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Raps tied for first place

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  • #16
    Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Players and coaches should never tank. They should always give 100% no matter what and try to win every single game. If they do not, then they should be fired/traded/waived as soon as possible.


    It is the job of the front office and GM to tank - which they appear to have taken their job very seriously this year.
    I don't necessarily agree that the front office/GM are tanking. A GM tanking would be trading Derozan for Steve Blake. Or Amir Johnson for Andray Blatche.

    What the GM is avoiding is becoming mediocre. Don't go after talent that will not be part of the core in a couple of years. Stick with what you've got and develop them similar to what Chicago and OKC did. Once you have assessed your talent properly figure out who should be in your core moving forward and who should be dropped and swapped for better talent.

    I like to see the Raptors playing hard. They may end up with a record that prevents them from getting someone like Anthony Davis, but in the long term they will be better off since we will know for sure who should be in our core moving forward and who should not. Plus Bryan can always make a trade to get another pick. He's pretty savvy in the trade department if you haven't noticed.

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    • #17
      I'd like to just add that since the lottery system was implemented (in 1993), the worst team in the league has only won the draft twice (out of 19 drafts)

      Here is the draft, and the position the team was in (from the bottom) that got the first pick overall:

      1993 - 11th
      1994 - 2nd
      1995 - 5th
      1996 - 2nd
      1997 - 3rd
      1998 - 3rd
      1999 - 3rd
      2000 - 7th
      2001 - 3rd
      2002 - 5th
      2003 - 1st
      2004 - 1st
      2005 - 6th
      2006 - 5th
      2007 - 6th
      2008 - 9th
      2009 - 3rd
      2010 - 5th
      2011 - 8th

      The average was about 4.6 so about 4th or 5th worse. I can see Toronto in that range even if they play hard. There is a better chance that they get the top pick even if they win some games.

      Looking at those numbers it's interesting that the 4th worst team has never won the lottery. The 3rd worse team has won the lottery the most at 5 times, and the 5th worse has won it 4 times. It's pretty random, but I guess that's the point of the lottery isn't it?

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      • #18
        planetmars wrote: View Post
        I don't necessarily agree that the front office/GM are tanking. A GM tanking would be trading Derozan for Steve Blake. Or Amir Johnson for Andray Blatche.
        But the front office/GM do not need to move key pieces from a 22-60 team to ensure the tank is on. Getting a top draft pick with no other pieces in place once he arrives is counterproductive. In the Raps case they have nice pieces, they just don't have enough talent at this time and players are being asked to contribute more than they would on a winning team. That will change with the addition of JV, 2012 pick, growth/development/maturation of current players, and current players taking a lesser role in the future due to the addition of new talent.

        This may be over simplistic or splitting hairs but anytime the front office is not doing whatever they can to field the best team they can and win the most games possible that is tanking, regardless of circumstances, in my opinion. It would be like Ed Davis not giving it his all tonight against Tyler Hansbrough or David West because he may be matched up on Dirk in the next game.

        Again, a little simplistic and probably not 100% accurate, but the front office did nothing to add to the win column this year with roster additions this year. In my opinion, that is tanking when the team won 22 games the season before.


        What the GM is avoiding is becoming mediocre. Don't go after talent that will not be part of the core in a couple of years. Stick with what you've got and develop them similar to what Chicago and OKC did. Once you have assessed your talent properly figure out who should be in your core moving forward and who should be dropped and swapped for better talent.
        Agree with everything here. That doesn't mean the Raptors front office is not tanking the 2011-12 season.

        I like to see the Raptors playing hard. They may end up with a record that prevents them from getting someone like Anthony Davis, but in the long term they will be better off since we will know for sure who should be in our core moving forward and who should not. Plus Bryan can always make a trade to get another pick. He's pretty savvy in the trade department if you haven't noticed.
        Agree with everything here. But, again, that doesn't mean the front office is not tanking the 2011-12 season.

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        • #19
          GarbageTime wrote: View Post
          JJ meh? He was absolutely excellent in that game. He was a defensive powerhouse and didn't try to do too much offensively (and Karma rewarded with with that 3 at the end of the shot clock). He was this teams 2nd best player after Jose that game (and thats saying alot with the way Amir and Ed played)
          Agreed. I don't understand how JJ's performance on Monday can be considered "meh". He played a solid game.

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