLeonard, JJohnson, LKleiza
PF: ED, Amir (KFaried at #22?)
C: EKanter, JThompson, SAlabi

[mcHAPPY]

bare bones close, but I have a hard time seeing Minny trading Pekovic, Flynn, Ridnour, Webster AND the #4 for Calderon, Garcia and Casspi. It also appears (to me) that SAC should be giving up more. What if the #7 actually goes to Minny, and the #20 goes to SAC (or is that gone in the DET/CLE trade I don't remember)? To me it would appear more balanced. The Raptors should be ok with the ins and outs (insert Heinz joke here) but that said I would be more inclined to have Webster go to SAC instead of Toronto (they would not then require the #20), and Toronto uses the money to go for a Wilson Chandler or such or another option would be to draft Leonard and go after Felton as a FA next year or further trade this year. SAC still has the money to go for FA wing if they need and definitely need another big (they have indicated they are interested in bringing Dalembert back although Houston may snag him).

Good points but I have a differing view on Minnesota's contribution.

Flynn and Ridnour, while assets, put MIN in a tough position because they are at a disadvantage with any team in negotiating trades. They are not going to have Ridnour, Flynn, and Rubio there next season. Flynn, for all his upside, still is coming off major surgery and a rough year averaging only 18.5 minutes per game.

Webster also had a rough year injury wise appearing in only 46 games, averaging just 24 minutes per game and starting only 1. For all his promise being drafted 6th overall, for whatever reason he has not lived up to expectations.

Pekovic is a fairly large contract (about $4.5M per year) given his production (5.5ppg, 3.3rpg) and he only played 13 mins per game in 65. If they draft a big at #8, I'm sure he would have more upside, be a little cheaper, and be capable of taking his 13 minutes a game.

My thinking is Minnesota gives up one starter (who should be a backup in Ridnour), 3 non-starters (from a 17 win team!), and a #4 pick to get another PG who can start but is better served as a backup, is a better player than Ridnour, and provides a lot of off-court benefits (Calderon); a solid veteran who is tough, a good defender, very much a professional who can still play, and provides much needed experience on the wing (Garcia); and a cheap prospect on a rookie deal for 2 more seasons who at the very least provides what Webster did (Casspi).

[mcHAPPY]

Even do a Bayless/Barbosa for Felton/#22 after, and to further entice Minny flip the 5 and 8 (Burks)?

Sorry I am bastardizing your trade here. But we could then look like:

PG: RFelton, LRidnour (Darius Morris at #22?)
SG: Derozan, Burks (Marshon Brooks at #22?)
SF: KLeonard, JJohnson, LKleiza
PF: ED, Amir (KFaried at #22?)
C: EKanter, JThompson, SAlabi

That would certainly be an overhaul. I think your team will still be a lottery team though. I think for the long term development of the team I'd pass on Felton. He is going to be 27 next year and by the time the team is ready to compete again he'll be pushing the wrong side of 30 (assuming he even re-signs as an UFA). With this lineup below, the Raptors still are a lottery team next year and can (hopefully) get a SF for the future and with (hopefully) a deeper draft and better options on the wing, a better player than Leonard could be had (oh how I dream of Barnes).

PG: Walker or Knight
SG: DD
SF: (2012 draft), JJ
PF: Davis, Amir
C: Kanter

[Maleko]

That would certainly be an overhaul. I think your team will still be a lottery team though. I think for the long term development of the team I'd pass on Felton. He is going to be 27 next year and by the time the team is ready to compete again he'll be pushing the wrong side of 30 (assuming he even re-signs as an UFA). With this lineup below, the Raptors still are a lottery team next year and can (hopefully) get a SF for the future and with (hopefully) a deeper draft and better options on the wing, a better player than Leonard could be had (oh how I dream of Barnes).

PG: Walker or Knight
SG: DD
SF: (2012 draft), JJ
PF: Davis, Amir
C: Kanter

I definitely like the idea of getting a SF in next year's draft, and Barnes would be ideal at this point, but what scares me is the new CBA and a strong potential of changing the age requirements thereby eliminating about 80-90% of the projected lottery picks for next year.

That said what do you think about sticking with Bayless/Ridnour at the point, flipping with Minny and taking Burks for a longer term backup 2 like Burks? I am not dismissing taking Knight (preferred but likely not there at 4/5) or Walker, but with next year's hopeful SF strength, and Barbosa's upcoming expiring...

BTW good news Ceez has a thread in the everything raps forum with a quote (twitter/draft express sourced) from Colangelo saying he is actively looking at acquiring another top 10 pick. (this was in context of making clear he was not shopping DD) This as you and I well know is a turnaround from prior statements, but welcoming news.

[mcHAPPY]

I definitely like the idea of getting a SF in next year's draft, and Barnes would be ideal at this point, but what scares me is the new CBA and a strong potential of changing the age requirements thereby eliminating about 80-90% of the projected lottery picks for next year.

That said what do you think about sticking with Bayless/Ridnour at the point, flipping with Minny and taking Burks for a longer term backup 2 like Burks? I am not dismissing taking Knight (preferred but likely not there at 4/5) or Walker, but with next year's hopeful SF strength, and Barbosa's upcoming expiring...

BTW good news Ceez has a thread in the everything raps forum with a quote (twitter/draft express sourced) from Colangelo saying he is actively looking at acquiring another top 10 pick. (this was in context of making clear he was not shopping DD) This as you and I well know is a turnaround from prior statements, but welcoming news.

Considering Burks plays the same position as DD and wings are easier to come by than PG's or C's, I would rather see draft picks at the top of this draft used on PG's or C's rather than wings.

Another possibility is if Ridnour, Webster, or Pekovic are sent to Detroit in that rumoured MIN/DET/CLE deal then Minnesota would be at least $4 million more under the salary cap in addition to the $3.75M they already are.

[keefec]

Even do a Bayless/Barbosa for Felton/#22 after, and to further entice Minny flip the 5 and 8 (Burks)?

Sorry I am bastardizing your trade here. But we could then look like:

PG: RFelton, LRidnour (Darius Morris at #22?)
SG: Derozan, Burks (Marshon Brooks at #22?)
SF: KLeonard, JJohnson, LKleiza
PF: ED, Amir (KFaried at #22?)
C: EKanter, JThompson, SAlabi

3 lottery picks, 4 first round rookies on the same team? :S