View Poll Results: Will you be happy if Vesely is drafted 5th overall?

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Thread: Chad Ford Mock Draft 6.0: Raptors STILL selecting Jan Vesely

  1. #21
    Raptors Republic Superstar planetmars's Avatar
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    Do we really need someone like Biyomba though? The guy can't play a lick of offense. He's the anti-Bargs. It's like getting a much younger version of Reggie who doesn't have his IQ yet. When Reggie is on the floor its like playing 4 on 5. It would be nice to get Biyomba but only if we can get him as a second pick since he would be like an 8th or 9th option. And on this team, you need someone who can be a starter or at least a first or second bench option.

    I'd rather resign Reggie for cheap, and use him instead of Biyomba (for some veteran presence). Then go for someone like Walker/Leonard or Val. Assuming Kanter is off the table. I say no to Knight. I just don't have the same faith in him that a lot of other people do.

  2. #22
    Super Moderator MangoKid's Avatar
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    Quote planetmars wrote: View Post
    Do we really need someone like Biyomba though? The guy can't play a lick of offense. He's the anti-Bargs. It's like getting a much younger version of Reggie who doesn't have his IQ yet. When Reggie is on the floor its like playing 4 on 5. It would be nice to get Biyomba but only if we can get him as a second pick since he would be like an 8th or 9th option. And on this team, you need someone who can be a starter or at least a first or second bench option.

    I'd rather resign Reggie for cheap, and use him instead of Biyomba (for some veteran presence). Then go for someone like Walker/Leonard or Val. Assuming Kanter is off the table. I say no to Knight. I just don't have the same faith in him that a lot of other people do.
    The one thing Biyombo can't really do is hit a jumpshot, but he can do putback jams and layups. His over 50% FGs points to that. For people clamouring for guys that play D, Biyombo certainly can do that. He doesn't require touches. The thing that Biyombo could possibly bring that Reggie does is play better D and block shots. While Reggie is a big body, all he really does is rebound.
    I compare Biyombo's ceiling to that of an offensively challenged Marcus Camby.

  3. #23
    Raptors Republic Superstar planetmars's Avatar
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    I think to be a decent player in the paint you need mass. Biyomba is long and athletic but doesn't have the mass. It's great that he scores at a high efficiency in the paint, but that's not against an NBA team. Do you see him being able to score easily in the paint against players like Howard, Bynum or Perkins, or even Marc Gasol, or Bogut?

    Hasheem Thabeet (a similar kind of player) I believe shot over 65% from the paint. He's struggling to find minutes now in the league, and people are thinking bust.

    I've heard comparisons to Ben Wallace since they are roughly the same size. Michael Rosenberg of the Detroit Free Press had something to say about that, which you can find here.

    Just because Toronto hasn't had a good defensive team for a while shouldn't mean we just get players for their defense and throw offense down the toilet. They are not quite ready for role players in my opinion. Once they become a perennial playoff team is when they should acquire role players. Now is the time to get a decent 2-way player and focus on getting the team better as a whole.

    Again if the Raptors get a second pick then I am more than okay with selecting Biyomba with that pick, but a top 5 for a role player who can only play one way? I'm not so sure about that.

  4. #24
    Raptors Republic All-Star Balls of Steel's Avatar
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    Quote Tim W. wrote: View Post
    Since there's a chance there won't even be a next season, who cares if Valanciunas is going to miss a season. It's not as if he doesn't want to come. The only reason he won't come next season is because his current team wouldn't let him. I'd rather see the Raptors take Valanciunas than Vesley, Walker or Knight.
    The big man outside Kanter is Jonas. It is so dumb what most teams will do when someone is honest. The lockout is imminent. Here's a player that was upfront, and now his stock drops? Walker has intrigued me of late but he is another Bayless clone. If we draft Kemba, he's going to have to take the reins away from Bayless to prove his worth as a 5th pick. Valanciunas on the other hand is a legit 7 footer with a mean streak. He can play and contribute right away once the labout dust settles.


