Page 1 of 5 1 2 3 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 81

Thread: Ripples From Mavs Win Changing Views?

  1. #1
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    11,986
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default Ripples From Mavs Win Changing Views?

    So the Mavs are the champs. They did it with only one true star in Dirk Nowitzki, along with a strong supporting cast who fit together and played as a team. Although they no doubt had a lot of talent they have bucked the current philosophy held by many high profile young star, that being, you need two or three stars to win it. That's said, does the Mavs victory over the new school philosophy give you hope for the Raptors in the future?

  2. #2
    Raptors Republic Rookie Tortacular's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Saskatoon, SK.
    Posts
    110
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Of course. The Mavs were a veteran team with a variety of skills (most notably, the ability to shoot the ball) and an excellent coaching staff.

    I was pretty pleased to see the Miami "blueprint" proven as faulty quickly. I mean if you can't win when you have Wade and LeBron in your "big 3"... pretty tough for someone to top that from a sheer talent standpoint. Team basketball won out.
    You can find me on Twitter.

  3. #3
    Raptors Republic Rookie 10 000 Hours's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Toronto, On
    Posts
    167
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    They choked, plain and simple. Dallas was too aggressive, too hot, too resilient. I think people are too hard on the Heat because Boston won in the first year after bringing together their big 3. Maybe Boston was the rare exception, and the norm of so-called super teams is that they won't gel and mesh win so easily.

    One of the Heat's 3 should be traded to bring better 2nd unit guys.

  4. #4
    Raptors Republic Starter jeff_hostetler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    659
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Only thing I saw in the Finals that applies to the Raps is that Barea absolutely killed the Heat, and it made me think someone like Kemba Walker's got a real shot to do something special in the league. And Walker isn't really even that small

    Maybe the way they ran the zone showed that it can be a primary defensive option if you have the coach to teach it properly and the players to carry it out the same.

  5. #5
    Raptors Republic Starter
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    402
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    No, it doesn't. LeBron James is clearly a headcase, or something went wrong in the locker room that the public doesn't know about. He gets into periods or what look like depression where other all-time greats turn into killer sharks ripping their opponents apart. Early in the series it looked like a 4-game sweep for the heat, and I thought it would be so. But then LeBron went bye-bye. I guess Spoelstra will get the blame and be on the earliest train out of town, but it's really something in James's head that caused this. Miami also needs to diversify the roster so they have more players who do things well without the ball, but they still had it won this year.

  6. #6
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    19,191
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I don't think the loss changes views. Teams try to put the best talent and the most marketable talent together to win, fill the seats, and line the coffers with merchandise sales.

    The new-to-be-determined CBA is going to be the ultimate view changer.

    Don't forget, the team still made the finals - and quite easily at that. With all the attention, anything less than a championship was a failure but LBJ and Bosh are still a few years from 30 and Wade has a few peak years left.

    Personally, I"m glad they lost. It is nice to see nothing is a sure bet, the team wins before the individuals, and this might cause players to think twice about teaming up to win and ditching those franchises and fans that made you what you are. It didn't work for Karl Malone and Gary Payton (LAL), Charles Barkley (HOU), Shaq (PHX, CLE, BOS), nor, at least this year, for LeBron and Bosh. I would think the one championship in Dallas for Dirk would be sweeter than 3-4 championships in, say, Chicago had he left to go there after 12 years in Dallas. Maybe I'm wrong, it is just my opinion, but it is nice to see someone work and achieve a goal rather than having it handed to them. My opinion speaks more about the world today than just professional basketball - and again, it is just my opinion.

  7. #7
    Raptors Republic Starter mountio's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    741
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I think the most important thing this series showed is that you can play good defense without having all good defensive players. Kidd, Dirk, Barea, Peja (when he played), Terry are not good defensive players. BUT - the Mavs have a good coaching staff (who use zone effectively), have a couple of good defenders (Chandler, Marion) and are competive enough offensively for guys to give a sh*t. This shows me that there is more hope for the raps than people think and if we can pick up a good coach and a couple of good defensive players (Ed is already one) - we could be in good shap.e

  8. #8
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    11,986
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    This doesn't make anyone think that Casey's odds of being the Raptors' next head coach have gone up?

  9. #9
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    19,191
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    This doesn't make anyone think that Casey's odds of being the Raptors' next head coach have gone up?
    I'm not sure but it will certainly decrease the amount of explanation required of BC if this is his ultimate choice.

  10. #10
    Raptors Republic Rookie 10 000 Hours's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Toronto, On
    Posts
    167
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    This doesn't make anyone think that Casey's odds of being the Raptors' next head coach have gone up?
    He's good, but having Chandler anchor your D will make any defensive coach look better. Not saying he's a bad choice, just let's not hand him a key to the city yet.

