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Has Bautista's All-Star Success Proved Bosh's US Exposure Claims to be false?

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  • #46
    GarbageTime wrote: View Post

    I was reading a Piston's blog the other day and they were breaking down all the draft picks by all teams in the NBA and grading them. Except they only had 29 teams... guess who was missing.

    http://www.detroitbadboys.com/2011/6...a-draft-grades
    That's shocking actually... I didn't even see anyone mention it in the comments section!(The bunch I skimmed through anyways...)

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    • #47
      Unless they JUST added it, I had no problem finding the B grade they gave the Raptors for the Valanciunas selection.

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      • #48
        Hassan wrote: View Post
        bosh sucked so he didnt get recognized end of story , vince was a beast so he did
        So he sucked to the tune on 4 consecutive all-star appearances as a Raptor? Really?

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        • #49
          MangoKid wrote: View Post
          So he sucked to the tune on 4 consecutive all-star appearances as a Raptor? Really?
          It was supposed to be the end of the story, this line in not admissible!

          Still don't see where they gave the Raps a B in that link though...

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          • #50
            Mack North wrote: View Post
            It was supposed to be the end of the story, this line in not admissible!

            Still don't see where they gave the Raps a B in that link though...
            I did find it after doing a (ctrl f) search... its lumped in with San Antonio

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            • #51
              Bendit wrote: View Post
              Tim Duncan is even "growing old" gracefully, with class and inclusive of team needs. He has taken a lesser role offensively to concentrate on defense and also minutes played so Popovich can manage his longevity and the inevitable.

              This is a very good point. Tim Duncan, has never craved the attention that Bosh did. He was not making parodies on the internet. He is not the type of player that needed to be wined and dined, and I doubt he needed teams to go the extra mile for him. He is more than comfortable just playing team basketball and staying out of the spotlight.

              Bosh, was always comparing himself to his draft class. In his mind, Melo, Wade and James had it better than him, and to a degree he did not respect Toronto the way Toronto respected him.

              This is not a knock against Bosh, its just human nature to want what we do not have.


              Also as has been pointed out, winning is what made Duncan who he is. If his teams were mediocre, he would never draw the attention that he has. People would regard him on the level of a Jermaine Oneal (prime), maybe an Elton Brand. A player that is formidable, but not someone that you will trade half your team for to get on your roster.
              Last edited by MyMomLovesMe; Wed Jul 6, 2011, 10:02 PM.

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              • #52
                Arsenalist wrote: View Post
                If Bosh led the league in scoring like Bautista does with home runs, he would have gotten his due as well. Bosh overestimates his own marketability without realizing that the market/media isn't undervaluing or ignoring him, they're giving him the same amount of pub that is deserved of a player of his caliber. When Bosh was in Toronto, I'd say he got more pub than someone like David West, and those two are pretty much on par, I'd even say West is better.

                Vince Carter led the league in All-Star votes by a distance while in Toronto, Roy Halladay was recognized every start on ESPN and so on. It's what you do, not where you play.
                I think that we as fans wanted to believe that Bosh was a franchise player and he was not. I don't think we have given him any credit for realizing this fact himself. He has chosen to try and get his attention on the backs of his teammates instead of on his own. He looked like he finally understood after the final game of the series that no matter how he is rolling on the court, he is not going to get touches unlike here when every play ran through him.

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                • #53
                  Why do you expect most fans to think of Bosh any other way than a "franchise player" when he himself, right up until the end, was saying he was a franchise player and that he wanted to be "the man" on any team he played for. I've always thought of him as more fit to be a second star on a team because most top teams don't have their big man making the plays during clutch time while the Raptors have been running counter to that ever since Vince Carter left town.

                  To bring this back to Toronto now, if Bargnani stays and is a focal point on offense and somehow Dwayne Casey cracks the code and wins a nobel prize for helping Bargnani discover defense and rebounding, they're still going to need a top flight wing who can break down defenses late in games and find ways to score when the opposing team is playing smothering playoff defense. That wing will get recognized at that point(DeRozan maybe). Bargnani would get recognized at that point. The whole team would get recognized at that point. When the Raptors surged back to the playoffs in 2008-2009 most American media wrote them off as overachieving flukes. If today they were still making the playoffs, that's five straight seasons, the fluke status would have been long lifted.
                  Last edited by Apollo; Thu Jul 7, 2011, 01:02 PM. Reason: more to say...

