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Thread: ESPN Insider: Small trades, big impact - Jose Calderon for Devin Harris

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    Administrator Arsenalist's Avatar
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    Default ESPN Insider: Small trades, big impact - Jose Calderon for Devin Harris

    From the insider article today:

    The Toronto Raptors trade PG Jose Calderon to the Utah Jazz for PG Devin Harris and a future pick

    Why the teams should make this trade: Calderon has had a nice seven-year career with the Raptors, but at age 30, he might not be in the team's future. Head coach Dwane Casey is all about defense, and Harris would provide an upgrade over Calderon.

    On the other hand, Calderon (13.6 ppg, 10.2 apg in the past 10 games) would be tremendous running the Utah offense with big men Al Jefferson and Paul Millsap. He is one of the best assist-to-turnover ratio point guards in the NBA, whereas Harris has proved to be a bad fit for the Jazz, averaging just 9.1 ppg and 4.5 apg, the lowest numbers he has had since his early days in Dallas.

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    Raptors Republic Superstar TheGloveinRapsUniform's Avatar
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    Quote Arsenalist wrote: View Post
    From the insider article today:
    The problem with this trade is...its bad for the Raptors, IMO.

    I think its fairly obvious that the Raps offense is PG driven, meaning you have a pass first PG, the offense is successful. We've all seen how bad the offense gets when Bayless is running the point, who is a scoring PG, and Harris, IMO, is too.

    With the new Raptors defensive philosophy, Calderon's inadequacies on defense is hidden because of the zone and good perimeter D from JJ and Barbosa. But the offense will surely suffer if you get a scoring PG.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Balls of Steel's Avatar
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    This is bad for the Raps no matter how you cut it. Pass for me.
    “The saving of our world from pending doom will come, not through the complacent adjustment of the conforming majority, but through the creative maladjustment of a nonconforming minority.” - Martin Luther King

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    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    Depends what the pick is

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    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    If the pick is in the 2012 draft and it's not lotto protected(the Jazz hold picks #11 and 12 right now) then I'm down for that. They could draft a PG of the future such as Marshall or Lillard. Alternatively they could use the pick on a high talent wing like Perry Jones or Terrence Jones or Quincy Miller or Jeremy Lamb or whoever they're interested in, you get the picture. Alternatively depending on where they land in the draft they could use the pick to trade up in the draft to secure the rights to a guy like Andre Drummond, which on the surface while looking at the current roster makes no sense but after a few other off-season moves could look like a coup when A.D. is out there killing it along side J.V. three or fours seasons down the road.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star hateslosing's Avatar
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    I don't like Harris over Calderon straight up: Calderon is a better pg than Harris and fits better. They have similar contracts, both expiring next season and both for about 10 mill (Harris makes a bit less) so I don't like it on that front either. That said, if the Jazz through in their first, I'd be all over it. If Jose is going to be moved anyway I think Harris and a Jazz first is far better value than just the Lakers first rounder.

    I might even throw in our second.

    Edited: changed my mind
    "When Life gives you lemons, you clone those Lemons to make super lemons!"
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    Raptors Republic Starter knickz's Avatar
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    Ater watching that Jose Calderon segment on the score, I am more infuriated with how he has been treated by this fan base. Honestly, it absolutely makes me sick to my stomach to see some on the things people say about Jose. some of you guys cry about his contract fully knowing he never gave himself the contract. Also, I hear people talk about his lateral deficiencies as if every player in the nba is supposed to be perfect. Guys like Lebron , Melo and Kobe all have some type of weakness to their game, I just don't think you guys have forgived Jose for that turn over against the nets
    "the raptors were my fav team growing up"-kevin durant

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    Raptors Republic Starter knickz's Avatar
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    it makes me laugh when I hear guys say we should trade jose for this pg. some people in raptor nation just like the flashier, bigger name guy who they assume is better than jose
    "the raptors were my fav team growing up"-kevin durant