  11. #11
    Raptors Republic Starter jeff_hostetler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    659
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote mountio wrote: View Post
    I think the most important thing this series showed is that you can play good defense without having all good defensive players. Kidd, Dirk, Barea, Peja (when he played), Terry are not good defensive players. BUT - the Mavs have a good coaching staff (who use zone effectively), have a couple of good defenders (Chandler, Marion) and are competive enough offensively for guys to give a sh*t. This shows me that there is more hope for the raps than people think and if we can pick up a good coach and a couple of good defensive players (Ed is already one) - we could be in good shap.e
    What's with all these people - not just mountio but I seem to hear it from everywhere, broadcasters included - claiming Jason Kidd isn't a good defensive player? The guy's made 9 NBA All-Defense teams, including 4 All-Defense 1st teams. I don't know what player they've been watching, but to me, one of the primary reasons Jason Kidd is talked about as being one of the best point guards of all time is precisely because he's an outstanding defensive player (that and his passing skills).

  12. #12
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    19,191
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote jeff_hostetler wrote: View Post
    What's with all these people - not just mountio but I seem to hear it from everywhere, broadcasters included - claiming Jason Kidd isn't a good defensive player? The guy's made 9 NBA All-Defense teams, including 4 All-Defense 1st teams. I don't know what player they've been watching, but to me, one of the primary reasons Jason Kidd is talked about as being one of the best point guards of all time is precisely because he's an outstanding defensive player (that and his passing skills).
    It has more to do with age. Mentally and fundamentally he is sharp as ever but he has definitely lost a step or two.

  13. #13
    Raptors Republic Starter jeff_hostetler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    659
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Further, along with Marion and Chandler, that's 3 players in the starting 5 who are excellent defenders. Bring in Stevenson off the bench, that's 4 out of 9 players who played in game 6 that are great defensively (not mentioning Brian Cardinal who hit with hard fouls anyone on the Heat who tried getting into the paint). Basically half the Mavericks. So I think we can throw out the argument that they played good defense without good defensive players.

  14. #14
    Raptors Republic Starter jeff_hostetler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    659
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    It has more to do with age. Mentally and fundamentally he is sharp as ever but he has definitely lost a step or two.
    A nine-time all-defensive player who has lost a step or two is still a good defensive player. It's not speed that makes a good defender, but awareness, toughness and effort.

  15. #15
    Raptors Republic Rookie
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    7
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default value of bargnani

    I'm not saying Bargs = Dirk for a second, but perhaps a Mavs title could improve the value of bargs on the open market. Their skill sets are undeniably similar and perhaps other gm's would be more interested in accepting Bargnani's defensive liabilities in a deal after seeing what dirk did to pretty much everyone in these playoffs

  16. #16
    Raptors Republic Starter Hassan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Guelph,ON
    Posts
    463
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    boston had a big three but they had a team around them two and there big three played like a team, wade and lebron still don't know how to work together and the heat are effectively a four man team wade lebron bosh and chalmers has been playing well the rest of the heat are non existent. you cant just grab 3 amazing players and tell them to play, much threw the finals you could tlel the heat had no offensive plan all they did was pass the ball to lebron or wade, i think coach erik spolstra and the heats lack of a true team let them down. boston had amazing role players to go along with the big 3 heat don't have any good role players

  17. #17
    Raptors Republic Starter
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Colborne, ON
    Posts
    240
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Can't agree more. Dirk has been there 12 years and Terry how many? I was worried that if the Heat won easily, it would create a two-tiered league where all young stars colluded to play together. At least if Miami wins it next year, they at least had some adversity to overcome (not a whole lot) but at least the title wasn't just handed to them.

  18. #18
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    19,191
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote jeff_hostetler wrote: View Post
    A nine-time all-defensive player who has lost a step or two is still a good defensive player. It's not speed that makes a good defender, but awareness, toughness and effort.
    I agree all those things are extremely important in defense and having those traits certainly overcome lack of athletic ability.

    However, Kidd has felt the effects of father time and it has affected his defensive game compared to 3-4 seasons ago.

  19. #19
    Raptors Republic Starter Hassan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Guelph,ON
    Posts
    463
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    dwayne casey should get the raptors coaching job

  20. #20
    Raptors Republic All-Star
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Mississauga
    Posts
    1,570
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote ejah wrote: View Post
    I'm not saying Bargs = Dirk for a second, but perhaps a Mavs title could improve the value of bargs on the open market. Their skill sets are undeniably similar and perhaps other gm's would be more interested in accepting Bargnani's defensive liabilities in a deal after seeing what dirk did to pretty much everyone in these playoffs
    While Bargnani is definitely not Dirk, and I don't think they are comparable, I am at least heartened to see that this observation is followed up by a potential increase in his trade market worth instead of "maybe we should keep him so Bargs can do what Dirk did"...blah blah blah as we have seen a number of times on here and elsewhere during these finals.

Page 1 of 5 1 2 3 ... LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •