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  • #16
    Normally I would look at a guy like Battier, see no ring, look at his age and naturally assume that he doesn't want anything to do with a rebuilding team but in this case what's coming from Battier makes it sound like he cares more about the money and years rather than the team:

    I've heard (and this is not fact) that Battier is seeking a contract starting at the mid-level exception (or around $5 million). I've also heard the Griz aren't willing to pay that.
    Source: Commercialappeal.com

    Battier said he’s hoping to get a three- or four-year deal.
    Source: NBCsports.com

    But he also did say this:
    "I want to be in a happy place. I want to go to work and enjoy it. When you go to work and you have a chance to win every night, your job is way better. That’s for any profession, but you want to have a role and be able to contribute to winning.”
    Source: NBCsports.com

    That said, I wouldn't rule out rebuilding teams if they're not far out from winning as long as they're the top bid. Battier would be an excellent addition... I just don't want to see them make plays for guys like this when we're a little less than seven months out from when they take the next step forward. I'd much rather sit through growing pains in a shortened season.

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    • #17
      Kurt Thomas to help guild our bigs. If Jose is traded Anthony Carter to help guide Bayless. If Marvin Williams was cut I'd look at him as well (assuming we cut Kleiza).

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      • #18
        Battier? Really? You want to pay $5 million a year for a guy who might not even be able to contribute when the team is actually good?

        And SuperRaptor, if you think that there won't be teams lining up to sign one of the best wing defenders in the league who also has one of the highest basketball IQs in the game, can hit the open shot and is basically a perfect role player, you've got another thing coming. If I'm Orlando, the Lakers, San Antonio, Dallas, Chicago, or any number of other playoff teams, he's going to be one of the first free agents I call on December 5th.

        And after being on mediocre teams throughout his NBA career, I hope he latches on to a contender. I like the guy far too much to see him toil on a lottery team. And I really doubt he'd do that.
        Read my blog, The Picket Fence. Guaranteed to make you think or your money back!
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        • #19
          joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
          Put Dan Gadzuric on my list of DON'T sign. haha
          Unfortunately Gadzuric signed in China; would have been a lock otherwise.

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          • #20
            Tim W. wrote: View Post
            Battier? Really? You want to pay $5 million a year for a guy who might not even be able to contribute when the team is actually good?

            And SuperRaptor, if you think that there won't be teams lining up to sign one of the best wing defenders in the league who also has one of the highest basketball IQs in the game, can hit the open shot and is basically a perfect role player, you've got another thing coming. If I'm Orlando, the Lakers, San Antonio, Dallas, Chicago, or any number of other playoff teams, he's going to be one of the first free agents I call on December 5th.

            And after being on mediocre teams throughout his NBA career, I hope he latches on to a contender. I like the guy far too much to see him toil on a lottery team. And I really doubt he'd do that.
            I'd give Battier a $22-$24 million contract for 5 years. With all the qualities you mentioned - high IQ, perfect role player - he would be outstanding for the Raptors. He'd help shift the culture which is what we desparately need. Casey is a good start, but a coach in my opinion doesn't really have that much power in the NBA unless your name is Phil, Greg or Jerry (and both Jerry and Phil are out of jobs right now).

            We have a lot of young talent, and no veterans other than Jose - and Jose is not really the leader our team needs. You bring in Battier, and our team will be even better a year or two from now.

            If we amnesty Linas, trade Bargnani for picks and expiring contracts, trade Barbosa, and let Jose's contract expire in two years - Battier's contract won't be so bad.. he would be a mid-level player earning his keep - the same amount Jarrett Jack made yet no one seemed to care.

            Also now a days a 32-year old player is still young in the NBA, especially when you see players like Allen, Nash, Garnett and Kobe still playing strong.

            Your wish to have Battier play for a contender sounds great - but wouldn't it be better if that happened while he was a Raptor in say 3 or 4 years, while helping mold our team to become such a contender in the next 2 years?

            There are only a few players I'd try and get my hands on, even as a rebuild is taking place.. Battier is one of those guys for me.

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            • #21
              planetmars wrote: View Post
              I'd give Battier a $22-$24 million contract for 5 years. With all the qualities you mentioned - high IQ, perfect role player - he would be outstanding for the Raptors. He'd help shift the culture which is what we desparately need. Casey is a good start, but a coach in my opinion doesn't really have that much power in the NBA unless your name is Phil, Greg or Jerry (and both Jerry and Phil are out of jobs right now).
              Battier is 32. How's that contract going to look in two years?

