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Thread: The Official "Welcome to Toronto, Jonas Valanciunas!" thread

  1. #101
    Raptors Republic Starter charlz's Avatar
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    Quote MangoKid wrote: View Post
    Love this pick.. love, love, love it.

    Here's a snippet of instant analysis of the Valanciunas pick, courtesy of Chad Ford:

    The Raptors know international players and they may feel that they finally have found a real center. He's a true low-post player with a good motor,
    Welcome to Toronto, Jonas!
    If I hear 'good motor' again I am going to jump off a bridge. I miss the good ol' days where Hubie Brown would kick around the old most hated draft term 'Maximum upside potential'..

    "I may be wrong ... but I doubt it"

  2. #102
    Raptors Republic Starter minks77's Avatar
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    I'll start by first admitting that other than highlight reels I have never seen JV play. That being said all the highlight reels reveal is he is long, has good hands and finishes well against euro trash when he slips on the P&R. haven't seen a hint of a post game. Nothing. Maybe it's due to his frame? But being from Fundamental obsessed Europe I'm amazed he doesn't have even a mini hook, no turnaround, nothing with his back to the basket etc. Like a young Bosh without the range but with better length. His FT shooting is great so at least he can be relied on there.

    I'm down on Euros it's true. Euro League is nice but it's not the NCAA and these guys take longer to develop as a general rule and even with all the skills and experience some of the best don't translate to the NBA. Add to that that JVs game/body is not NBA ready at all and I'm mystified. MAybe he comes next year, maybe the year after that, maybe he stays in Europe 2 years, who knows? Young, skinny bigs are a risk, young, skinny euro bigs are a bigger risk. I'm not hating, it's just a fact.

    With this draft being what it is I'm not entirely devestated by this pick (he looks better than Hoffa, Esposito etc) but I was really hoping for Knight when he dropped or even Kawhi who's length and ability to D up on the wing are so very needed on this squad. I really hope I'm wrong about Vala but right now I'm very disappointed in BCo.

  3. #103
    Raptors Republic Starter minks77's Avatar
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    Quote Balls of Steel wrote: View Post
    +1. Look at Biedrins in Golden State (who happens to be a projected worst case for JV). They're mentioning Ellis more than Biedrins in trade rumours!!!!
    Uh, maybe because Bierdrins is an overrated defender and rebounder (on a team where no one else plays D or rebounds), is fragile, can't hit fts to save his life and gets paid too much whereas Ellis is, you know, an actual NBA talent with near elite scoring ability. Ellis has value, Bierdrins has next to none except to Toronto fans for some insane reason.

  4. #104
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    I can understand those who would have preferred Knight, but he is going to take at least a couple of years to have any substantial impact on the team. I think the Raptors will have other options to upgrade at PG, either by trade or through the draft in the next couple of years. I still can't understand how people think someone like Leonard would have been better than JV as a pick. He has freakishly long arms and rebounds, but JV is much taller and rebounds at a high rate in a much tougher league. Besides, Leonard got traded for George Hill. Would you have traded #5 for George Hill? Think about it.

  5. #105
    Super Moderator MangoKid's Avatar
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    Quote charlz wrote: View Post
    If I hear 'good motor' again I am going to jump off a bridge. I miss the good ol' days where Hubie Brown would kick around the old most hated draft term 'Maximum upside potential'..

    So you would have prefered to have a draft selection that is unathletic and slow? Good motor is considered a good thing, especially when we're going forward with a defensive mentality.

  6. #106
    Raptors Republic All-Star hateslosing's Avatar
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    Quote minks77 wrote: View Post
    I'm down on Euros it's true. Euro League is nice but it's not the NCAA and these guys take longer to develop as a general rule and even with all the skills and experience some of the best don't translate to the NBA. Add to that that JVs game/body is not NBA ready at all and I'm mystified. MAybe he comes next year, maybe the year after that, maybe he stays in Europe 2 years, who knows? Young, skinny bigs are a risk, young, skinny euro bigs are a bigger risk. I'm not hating, it's just a fact.
    I'd just like to point out that the Euro league is actually at a much higher level than the NCAA, especially for big men. If the NCAA champions played the Euroleague champions I doubt it would be remotely close. The reason Euro's generally take longer is that the is a stylistic difference between Euroball and the American style that takes some time to overcome. In terms of developping big men I'd much rather have my guy playing in Europe then the NCAA since big men in Europe tend to be just as strong as many pro American bigs.
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  7. #107
    Raptors Republic Starter minks77's Avatar
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    Quote hateslosing wrote: View Post
    I'd just like to point out that the Euro league is actually at a much higher level than the NCAA, especially for big men. If the NCAA champions played the Euroleague champions I doubt it would be remotely close. The reason Euro's generally take longer is that the is a stylistic difference between Euroball and the American style that takes some time to overcome. In terms of developping big men I'd much rather have my guy playing in Europe then the NCAA since big men in Europe tend to be just as strong as many pro American bigs.
    Maybe among the very top 5-10 teams but the drop off is huge after that. I understand your point but look at Andrew Bogut, Linas Kleiza and Enes Kanter. 2 of them are big men, all 3 are Euros from top flight Euro ball communities and all 3 (and more each year) moved FROM Europe and avoided the Euro League to go to prep schools and colleges in the States, specifically to play ball and put themselves in the best position to be NBA ready. This happens much more often than the Josh Childress' and Brandon Jennings types. For all the Euro league I've ever watched I have yet to feel that the average talent level is actually so much better than in the NCAA.

