View Poll Results: Grade Valanciunas' Season

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  • A

    29 26.85%
  • B

    60 55.56%
  • C

    17 15.74%
  • D

    0 0%
  • F

    2 1.85%
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Thread: Everything Valanciunas

  1. #2801
    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    Quote Mediumcore wrote: View Post
    No ulterior motives behind not mentioning the minutes, but does he get less minutes because he tends to make a lot more mistakes (my first question about slower development)? Or is it just those other guys on the list are allowed to play through their mistakes? PER is through the roof on a couple of those guys too.
    I think it's not only a matter of minutes played but, especially compared to those players, Valanciunas is really an afterthought in DC's offense. I think it speaks to the various methods of developing young players. Davis & Drummond were spoon-fed minutes & opportunities from day 1, being on horrendous teams. Kanter didn't get much burn until this season, playing behind Jefferson & Millsap. JV has taken a similar route as Kanter, but more due to coaching decisions, rather than team depth.

    I'd love JV to get more playing time and more opportunities on offense. I'd also like to see MU bring in a veteran C to play behind and mentor JV throughout the season.

  2. #2802
    Raptors Republic All-Star JimiCliff's Avatar
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    Quote Mediumcore wrote: View Post
    That's a good point, but there were some people saying JV could have gone second in that draft. IMO JV isn't doing poorly but hasn't looked as good as I thought he might. Just curious if others feel the same way or are my expectations too high.
    Of course his PER is low; he's playing on a team with multiple players that can SCORE AT WILL. Why should they ever get him the ball?!?

  3. #2803
    Raptors Republic All-Star Mediumcore's Avatar
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    So I guess there are no concerns as it pertains to JV. Carry on.

  4. #2804
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote Mediumcore wrote: View Post
    That's a good point, but there were some people saying JV could have gone second in that draft. IMO JV isn't doing poorly but hasn't looked as good as I thought he might. Just curious if others feel the same way or are my expectations too high.
    I think expectations are too high for him. Still think 13/8.5 this season on 55%+ shooting is a reasonable goal.

    Definitely think he has underachieved a bit too.

    Definitely think he is being underutilized and not getting an opportunity to play through mistakes which is unfortunate considering any success this team has this season or in the future is going to contingent on his development.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  5. #2805
    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    Quote Mediumcore wrote: View Post
    So I guess there are no concerns as it pertains to JV. Carry on.
    I will develop a concern if DC continues to underutilize him, especially if it becomes apparent that the team is focusing on the future and his playing time & usage don't both increase.

  6. #2806
    Raptors Republic Superstar Puffer's Avatar
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    As has been noted numerous times, JV battles for position, gets it, and is looked off. And with DeMar and Rudy shooting whatever stupid % of the Raptors shots, how much opportunity does JV get?

    I think the last few games, where the Raps make 6 trips down the floor, JV gets the ball 5 times and comes away with 8 points tells you what you need to know. As for rebounding, Amir does a good job, And Rudy and Lowry do pretty good jobs of rebounding as well. JV is doing just fine.

  7. #2807
    Raptors Republic Superstar isaacthompson's Avatar
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    Quote Mediumcore wrote: View Post
    Just browsing the general stats from some of the other young, up and coming centres in the league

    pts/rebs/blks/per:

    Anthony Davis - 21/11/3.1/29.83 (that's nuts by the way)
    Andre Drummond - 11/11/1.6/21.65 (outstanding)
    Enes Kanter - 16/7/0.8/17.45
    JV - 9/7/1.1/13.96

    Is there anything to be concerned about with JV's seemingly slower development (College experience vs. Euroleague debate)?

    Is he maybe not as good as the hype that surrounds him (Is JV more Noah than Dwight)?

    Is he maybe not as athletic as thes other players (He seems to be plodding up and down the court, and doesn't exactly jump that high. He's not the athlete he looked like he was in his teens)?

    Thoughts?
    You have to take into account that fact that JV's touching the ball a maximum of 5 times a game. There's zero offense oriented around him, which is surprising considering he's touted as the face of the franchise for years to come.
    Twitter - @thekid_it

  8. #2808
    Raptors Republic Veteran rocwell's Avatar
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    JV will never meet his expectations if we keep two highly-scoring wings.

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  10. #2809
    Raptors Republic Veteran white men can't jump's Avatar
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    JV's doing fine. He's still just a 2nd year player and his going to have some bad games pretty frequently. He actually hasn't played badly in a lot of the games, and has definitely been underutilized...

