Hard to argue against having two loyalties, to your team (employer) and to your country (obligation to fellow country-men).
WTF. We receive injury riddled Shaun Livingston, and one dimensional power forward vet Boris Diaw? Milwaukee is probably going to be a high lottery and Charlotte's 2ND rounder is, I guess alright.
it sounds soo bad i'm not going to bother looking at it. People seem to think if you have a lot of picks you can get good players. It useless having a shit load of picks if your entire team is going to be unproven rookies with no vet's or 3rd or 4th year players(like Ed and DeMar) who can relate and help the rookies out.
- Reunite the YoungGunz in Milwaukee (I'm sure Sonny Weems will be happy to join in)
- Send davis to be mentored by oakley
- Diaw is an expiring contract, cap space.
- This is a deep draft, we can get good players with Milwaukee's 1st and Charlotte 2nd.
This thread is about "what do you hope the raptors do at the trade deadline."
I don't know anything about basketball, but that doesn't mean I don't have ridiculous opinions. So my view on team construction is that you want 5 "pure" starters, meaning 5 player that are prototypical players for their position, then you want 5 versatile players that can give you different looks from the bench, plus 1 pure C and 1 pure PG on the bench.
So, the trade above is just what I would like to see by the deadline, because I rally want more picks, and we're not going to get any higher tan Charlotte's 2nd rounder for for barbosa.
As such, we have 3 players that can be among my 5 starters: Bargnani, Calderon, JV. That's it. So we need to get two starting quality players, with 2 first rounders and a high 2nd rounder, hopefully we get at least 1, maybe two if somebody like quincy miller falls (and isn't a bust).
Now, since Ed Davis, Amir Johnson and DeMar DeRozan are not the starters I'm looking for, there are not the 1 pure c or the 1 pure pg I want on the roster, and not really good candidates for the "versatile" 5 I want on my bench, since the can only really play one positon. Since we also have JJ and Kleiza, I'd rather have them on my bench.
So so far, we have these starters
3- Draft Pick/Free Agent
2- Draft Pick/Free Agent
On our bench:
Aaron Gray, Pure C Back Up
Anthony Carter, Pure PG Back Up
I can live with the above, though an upgrade would not hurt. Especially given our lack of a "point guard of the future."
Our Versatile Backups:
JJ (3/4), Kleiza (3/4), Bayless (1/2), Livingston (1/2), Forbes (1/2/3)
I'd prefer to exchange one of Bayless, Livingston or Forbes for a 4/5, but otherwise those guys are a great bench.
(Edit: I would also be happy to keep Diaw for cheep and send one of Bayless, Livingston, or Forbes out of town or down on the reserves list)
That's it, 3 more whoevers as injury insurance: Alabi, Magliore, Some Vet-Min wing or guard,
(Edit: I'd actually like to get rid of Alabi too, since I'd prefer vets as reserves that can contribute more in practice and actually play when needed, maybe Denver will give us a 2nd rounder for him?)
The trade I propose, plus the expiring contracts of Barbosa and Diaw will give us the picks and cap space to try and sign legitimate starters for the 2 and 3, plus a prospect for our point guard of the future. I'm not so much interested in "equality" in terms of what we're trading and what we're getting, but working to get a better roster over all.
I don't think ED, DeRozan and Amir are helping us do that at this time since they do not seem able to be starters on this team, nor do they provide much versatility as back ups. I do however like them, and thus want to trade them to where they can excel, Davis will do well with Coach Oakley (his dad's pal) and the new YoungGunz will totally own Milwaukee, running with Jennings and Bogut. Win-win-win.
Last edited by Quirk; Wed Feb 22nd, 2012 at 01:24 PM.
If your trade was the best possible trade that BC could make using those 3 players (DeRozan, Davis & Amir), I would MUCH rather just keep those players. And if you're at all familiar with my posts, you'll know that I have been as vocal about trading one of Amir/Davis since the offseason as anybody on here, and am 50-50 on DeRozan, so I think I'm being pretty objective in my valuation.
How would Milwaukee's late lottery pick (or they could even sneak into the playoffs, who knows) and Charlotte's early 2nd round pick be guaranteed to wind up being more valuable than DeRozan, Davis and Amir? For the 1st overall pick, maybe, but not for late lottery and 2nd rounder.
In any case, if you're right and BC can get more for DeRozan, Davis and AJ than Milwuake's 1st and Charlotte 2nd while not taking on any more salary in return than Livingston's 2nd year, that would be even better. More than likely it wont be easy though. I'd guess most teams have decided these guys are not great starter prospects by this point.
The short answer to what I want the team to do? Trade players that are not fitting in long term for picks. The only trades we can make that will net decent picks (and yes, I think Charlotte's 2nd is a decent pick this year) would probably need to include DeRozan, Davis and AJ.
Maybe Calderon to a Contender. But I want to keep Calderon, as he's one of the few productive starters on the team and the pick from a contender is not likely to be much better than Charlotte's 2nd.
Stoking the trade fire, Dwane?Ryan McNeill @ryanmcneill
Dwane Casey told the media that the #RTZ have gotten a lot of trade offers for Calderon but they aren't interested in dealing him. #NBA
Retweeted by Ryan Wolstat
Or are you serious?