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              • #22
                planetmars wrote: View Post
                I'd give Battier a $22-$24 million contract for 5 years. With all the qualities you mentioned - high IQ, perfect role player - he would be outstanding for the Raptors. He'd help shift the culture which is what we desparately need. Casey is a good start, but a coach in my opinion doesn't really have that much power in the NBA unless your name is Phil, Greg or Jerry (and both Jerry and Phil are out of jobs right now).

                We have a lot of young talent, and no veterans other than Jose - and Jose is not really the leader our team needs. You bring in Battier, and our team will be even better a year or two from now.

                If we amnesty Linas, trade Bargnani for picks and expiring contracts, trade Barbosa, and let Jose's contract expire in two years - Battier's contract won't be so bad.. he would be a mid-level player earning his keep - the same amount Jarrett Jack made yet no one seemed to care.

                Also now a days a 32-year old player is still young in the NBA, especially when you see players like Allen, Nash, Garnett and Kobe still playing strong.

                Your wish to have Battier play for a contender sounds great - but wouldn't it be better if that happened while he was a Raptor in say 3 or 4 years, while helping mold our team to become such a contender in the next 2 years?

                There are only a few players I'd try and get my hands on, even as a rebuild is taking place.. Battier is one of those guys for me.
                Battier is 33; after five years he'll be 38 in his last year and still on the payroll. Right now there are only about 15/20 guys over 36 in the league and maybe half of them play significant mintues. Bad plan signing him on a long contract.

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                • #23
                  Ray Allen is 36 and Steve Nash is 37.. yet these guys are still playing strong, and would probably play for a few more years.

                  When Battier is 35/36/37, we'll be contenders. In the meantime he's earning his keep by helping change the culture of our team into a gritty defensive team.. the kind you need to be a contender.

                  The age doesn't matter as much to me I guess.. considering the type of talent I'm getting back. I just think that the knowledge that a lot of NBA players (and athletes in general) have to help have a long lasting career shouldn't make someone who's 32 now going into his last contract a bad thing, especially one that seems to be one of the smartest players in the league.

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                  • #24
                    Ray Allen and Steve Nash are exceptions to the rule. Is it best plan the future based on rare occurrences or is it best to plan the future based on the norm?

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                    • #25
                      Apollo wrote: View Post
                      Ray Allen and Steve Nash are exceptions to the rule. Is it best plan the future based on rare occurrences or is it best to plan the future based on the norm?
                      I actually think those rare occurrences are becoming the norm based on the improvements in training, diet and nutrition programs.. but you have to look at each individual athlete and their track record to see which slot they would fit in. Battier in my opinion is more like Allen and Nash then what you would consider the norm. He doesn't have that many nba games under his belt since he came in as a senior - he has a very strong IQ and is considered one of the smartest guys in the league.

                      It's the risk takers that end up on top though, not the guys that do what everyone else does. Can you name me another player like Battier who is younger and worth about $5 million or less? Even in two years time, I can't think of someone like that - someone who wants to guard the Lebron's, Wade's, or Carmelo's of the league, do a heck of a job, not complain afterwards, and help train the young guys on the team how to do the same thing he just did.

                      Just like Nash would be a great mentor for a future PG.. Battier could be that mentor for our wings.

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                      • #26
                        I'd need to see proof of that. There's a difference between collecting a pay cheque and playing at a high level. Steve Nash and Ray Allen have been playing at a high level... Well Allen was up to last season. He's regressing rapidly.

                        An important note that didn't immediately "click" is the Raptors can't offer five years.

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                        • #27
                          planetmars wrote: View Post
                          I actually think those rare occurrences are becoming the norm based on the improvements in training, diet and nutrition programs.. but you have to look at each individual athlete and their track record to see which slot they would fit in. Battier in my opinion is more like Allen and Nash then what you would consider the norm. He doesn't have that many nba games under his belt since he came in as a senior - he has a very strong IQ and is considered one of the smartest guys in the league.

                          It's the risk takers that end up on top though, not the guys that do what everyone else does. Can you name me another player like Battier who is younger and worth about $5 million or less? Even in two years time, I can't think of someone like that - someone who wants to guard the Lebron's, Wade's, or Carmelo's of the league, do a heck of a job, not complain afterwards, and help train the young guys on the team how to do the same thing he just did.

                          Just like Nash would be a great mentor for a future PG.. Battier could be that mentor for our wings.
                          If it was becoming the norm there would be more players over 36 in the league, it's less than 0,5%...

