View Poll Results: Grade Valanciunas' Season

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  • A

    29 26.85%
  • B

    60 55.56%
  • C

    17 15.74%
  • D

    0 0%
  • F

    2 1.85%
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Thread: Everything Valanciunas

  1. #2881
    Raptors Republic Veteran white men can't jump's Avatar
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    Just for fun question of the day: would Jonas be the 1st pick in the 2011 draft knowing what we know now?

    Irving has another injury, a minor one, and has still not shown the ability to elevate his teammates. Does he have ridiculous talent? Sure. But does it really contribute to winning? So far, not very much. People can say Cleveland's roster is flawed, but to contrast, so is Charlotte's (undeniably flawed), and Walker, while not as talented or productive as Irving, is consistently helping his team win more games and being a leader.

    Williams is basically a 'bust' at this point for a #2 pick.

    Kanter is slow-footed on D, loves taking jumpers, and plays below the rim. He started the season hot, but has been struggling mightily since. Just doesn't seem to have enough variety of skills both basketball-wise and physically.

    Thompson is a good energy PF, and I commend him for being able to totally switch his shooting hand with positive results. But it's still kind of ridiculous Cleveland took an energy PF over a guy whose worst case was a high-energy two-way C.

    Obviously there's no debate about "at the time", because Irving was basically a consensus top overall pick. But Jonas is looking like he has a very good chance to be the highest impact player for that draft.

    *Honourable mentions for Klay Thompson and Kawhi Leonard, who could easily have been top 5 picks in retrospect.

  2. #2882
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    Quote consmap wrote: View Post
    ... His jump shot hasn't been going in lately but I'm not too concerned, it'll start falling eventually.
    Yeah, no worry there. He seems to be still doing a lot of thinking when playing on offense. He hesitates when to take that jumper, when to drive... you feel like he's still on a very steep learning curve, but already contributing in major ways towards winning basketball games. Once he will settle down a bit and starts playing automatic with less thinking, I think, he'll be knocking down them jumpers on a consistent basis. He looks already like someone who'll be able to easily drop 18 points and pull down 10 rebounds in 30 minutes of playing time on a consistent basis. Maybe as soon as by the end of this season...

  3. #2883
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    Last edited by MixxAOR; Thu Jan 2nd, 2014 at 03:04 PM.

  4. #2884
    Raptors Republic Superstar Puffer's Avatar
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    Nice find. JV continuing to grow.

  5. #2885
    Raptors Republic Starter omgsomuchpotential's Avatar
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    Quote white men can't jump wrote: View Post
    Just for fun question of the day: would Jonas be the 1st pick in the 2011 draft knowing what we know now?
    These are the guys that I think were definitely better:
    Kyrie Irving (he's still a star in the making)
    Nikola Vucevic

    These are close calls:
    Chandler Parsons
    Kemba Walker
    Tristan Thompson
    Klay Thompson
    Kawhi Leonard
    Kenneth Faried
    Jimmy Butler
    Isaiah Thomas

    I would personally prefer him over all of the 'close calls' because he's a true center prospect, those are quite rare. So yeah, he's a 3rd pick in my mock re-draft, but I'd agree that a case COULD be made for Jonas being the 1st pick, with Kyrie possibly being injury-prone and Vucevic being 1.5 years older and further along in his development because of it.

    P.S. Although it could also be Lithuanian homerism talking here.
    Last edited by omgsomuchpotential; Fri Jan 3rd, 2014 at 09:53 AM.

  6. #2886
    Raptors Republic Superstar FoxMachine's Avatar
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    LOL JV made the "reaction GIFs" segment on ebaumsworld: http://www.ebaumsworld.com/pictures/view/83758945/

  7. #2887
    Raptors Republic Veteran rocwell's Avatar
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    "The Cavaliers could've had Kyrie Irving and Toronto center Jonas Valanciunas in the 2011 draft class, but Grant balked on using the fourth overall pick on the center everyone else would've selected there. Several reasons factored in, but there had been a strong belief within the Cavaliers personnel department that Grant hadn't scouted Valanciunas hard enough to gain full confidence in his abilities. Cleveland's international scouts raved about the 7-footer, and most of the Cleveland's staff agreed with them, sources said.

    In the end, Grant wanted Valanciunas' agents to give the Cavaliers a signed buyout agreement with Lithuanian club Lietuvos Rytas that guaranteed the center would join the NBA for his rookie season. His agents at Creative Artists Agency, including Leon Rose, had a reasonable counter, sources said. They wanted the ability to negotiate the buyout once Valanciunas' rookie draft salary had been slotted. And Toronto, with the fifth pick, wanted Valanciunas badly and never demanded the signed buyout as a prerequisite to draft him, sources said.