Probably trying to drum up some real offers
As mentioned, if Bargnani and JV are starting, I'd rather give the backup minutes at the 4 to JJ and Kleiza, since they can backup the 3 as well, and at the 5 to Aaron Gray who is a legit C. JV/Bargnani/Gray/JJ/Kleiza already covers the 4/5 adequately, with Magliore and Alabi as deep bench insurance. Adding AJ and ED to this mix doesn't improve it terribly.
What would improve the team tremendously is a all-star calibre starting 3, which is what our #1 pick will hopefully bring. No team is going to trade us an all-star calibre starter for any or all of DeMar, Amir and Ed. Hopefully MKG or Barnes is the one or maybe luck out with Milwaukee's pick and have Quincy Miller fall. Or maybe the cap space this opens up gets us Wilson Chandler.
As for DeRozan, I no longer believe DeMar can be a top-tier starter, a lot of you may disagree, but I think we'd get by starting Bayless or Livingston at the 2, and once again look to the draft or free agency to find our starting two. Jeremy Lamb, Bradley Beal and other potential draft choices as well as Wilson Chandler, again being options here one way or the other.
I agree that my trade maybe doesn't get "value" in terms of what we get back, but I don't care about equal value, which normally means promising players that are not fitting in somewhere else. That seems like a lateral move. I want flexibility, meaning cap space and draft picks.
In the end, I'll be happy if the result is a starting line up of:
With a bench that includes JJ, Kleiza, Bayless, and Gray, along with some upside in perhaps Beal or Lamb that would eventually push Chandler to the bench. In any case, Chandler is a versatile player who can play either 2 or 3, so would be welcome on the bench even when no longer a starter. Grabbing somebody like Alex Young with Charlotte's 2nd rounder could be a nice pick up as well.
And if Wilson Chandler doesn't work out, as mentioned, Livingston or Bayless could hold the fort at the 2 till one of the prospects developed or we found a free agent to take our money.
On the list of missions accomplished in the first half of the Toronto Raptors' schedule, getting Jose Calderon to play up his trade value must surely be at the top.
Yet when general manager Bryan Colangelo and head coach Dwane Casey and his staff do their blue-skying for next season, and figure out the point-guard ‘what-ares’ in the upcoming draft, the trade ‘might-be's’ and free-agent possibilities, they may well reach an obvious conclusion: the Raptors might be best-served keeping Calderon.
“We’re trying to hold on to him and keep him, but he has played his way into a very high status as a point guard,” Casey said Wednesday, before the Raptors beat the Detroit Pistons 103-93 to hit the halfway point of the NBA’s condensed 66-game regular-season schedule with a .303 winning percentage (10-23.) “A lot of teams have been calling and wanting him.”
Yet something happened over the course of the Raptors' seven-game homestand, during which they went 2-5. Calderon went off, averaging 16.7 points, 11.1 assists and just under 35 minutes, including setting career highs in points (30) and field goals (13) in a loss to the Los Angeles Lakers. Wednesday, he had 15 assists for the second time on the homestand, to go along with six points. He is, as Casey noted, one of the Raptors' best shooters but he has also had more ups than downs defensively. “Last year was just a parade of paint points starting with him and then the big guy,” Casey said.
SourceWhich brings us to the 30-year-old Calderon, who has one year and $10,561,985 (U.S.) remaining on his contract. There are Raptors fans who would have taken the Pistons' Brandon Knight fifth overall in the draft instead of the big Lithuanian Jonas Valanciunas. But Knight – who had 16 points in a game in which Casey went to the whip in a first-half huddle, tearing into his big players for letting the Pistons' quick guards have free run – went eighth and isn’t exactly a pure point guard, and the fact is that this draft is deep in every area but the point.
So if the Raptors do end up in the lottery any point guard they’d take would be a horrible reach. Trade for a point guard? With what? Calderon – another point guard? Free agency doesn’t offer a great deal either. Deron Williams isn’t coming here. Beyond that? There isn’t much.
Calderon’s bought what Casey is selling. And perhaps Wednesday, Casey was doing some selling of his own – to his boss. “That is why we need Jose,” said Casey. “That’s the argument for him. He gives us stability. You need that leadership.” Calderon has gone from being an inhibitor to a facilitator. What once seemed so clear-cut is no longer the case. Full credit to Jose Calderon.
What do you think:
Is Casey publicly pleading BC to keep him?
Is Casey publicly inflating his trade value?
Aside from that, Calderon really seems to understand the game. If you were a new coach, with a lot of young players, and a couple of more promising rookies coming next year, wouldn't you want a floor general who has court vision, a good shot, and a high assist to turnover ratio to help you shepherd your young crew towards some kind of organized offensive effectiveness?
Johnny Flynn is a guy worth taking a flier on and his stock is probably as low as it's going to get. Maybe they should look into bringing in a guy like that at the deadline? Alternatively I do like D.J. Augustin even if he's got Brandon Jennings size.
I hope DC is inflating trade value.
My concerns with Jose for next year are 100% injury and long term related.
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