                          Nash is a 2-x mvp, 7x allstar; Pierce is a finals mvp, 9x allstar; Allen is a 10x allstar. If you're that good, you can drop a level and still be better than a lot of other players. Battier has no allstar appearances; all he has is 2x all-defense 2nd team. What's worse, he relies heavily on defense for his game and defense gives way earlier because of the loss of athleticism.

                          Nevertheless I would not be opposed to getting Battier to help instilling a defensive mindset and on court coaching of the other players, but I would only want him on a short term contract so he won't be on the payroll when we need the flexibility and he won't bring much to the team anymore. Also, you seem to think he would want to play here for 5 mill or less, which I highly doubt.

                          One last note: is there any proof that Nash is a great mentor? He makes other players look better on the court with his play, but has he helped any pg becoming a better pg?

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                          • #28
                            Amnesty details

                            MIAMI— An expected windfall for NBA contending teams in search of affordable talent could wind up short-circuited by the league's soon-to-be-approved collective-bargaining agreement.

                            The Sun Sentinel confirmed Sunday that instead of players being released under the league's "amnesty" provision going directly to the open market, a bidding system has been put in place for teams operating below the league's salary cap to add such players at a deep discount.

                            "That's what the clause is in there for," a party familiar with the impending process Sunday told the Sun Sentinel. "It's so the Lakers can't go in and scoop up all the players."

                            Under the amnesty program, a team can waive a player in order to remove his salary from its salary cap and luxury tax, while still paying out the balance of that contract. It had been widely assumed that such players then would immediately hit the open market.

                            That could have positioned the Miami Heat to add players such as Baron Davis, Rashard Lewis, Brendan Haywood or Brandon Roy at the NBA salary minimum, with the players' previous teams still paying their full salaries. (Team-by-team decisions on specific players, if any, to receive amnesty releases will not be announced until after the CBA is ratified.)

                            However, in an outline of the proposed collective-bargaining agreement obtained by the Sun Sentinel, the NBA instead has instituted "a modified waiver process" that would allow teams operating below the salary cap to "submit competing offers to assume some but not all of the player's remaining contract."

                            For example, while Lewis has two years at $44 million total remaining on his contract, a team currently operating below the salary cap could bid to pay Lewis $3 million in each of those years (with the Washington Wizards, who are expected to make Lewis available, then paying the balance of his salary).

                            "Some of it is still not 100-percent worked out," a party familiar with the impending policy told the Sun Sentinel.

                            Under the about-to-be-rubber-stamped program, teams such as the Heat and Lakers that are operating well above the salary cap would therefore be precluded from bidding on such players, able to move only on amnesty players who receive no partial bids in the waiver process. For the Heat, it would be a blow in the bid to add depth around LeBron James, Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh.

                            For teams currently operating well below the cap, such as the Denver Nuggets, Sacramento Kings, Indiana Pacers, Memphis Grizzlies, New Jersey Nets, Washington Wizards and New Orleans Hornets, it could provide a pennies-on-the-dollar windfall.

                            "This just makes it more attractive or appealing for a team to pick up a contract on waivers, because they're obviously not paying the whole thing, they're only going to be paying the part that they bid on," another party involved in finalizing the process told the Sun Sentinel.

                            "The notion has been, unlike last time (after the 1998-99 lockout), where you have a Michael Finley, who picks the team of his choice, collects his money, and goes to the team of his choice for a million dollars, that there's going to be a secondary-bidding process. It's going to be no different than being traded."

                            Because of the revised process, players who had expected an amnesty release to lead to the ability to sign with the team of their choice -- with Heat forward Mike Miller possibly to be included in such a group -- could instead find themselves forced to join small-market, small-payroll teams who have ample available salary-cap space.
                            Source: Sun-Sentinel


                            The next few weeks are going to be FANtastic.

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                            • #29
                              Wow, this stipulation is going to make it really difficult for the high spenders to cash in big on the amnesty cuts. I like it.

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                              • #30
                                Apollo wrote: View Post
                                Wow, this stipulation is going to make it really difficult for the high spenders to cash in big on the amnesty cuts. I like it.
                                I hope the Raptors can get lucky here and put a 'bid' in on a useful player under contract for a few years, dirt cheap. Marvin Williams immediately comes to mind but I'd imagine: 1) other teams would be interested in him cheap too, and 2) it would essentially end the stay of JJ or Kleiza.

                                This assumes he is cut of course.

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