    In general Casey hasn't done a great job involving our bigs. I mean, when's the last time you saw Amir catching a pass on the roll for a dunk? I feel like he hasn't gotten to finish on one all year, but I really could be wrong...Still it feels that way. Same for Jonas where I don't think he's had more than 3 or 4. It's really sad that they don't run it more. Wonder if they'll try to work it in.

  11. #2810
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote white men can't jump wrote: View Post
    JV's doing fine. He's still just a 2nd year player and his going to have some bad games pretty frequently. He actually hasn't played badly in a lot of the games, and has definitely been underutilized...

    In general Casey hasn't done a great job involving our bigs. I mean, when's the last time you saw Amir catching a pass on the roll for a dunk? I feel like he hasn't gotten to finish on one all year, but I really could be wrong...Still it feels that way. Same for Jonas where I don't think he's had more than 3 or 4. It's really sad that they don't run it more. Wonder if they'll try to work it in.
    Probably not.

    Remember Casey's desire? Shooters. He wanted shooters for his high school sets.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

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  13. #2811
    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    He wanted shooters for his high school sets.
    HAHAHA This made me laugh ... one of those "its funny because its completely true" situations.

    The offensive plays Casey runs could literally be picked up at a Coaching Seminar at Humber College over a weekend.
    In Masai we Trust.

  14. #2812
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    As long as we have both, DeMar and Gay, on this team, JV will never get enough touches and he'll never get into any kind of rhythm (season). For a developping player with JV's potential there's nothing more important than getting regular touches and a lot of playing time.

    JV should be playing 35+ minutes a game and taking 15-20 shots a game. Even (and especially) when he plays against the big frontcourts like Memphis' or Indiana, etc. He has to get the opportunities to fail, learn and adapt/improve. Right now it's incredibly frustrating to watch him working the whole time setting those screens, rolling to the basket, posting up, presenting himself and never getting the ball.

    He's been visibly frustrated over the last couple of games and in the game against Bulls he even seemed somewhat desinterested. And that is what I fear most. The guy is doing everything he should to get some touches, they never come and at some point he can't take it no more and loses interest in playing with his teammates who never share the ball...

    I don't think we're there yet, I don't think JV is giving up, but he's visibly unhappy how the offense is run and he's unhappy with his role. Things need to change and fast. It's not like we're gonna win the championship with Gay and DeRozan leading the way. So why not put in the work into improving JV's game while we find a new home for Gay or whoever it is that Masai is gonna trade sooner or later?

    I'm not a pro-tanker, but I see little sense in trying to win games with this current roster. I'm not against winning and making the playoffs this year, but if it comes at the expense of JV's, Ross's improvement by sticking to this kind of crap ISO ball (especially when it's obvious this roster will get blown up sooner or later) just doesn't make sense. I mean, if you don't develop your young players and at the same time you don't plan on keeping your "star" players (Gay, DeRozan, Lowry) what is it exactly that you're trying to accomplish?

    Masai must make some moves and quick or I see us failing this season in every single way, even if we were to make the playoffs.

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  16. #2813
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote BadDinosaur wrote: View Post
    As long as we have both, DeMar and Gay, on this team, JV will never get enough touches and he'll never get into any kind of rhythm (season). For a developping player with JV's potential there's nothing more important than getting regular touches and a lot of playing time.

    JV should be playing 35+ minutes a game and taking 15-20 shots a game. Even (and especially) when he plays against the big frontcourts like Memphis' or Indiana, etc. He has to get the opportunities to fail, learn and adapt/improve. Right now it's incredibly frustrating to watch him working the whole time setting those screens, rolling to the basket, posting up, presenting himself and never getting the ball.

    He's been visibly frustrated over the last couple of games and in the game against Bulls he even seemed somewhat desinterested. And that is what I fear most. The guy is doing everything he should to get some touches, they never come and at some point he can't take it no more and loses interest in playing with his teammates who never share the ball...

    I don't think we're there yet, I don't think JV is giving up, but he's visibly unhappy how the offense is run and he's unhappy with his role. Things need to change and fast. It's not like we're gonna win the championship with Gay and DeRozan leading the way. So why not put in the work into improving JV's game while we find a new home for Gay or whoever it is that Masai is gonna trade sooner or later?

    I'm not a pro-tanker, but I see little sense in trying to win games with this current roster. I'm not against winning and making the playoffs this year, but if it comes at the expense of JV's, Ross's improvement by sticking to this kind of crap ISO ball (especially when it's obvious this roster will get blown up sooner or later) just doesn't make sense. I mean, if you don't develop your young players and at the same time you don't plan on keeping your "star" players (Gay, DeRozan, Lowry) what is it exactly that you're trying to accomplish?