    Jonas Valanciunas is close to a buyout with Lietuvos Rytas, according to sources.

    But the buyout would not allow Valanciunas to come to the NBA for the 11-12 season, according to the report.

    The Cavaliers are high on Valanciunas with the fourth overall selection, but would likely not select him if he wouldn't arrive until the 12-13 season.
    Last edited by Balls of Steel; Tue Jun 21st, 2011 at 06:09 PM.
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  5. #25
    Raptors Republic All-Star hateslosing's Avatar
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    Quote planetmars wrote: View Post
    I think to be a decent player in the paint you need mass. Biyomba is long and athletic but doesn't have the mass. It's great that he scores at a high efficiency in the paint, but that's not against an NBA team. Do you see him being able to score easily in the paint against players like Howard, Bynum or Perkins, or even Marc Gasol, or Bogut?

    Hasheem Thabeet (a similar kind of player) I believe shot over 65% from the paint. He's struggling to find minutes now in the league, and people are thinking bust.

    I've heard comparisons to Ben Wallace since they are roughly the same size. Michael Rosenberg of the Detroit Free Press had something to say about that, which you can find here.

    Just because Toronto hasn't had a good defensive team for a while shouldn't mean we just get players for their defense and throw offense down the toilet. They are not quite ready for role players in my opinion. Once they become a perennial playoff team is when they should acquire role players. Now is the time to get a decent 2-way player and focus on getting the team better as a whole.

    Again if the Raptors get a second pick then I am more than okay with selecting Biyomba with that pick, but a top 5 for a role player who can only play one way? I'm not so sure about that.
    I'm against them taking Biyombo at 5 because I think they could trade down and still get him. I do like him as a player however. Your mass argument however is incorrect: the guy weighs 245, five pounds less than Bargs who guarded Guys like Howard and Tim Duncan fairly well one on one when Bosh was here. He could easily be 260 pounds by his second season and that is plenty enough mass to guard anyone. In terms of his ability to score, If he can be a career 10 ppg guy who gets his points off put backs and alley oops while playing great D, I don't think anyone would mind that. It's not like he can't learn to be a decent offensive player, he just isn't right now. Dwight Howard was terrible on offense for his first couple seasons and look at him now.
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  6. #26
    Raptors Republic Rookie Paradigm Shift's Avatar
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    Quote white men can't jump wrote: View Post
    What the hell is up with Chad Ford's Vesely infatuation?
    I just had a chance to listen to Ryen Russillo's Jun 17 podcast featuring Chad Ford running through his mock draft. He was very wishy washy on the Raptor's number 5 pick. Yes, he still put Vesely there, but he spent a lot of time during the segment talking about how his sources have dried up and no one "internal" on any team is talking anymore.

    He also remarked about all the Raptors fans writing in that they'll die if BC pick another soft Euro, and was sure to emphasize that Vesely is not a soft Euro ("More Anthony Randolph then AB").

    All this makes me think his Vesely pick reflects who he thinks the Raps should take, rather than who he hears/knows they will pick.

  7. #27
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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    ok, i'm going to put a stone cold guarantee that if kemba is available at 5. the raps are picking him.
    It will be DUMB not to pick him

  8. #28
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    I've gotta think that now that the Raps have Casey on board, they are gonna go with a player who can contribute on D right away. That means (to me) that Vessely is off the board, and the Raps are gonna pick Leonard, or reach and take Biyumbo.

  9. #29
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    I wonder how much say Casey even gets in the matter, seeing as how he hasn't been around any of the scouts or GM and probably hasn't even seen any of the players in consideration first hand.

  10. #30
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    Quote duncan wrote: View Post
    I've gotta think that now that the Raps have Casey on board, they are gonna go with a player who can contribute on D right away. That means (to me) that Vessely is off the board, and the Raps are gonna pick Leonard, or reach and take Biyumbo.
    How can you saw that Leonard and Biyombo are the only players who can contribute D right away. There's Kemba, Knight, and Thompson at least.