    *edit: I know Bogut is an Aussie and Australia is no where near Europe.
    Last edited by minks77; Fri Jun 24th, 2011 at 01:04 PM.

  8. #108
    Raptors Republic All-Star Letter N's Avatar
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    Quote hateslosing wrote: View Post
    In terms of developping big men I'd much rather have my guy playing in Europe then the NCAA since big men in Europe tend to be just as strong as many pro American bigs.
    Really cause last time I checked every good big man in the league not named Gasol came from the NCAA or American highschools.

  9. #109
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    Quote Letter N wrote: View Post
    Chandler was a major bust for his first 5 years in the league, he was supposed to be alonzo morning instead he was worse than eddy curry.

    So if we have to wait 5 years with jonas congrats to fans of derozan and Davis, they'll be on good teams by then. Maybe some place warm.
    Chandler also struggled mightily with injuries, including back injuries, which slowed his progress a hell of a lot.
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  10. #110
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    Quote Letter N wrote: View Post
    Really cause last time I checked every good big man in the league not named Gasol came from the NCAA or American highschools.
    Well, I'm pretty sure Divac, Yao, Ilgauskus, Sabonis and Okur all were All-Star centers who never played in the NCAA or at an American high school. And that's just centers, and doesn't include guys like Dirk Nowitzki, who I'm pretty sure has an MVP and Championship under his belt.

    The ignorance of some Raptor fans is astounding.
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    Quote letter n wrote: View Post
    really cause last time i checked every good big man in the league not named gasol came from the ncaa or american highschools.
    dirk
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  12. #112
    Raptors Republic Starter minks77's Avatar
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    Ryen Russillio is reporting that Vala's team is owned by Lithuanian Mobsters who will look to squeeze every last penny they can get out of MLSE before they let this kid go. Don't expect a simple buy out. They have Vala under contract for 3 more years I believe.

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    Quote minks77 wrote: View Post
    Ryen Russillio is reporting that Vala's team is owned by Lithuanian Mobsters who will look to squeeze every last penny they can get out of MLSE before they let this kid go. Don't expect a simple buy out. They have Vala under contract for 3 more years I believe.
    I'm not holding my breath, but it's also been reported that they're REALLY broke.
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  14. #114
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    1) Biedrins may be overrated, but he's still a good rebounder and good positional defender (mind you, I've mostly got this from seeing him in the playoffs and in previous seasons games, I didn't watch much GS last season).
    2) Tyson Chandler was considered a bust because of injuries and because people kept waiting for him to develop post moves which he was never comfortable with. If Val becomes one of the best post defenders in the NBA while being a limited offensive player, I think I'd be fairly comfortable with that for the 5th pick of a weak draft.
    3) According to reports, he's a good finisher already and has a decent jumper out to a few feet. The weaknesses of his I've seen have involved his weight (correctable) and post moves (teachable). No criticism of his position, his motivation, his hands, his instincts, his attitude, etc.
    4) We're a 22 win team, getting us Brandon Knight or Kemba Walker may have made us a 25 win team. Whoop de freakin doo. Knight is being compared to Billups, but he's also been compared to Bayless who I'd rather see develop anyway. I like Knight and Walker and think they both could become solid pros, but I'm not convinced they're the future. Hell there are some who opine that Irving may or may not be a stud, just a solid pro.
    5) San Antonio wanted him badly, even willing to trade their all star, finals mvp, french rap god point guard for him. The Rockets were quite keen on him. These are teams whose opinions I trust.
    6) We get a good draft pick next year, in what is being called the strongest draft since 03.
    7) His last name is spectacular for Scrabble.
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    Raptors Republic All-Star RaptorsFan4Life's Avatar
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  16. #116
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    Dirk isn't that type of big man, neither is Okur. I can name tons of European bigs that can shoot, but none can band down low.

    Yao I'll give you, but Sabonis, Divac and Illgauskus came into the league 20 years ago.

    The delusion of some Raptor fans is astounding.

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    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Casey isn't the most well spoken person to put in front of a mic but what he says is insightful and is no b.s.

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    Quote Letter N wrote: View Post
    Dirk isn't that type of big man, neither is Okur. I can name tons of European bigs that can shoot, but none can band down low.

    Yao I'll give you, but Sabonis, Divac and Illgauskus came into the league 20 years ago.

    The delusion of some Raptor fans is astounding.
    Ha. And Dirk did play a lot at the 5 in the finals.

    Well I'm glad you seem so sure about it, but from what i'm gathering there isn't a whole of negative press from people that get paid to have an opinion. He isn't a jump shooting 5.
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    Lietuvos Rytas owner, Vladimir Romanov

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vladimir_Romanov

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/foot...an/4396338.stm

    "Romanov's financial legitimacy was thoroughly checked before the likes of Robinson and his rival Leslie Deans sold out to the new regime."

    "But, like his friend and fellow Russian Roman Abramovich at Chelsea, you don't survive the mafia and corruption-filled Eastern European markets without developing a mean business streak."

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