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                  • #54
                    Hilarious
                    http://www.onionsportsnetwork.com/ar...hot-car,19368/

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                    • #55
                      Apollo wrote: View Post
                      Why do you expect most fans to think of Bosh any other way than a "franchise player" when he himself, right up until the end, was saying he was a franchise player and that he wanted to be "the man" on any team he played for. I've always thought of him as more fit to be a second star on a team because most top teams don't have their big man making the plays during clutch time while the Raptors have been running counter to that ever since Vince Carter left town.

                      To bring this back to Toronto now, if Bargnani stays and is a focal point on offense and somehow Dwayne Casey cracks the code and wins a nobel prize for helping Bargnani discover defense and rebounding, they're still going to need a top flight wing who can break down defenses late in games and find ways to score when the opposing team is playing smothering playoff defense. That wing will get recognized at that point(DeRozan maybe). Bargnani would get recognized at that point. The whole team would get recognized at that point. When the Raptors surged back to the playoffs in 2008-2009 most American media wrote them off as overachieving flukes. If today they were still making the playoffs, that's five straight seasons, the fluke status would have been long lifted.
                      I agree, that was my point actually. I think Bosh finally can to terms with the fact that he is a second and not a first. I am not sure he is a third or forth option like he is currently in Miami, but that's their problem.

                      As for Bargnani, I don't see him as our first option either, and think he becomes much more potent on the perimeter and not in the post. But to give him an ounce of credit, he can score the ball. I believe he was 16th in the league in points last year, which may be attributed more to a lack of scoring from other players, but he can shoot and he is reasonably quick for a 7' player. Let's hope that he can develop some help defense skills this off season.

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                      • #56
                        Apollo wrote: View Post
                        Why do you expect most fans to think of Bosh any other way than a "franchise player" when he himself, right up until the end, was saying he was a franchise player and that he wanted to be "the man" on any team he played for. I've always thought of him as more fit to be a second star on a team because most top teams don't have their big man making the plays during clutch time while the Raptors have been running counter to that ever since Vince Carter left town.

                        To bring this back to Toronto now, if Bargnani stays and is a focal point on offense and somehow Dwayne Casey cracks the code and wins a nobel prize for helping Bargnani discover defense and rebounding, they're still going to need a top flight wing who can break down defenses late in games and find ways to score when the opposing team is playing smothering playoff defense. That wing will get recognized at that point(DeRozan maybe). Bargnani would get recognized at that point. The whole team would get recognized at that point. When the Raptors surged back to the playoffs in 2008-2009 most American media wrote them off as overachieving flukes. If today they were still making the playoffs, that's five straight seasons, the fluke status would have been long lifted.
                        Couldn't agree more.
                        Walking like I'm already there.

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                        • #57
                          Come on. Everyone knew Bosh was not a franchise player. The only reason people started categorizing Bosh as a potential franchise player was because Carter left. I was 14 when they started hyping Bosh and even then I knew they were lying to my face.

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                          • #58
                            When you get Big Papi calling you to play on his team you know you're good! Bosh moving to Miami only made him a tad more popular. Like people have said already it's not who you play for but what you do.

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                            • #59
                              It's winning and performance that gets a player noticed by fans and the media and not where you play.

                              Bosh will never play at an elite level and as result, he will not receive the noteriety he craves. He may ride on LeBron's and Wade's coat-tails and win a ring - but he will never be in the same conversation with those two legit stars.

                              Back in the day when the Blue Jays were winning back-to-back championships - Toronto had no problem getting a ton of publicity and free agents flocked here.

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                              • #60
                                Krix wrote: View Post
                                Come on. Everyone knew Bosh was not a franchise player. The only reason people started categorizing Bosh as a potential franchise player was because Carter left. I was 14 when they started hyping Bosh and even then I knew they were lying to my face.
                                I'm not so sure about that. Some thought he wasn't a franchise player, sure. But there were alot that did (I'd wager the majority but their is hardly hard evidence for that).

                                I remember having a lot of debates/disagreements with people who said Bosh was a franchise player and/or the best PF in the league (and getting called everything from racist to a moron for not believing or agreeing with them). A lot of people changed their tune when last year (especially last offseason) came around..... but prior to that, himself, the team and a huge contingent of fans thought he was.

                                Its hardly anything new though... fans of all teams a tendency to overvalue their 'best' player. Danny Granger, Ben Gordon (in Chicago), Brook Lopez... etc. When these guys are young these guys can apparently only "get better"... reality is what they do, is probably pretty close to what they will always do. (I'm expecting John Wall to be the next on this list)

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