    Within the Cavaliers, the belief was that Grant was searching for a way to cross Valanciunas off the list and draft a player that he believed to be a safer bet: Texas' Tristan Thompson. What's more, Rich Paul, James' childhood friend and player agent now, represented Thompson."

    So cavs wanted pre-draft contract with "Lietuvos Rytas". We should send thanks/card note to Grant, dude's brain doesn't know how to think about future.

  8. #2888
    Raptors Republic All-Star Letter N's Avatar
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    Has any team actually benefited from signing a player simply because they had the same agent as a player they actually wanted?

  9. #2889
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Default TSN Guy: Raptors exercise patience with V

    Long article. Be sure to click link to get it all.

    With just over one minute remaining in double OT, the game tied at 116, Valanciunas negated a Vasquez runner, needlessly tipping in the shot that was already on its way down, above the cylinder. The look of frustration on the sophomore's face said it all. This was not his night.

    The Raptors were outscored by 14 points in the 29 minutes that Valanciunas was on the floor.

    "I feel really sad," Valanciunas lamented, with his head down after the game. "I feel really bad right now. I could do a much better job than what I did."

    Valanciunas lost more than his rhythm, sitting as long as he did in the second half of Thursday's ball game. His confidence appeared to be at an all-time low.

    The second-year centre has had a rough couple of weeks, averaging 7.1 points and 7.6 rebounds, shooting 45 per cent in 24 minutes per in his last eight games. Over the previous eight contests, he put up averages of 15.4 points, 10.8 rebounds, shot 58 per cent from the field and logged just over 29 minutes a night. Perhaps fatigue has played a factor - he eclipsed his minute total from his rookie season last week - but the most noticeable variation in his approach hinders on an immeasurable concept that he has downplayed in the past.

    Swagger.

    Valanciunas is a different animal when he plays with that edge, anger and fire, when he gets outside of his head, stops over-thinking the game and just plays basketball. Too often you can almost see his thought process on the court, his movements are robotic as he aims to avoid disaster, fearful of making a mistake that will draw the ire of his head coach. However, he's at his best when he plays freely and Casey knows it.

    "The key is patience, not getting down on yourself, have fun," Casey said after morning shoot-around on Thursday. "I mean you're playing basketball. There's no pressure on JV to produce. The pressure is on DeMar (DeRozan) and Kyle (Lowry) and Amir, the older guys."

    http://www.tsn.ca/nba/story/?id=444918
    There have been lots of debates on Casey's handling of young players. Personally, I'm not a fan. I find he destroys confidence and has an unhealthy obsession with age versus talent. One could make the case, "Hey, look at Ross!" My reply would be, "Right, after Gay was traded and Casey was left with little choice."

    Anyways, if the goal is to build through the draft Casey is not the coach for that in my opinion.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

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  11. #2890
    Raptors Republic Veteran MACK11's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Long article. Be sure to click link to get it all.



    There have been lots of debates on Casey's handling of young players. Personally, I'm not a fan. I find he destroys confidence and has an unhealthy obsession with age versus talent. One could make the case, "Hey, look at Ross!" My reply would be, "Right, after Gay was traded and Casey was left with little choice."

    Anyways, if the goal is to build through the draft Casey is not the coach for that in my opinion.
    Exactly Casey is infatuated with vets! He always talks about the young guys developing is his main duty but that's not true if anyone watches the games you can clearly see he never gives younger guys min unless he has to. Yeah imagine Rudy was still here Terrence would just be sulking on the bench doing absolutely nothing

  12. #2891
    Raptors Republic Starter KHD's Avatar
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    Quote 4hunnit_degreez wrote: View Post
    Exactly Casey is infatuated with vets! He always talks about the young guys developing is his main duty but that's not true if anyone watches the games you can clearly see he never gives younger guys min unless he has to. Yeah imagine Rudy was still here Terrence would just be sulking on the bench doing absolutely nothing
    Yep.

    Casey is by nature not a good coach for a young team, and on top of that he's trying to save his job this year so he's even less willing to let young guys play.

  13. #2892
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    Quote KHD wrote: View Post
    Yep.

    Casey is by nature not a good coach for a young team, and on top of that he's trying to save his job this year so he's even less willing to let young guys play.
    let JV play so we can lose? the Wizards game showed why Casey is a genius for not playing him

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  15. #2893
    Raptors Republic Superstar Superjudge's Avatar
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    umm... vets play most on every team from Midgit boys basketball up.
    wtf guys.

  16. #2894
    Raptors Republic All-Star OldSkoolCool's Avatar
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    Quote UnderdogRaptors wrote: View Post
    let JV play so we can lose? the Wizards game showed why Casey is a genius for not playing him
    Well the Wizard game was especially poor...and he should have sat. But it is when he plays well he isn't rewarded with more PT and still sees the bench for a majority of the game

  17. #2895
    Raptors Republic Superstar Axel's Avatar
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    Quote UnderdogRaptors wrote: View Post
    let JV play so we can lose? the Wizards game showed why Casey is a genius for not playing him
    We lost anyway, so I don't see the correlation.