  11. #31
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    Chad Ford might finally be softening on his Vesely-to-Raptors stance:

    The Raptors' hiring of Dwane Casey might affect their draft plans. Casey is a defensive specialist, and when he looks at the Raptors' roster, there isn't much to like on that front. GM Bryan Colangelo has built an offensive juggernaut, but defensively, the Raptors are pretty terrible. That might explain why the team is zeroing in on three excellent defenders -- Brandon Knight, Biyombo and Kawhi Leonard -- at No. 5. I've had Jan Vesely going here for weeks, and others have been pushing for Kemba Walker here, but it sounds like neither player is atop the Raptors' board right now.
    http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/cat.../draft-reports

  12. #32
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Well it did not make any sense to begin with. I think he was following that Toronto stereotype that started after year one of Colangelo's career in Toronto.

  13. #33
    Raptors Republic Starter Hassan's Avatar
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    raptors are def going to take kemba walker

  14. #34
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    Quote Hassan wrote: View Post
    raptors are def going to take kemba walker
    I don't understand how anyone can say with ANY degree of certainty what is going to happen in this draft.
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  15. #35
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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    ok, i'm going to put a stone cold guarantee that if kemba is available at 5. the raps are picking him.
    Unless Knight is on the board I wholeheartedly agree with you.

  16. #36
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    Quote dballa21 wrote: View Post
    How can you saw that Leonard and Biyombo are the only players who can contribute D right away. There's Kemba, Knight, and Thompson at least.


    Haha, nice try, but I never said once that those 2 are the only players who can contribute on D right away. Those are just the 2 that I think will be at the top of the Raps draft board. Go stir shit somewhere else.

  17. #37
    Raptors Republic Icon mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Is Chad Ford finally relenting on Vesely?

    The Raptors' hiring of Dwane Casey might affect their draft plans. Casey is a defensive specialist, and when he looks at the Raptors' roster, there isn't much to like on that front. GM Bryan Colangelo has built an offensive juggernaut, but defensively, the Raptors are pretty terrible. That might explain why the team is zeroing in on three excellent defenders -- Brandon Knight, Biyombo and Kawhi Leonard -- at No. 5. I've had Jan Vesely going here for weeks, and others have been pushing for Kemba Walker here, but it sounds like neither player is atop the Raptors' board right now.
    http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/pos...o-7-for-felton

  18. #38
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    Quote MangoKid wrote: View Post
    The one thing Biyombo can't really do is hit a jumpshot, but he can do putback jams and layups. His over 50% FGs points to that. For people clamouring for guys that play D, Biyombo certainly can do that. He doesn't require touches. The thing that Biyombo could possibly bring that Reggie does is play better D and block shots. While Reggie is a big body, all he really does is rebound.
    I compare Biyombo's ceiling to that of an offensively challenged Marcus Camby.
    I think his ceiling could even be Big Ben. He can do everything Big Ben did, they measure around the same but Biyombo is longer.

  19. #39
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    Quote Balls of Steel wrote: View Post
    The big man outside Kanter is Jonas. It is so dumb what most teams will do when someone is honest. The lockout is imminent. Here's a player that was upfront, and now his stock drops? Walker has intrigued me of late but he is another Bayless clone. If we draft Kemba, he's going to have to take the reins away from Bayless to prove his worth as a 5th pick. Valanciunas on the other hand is a legit 7 footer with a mean streak. He can play and contribute right away once the labout dust settles.


    Jonas Valanciunas is close to a buyout with Lietuvos Rytas, according to sources.

    But the buyout would not allow Valanciunas to come to the NBA for the 11-12 season, according to the report.

    The Cavaliers are high on Valanciunas with the fourth overall selection, but would likely not select him if he wouldn't arrive until the 12-13 season.
    Considering Valanciunas is the guy the SPurs are apparently targeting, any questions I had about the guy (fouls, hands) have suddenly gone out the window. He might even have risen ahead of Kanter, in my mind. Yes, I put that much weight on who the Spurs want to draft.
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