    Masai must make some moves and quick or I see us failing this season in every single way, even if we were to make the playoffs.
    I agree with your points.

    Luckily still 72 games to be played and hopefully there will be about 55-60 when it is finally blown to smithereens.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  17. #2814
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    I agree with your points.

    Luckily still 72 games to be played and hopefully there will be about 55-60 when it is finally blown to smithereens.
    But it needs to get done like right NOW. Not 50-60 games into the season.

  18. #2815
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote BadDinosaur wrote: View Post
    But it needs to get done like right NOW. Not 50-60 games into the season.
    I meant there will be 55-60 games left in the season; 25-30 games in; late December.

    I agree with your sense of urgency but not much can be done until December 15th when free agents can be traded.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  19. #2816
    Raptors Republic Superstar Superjudge's Avatar
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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    HAHAHA This made me laugh ... one of those "its funny because its completely true" situations.

    The offensive plays Casey runs could literally be picked up at a Coaching Seminar at Humber College over a weekend.
    Oh I don't know, can you tell me, for CERTAIN, that you know exactly what he runs, how its supposed to go, etc? You know they made the term "Coach Killer" for a reason. Toronto has a few on the roster.

  20. #2817
    Raptors Republic All-Star JimiCliff's Avatar
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    Quote white men can't jump wrote: View Post
    JV's doing fine. He's still just a 2nd year player and his going to have some bad games pretty frequently. He actually hasn't played badly in a lot of the games, and has definitely been underutilized...

    In general Casey hasn't done a great job involving our bigs. I mean, when's the last time you saw Amir catching a pass on the roll for a dunk? I feel like he hasn't gotten to finish on one all year, but I really could be wrong...Still it feels that way. Same for Jonas where I don't think he's had more than 3 or 4. It's really sad that they don't run it more. Wonder if they'll try to work it in.
    I think that's more a function of Jose having been brilliant on the pick and roll, while our current guards are brutal at it.

  21. #2818
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    I meant there will be 55-60 games left in the season; 25-30 games in; late December.

    I agree with your sense of urgency but not much can be done until December 15th when free agents can be traded.
    Alright, my bad, got it now!

    Yeah, I wish we had a no nonsense coach like Popovic that would sit Gay and DeRozan after a couple bonehead shots, it would make this whole waiting thing much more interesting Can you imagine Popovich coaching our team? What a clash that would be!!! :O ...OMG...

  22. #2819
    Raptors Republic Superstar planetmars's Avatar
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    I do think that MU is going to blow it up after December 15th... if he trades DD/RG/KL then there is hope for JV to get some more touches but it's not a guarantee when you have a coach like Casey. What I'd prefer to see is a blow up but with Casey getting replaced by someone else who is told to develop first and win later. What if the guys we get back for Rudy and Lowry are veterans like Gordon or Butler? Would you expect Casey to feed JV when Butler/Gordon would love to have the ball in their hands (using those two as examples)?

    Even Bosh who was a goal post when he came into the league averaged 9.5 FGA's a game as a rookie. JV averaged 5.9 attempts last year and is averaging 7.7 this year. That's pretty pathetic for the guy that's supposed to be the franchise.

    I hope MU finds a coach that is willing to give JV the ball more often, or if he trades RG/KL or DD that shots open up for him or else when he hits RFA status it will be a big question of whether he would be worth his extension or not.

  23. #2820
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote planetmars wrote: View Post
    I do think that MU is going to blow it up after December 15th... if he trades DD/RG/KL then there is hope for JV to get some more touches but it's not a guarantee when you have a coach like Casey. What I'd prefer to see is a blow up but with Casey getting replaced by someone else who is told to develop first and win later. What if the guys we get back for Rudy and Lowry are veterans like Gordon or Butler? Would you expect Casey to feed JV when Butler/Gordon would love to have the ball in their hands (using those two as examples)?

    Even Bosh who was a goal post when he came into the league averaged 9.5 FGA's a game as a rookie. JV averaged 5.9 attempts last year and is averaging 7.7 this year. That's pretty pathetic for the guy that's supposed to be the franchise.

    I hope MU finds a coach that is willing to give JV the ball more often, or if he trades RG/KL or DD that shots open up for him or else when he hits RFA status it will be a big question of whether he would be worth his extension or not.
    You waive them before March 1st so they can play with a playoff team and use the last month and a half to sign minimum deals or 10 day contracts.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

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