    Quote OldSkoolCool wrote: View Post
    Well the Wizard game was especially poor...and he should have sat. But it is when he plays well he isn't rewarded with more PT and still sees the bench for a majority of the game
    JV was put into an impossible situation when he finally got in. He had sat for far too long to be able to step in and play at a high level. That's on Casey. He has to manage his rotations to get the young man in. Amir and PP both had foul trouble, so why not give JV a minute or two of burn and let one of those guys rest in the 4th? Then going small ball with Salmons over JV, that's got to be a kick in the confidence if I've ever seen one.

  18. #2896
    Raptors Republic All-Star Mediumcore's Avatar
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    I actually like the way Casey has developed Ross and JV. All rookies come into the league with bad habits, and giving them minutes for the sake of giving them minutes would have cultivated those bad habits (ie. Triano's handling of Bargnani). Getting benched for making the same mistakes is sometimes a great tool for a teacher.

  19. #2897
    Raptors Republic Superstar Axel's Avatar
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    Quote Mediumcore wrote: View Post
    I actually like the way Casey has developed Ross and JV. All rookies come into the league with bad habits, and giving them minutes for the sake of giving them minutes would have cultivated those bad habits (ie. Triano's handling of Bargnani). Getting benched for making the same mistakes is sometimes a great tool for a teacher.
    But Casey burying JV on the bench for the entire second half is extreme. You have to give a player opportunities to play to show that they have learned from their mistake. Straight sitting should be for disciplinary purposes or if a guy straight up ignores the coaching staff (ie - Nick Young, JaVale McGee, Andray Blatche type decisions).

    Casey then put JV in an impossible situation in OT; which was a disservice for JV's confidence and for the team trying to win an important game. Having JV completely "out of the game" then throwing him in for the second OT is not putting your team in a good situation either. You need to balance between the hot hand and keeping the bench engaged.

    As a coach, I know this is one of the things I have always found the hardest, but that's why you have assistants to keep track of the bench. "Hey coach, JV's been out a long time. We should get him in there for a bit". Boom, sub in JV and let PP and Amir rest for 2 mins each (resulting in a nice 4 min stretch for JV to stay engaged).

    Let JV know, he's got 4 mins, so leave it all on the floor. He'll bust his butt for 4 mins knowing it's his only chance to leave an impression in the game. That should provide a nice boost (stagger it over the 3rd/4th quarter breaks to maximize the rest for Amir/PP) and could make the difference in the game. It helps with JV's confidence, keeps more players engaged in the game, and could ultimately help you win the game (either with the boost of his 4 mins or the added freshness of your hot hands).

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  21. #2898
    Raptors Republic Starter 3inthekeon's Avatar
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    Quote Axel wrote: View Post
    JV was put into an impossible situation when he finally got in. He had sat for far too long to be able to step in and play at a high level. That's on Casey. He has to manage his rotations to get the young man in. Amir and PP both had foul trouble, so why not give JV a minute or two of burn and let one of those guys rest in the 4th? Then going small ball with Salmons over JV, that's got to be a kick in the confidence if I've ever seen one.
    Putting him in for a minute or two in the fourth would have been great. Then we could have complained that "Casey puts him in for a minute or two and then yanks him? No wonder JV's confidence is shot!" No matter what Casey does with respect to JV it's going to be derided by some. JV is not progressing because of Casey. TR is progressing despite Casey. Got it.

  22. #2899
    Raptors Republic Superstar Axel's Avatar
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    Quote 3inthekeon wrote: View Post
    Putting him in for a minute or two in the fourth would have been great. Then we could have complained that "Casey puts him in for a minute or two and then yanks him? No wonder JV's confidence is shot!" No matter what Casey does with respect to JV it's going to be derided by some. JV is not progressing because of Casey. TR is progressing despite Casey. Got it.
    I'm confused by your post, are you agreeing or disagreeing? Or both?

  23. #2900
    Raptors Republic Superstar Axel's Avatar
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    JV is smart enough to know when the other bigs on the team are out-playing him and when he is making mistakes. Point is, communicate with him, but give him the opportunity and keep him a part of the game. Otherwise, when you do have to turn to him (as what happened vs Washington when players fouled out), you've hurt both the team's chances of success and JV's confidence. A double whammy that can easily be avoided. If JV goes in and plays well, then you can extend the minutes beyond 4. If he is continuing to struggle, then you allow rest for the others.

    It's also important to note that JV isn't the center of our offence, so if he is struggling, it's not a death blow like it would be if Lowry/DD or even GV was playing poorly.

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