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Miekenstien's Avatar
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    Quote knickz wrote: View Post
    Ater watching that Jose Calderon segment on the score, I am more infuriated with how he has been treated by this fan base. Honestly, it absolutely makes me sick to my stomach to see some on the things people say about Jose. some of you guys cry about his contract fully knowing he never gave himself the contract. Also, I hear people talk about his lateral deficiencies as if every player in the nba is supposed to be perfect. Guys like Lebron , Melo and Kobe all have some type of weakness to their game, I just don't think you guys have forgived Jose for that turn over against the nets
    i never gave him that contract either

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Miekenstien's Avatar
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    Quote knickz wrote: View Post
    it makes me laugh when I hear guys say we should trade jose for this pg. some people in raptor nation just like the flashier, bigger name guy who they assume is better than jose
    i want jose either traded for very good prospects or to free up space for nash this summer. is it wrong to assume that nash is better then jose?

    i think that jose isn't part of the "core" so is therefor expendable to improve it. i have also stated that trading jose for the sake of change isn't a good idea because he will be great in the pick and roll.

    hypothetically if he were to play here next year we would either trade him at the deadline as a 10 million expiring or hold him into the summer. if he were to complete the year and play as good as this year at 31 he might get another 4 or 5 year UFA offer near his current salary. that is something we cant afford.

    it isn't that we think jose is the root of problems, i think he deserves a chance to play for something. it wont be here for the next couple years.

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    Super Moderator ReubenJRD's Avatar
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    Quote Miekenstien wrote: View Post
    i want jose either traded for very good prospects or to free up space for nash this summer. is it wrong to assume that nash is better then jose?

    i think that jose isn't part of the "core" so is therefor expendable to improve it. i have also stated that trading jose for the sake of change isn't a good idea because he will be great in the pick and roll.

    hypothetically if he were to play here next year we would either trade him at the deadline as a 10 million expiring or hold him into the summer. if he were to complete the year and play as good as this year at 31 he might get another 4 or 5 year UFA offer near his current salary. that is something we cant afford.

    it isn't that we think jose is the root of problems, i think he deserves a chance to play for something. it wont be here for the next couple years.
    Very good points.

    I think trading him for younger prospects would be smart, and save alot of cap space for other players trade/freeagency.

    But I would love to see him retire a Raptor. He's one of the few players in this league who are just so good at at getting guys the basketball, and plays with so much heart. One of my favourite raptors by far.

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    Harris seems to have not filled the bill in a number of locations so will be of no/little value coming back. No cap relief in the transaction and what does future pick mean? If its a lottery pick one must think hard about it. Harris would have expiring value next year but would not be (I dont think) a good fit for JV's development.
    I would hope there are other options (better) to choose from. And oh yes, he sulks a lot.
    Last edited by Bendit; Tue Feb 28th, 2012 at 08:44 PM.

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    Raptors Republic Superstar enlightenment's Avatar
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    If we get one of their picks (11 or 12 doesnt truly matter which) I would approve the trade. One, who knows how Devin Harris would react within a new scenery? and two, we go all out on this years draft and the transformation of the raptors would be complete (I like the idea of Myck Kabongo at 11/12).

    Also, instead of viewing this as us trying to get rid of Calderon (my favorite raptor, for obvious reasons) we should view this as giving Calderon a new chance to make something out of himself and actually win before he becomes just an aging vet. I would hate for us to hold on to a premier talent until he declines during our rebuilding phase, it is like Nash with the suns currently, the real generous thing that their team could do is give Nash up to an actual competitor and give him a chance to make something out of himself. Calderon is too good to retire unnoticed, and with barely any success (one time division champs).

    The Jazz aren't exactly competitors anymore, but they aren't freshly embarking on a rebuilding phase that will take more than a couple of years to complete (such as the Raps).
    Last edited by enlightenment; Tue Feb 28th, 2012 at 10:12 PM.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    How soon people forget Calderon asking to be traded to a contender.

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    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Quote knickz wrote: View Post
    it makes me laugh when I hear guys say we should trade jose for this pg. some people in raptor nation just like the flashier, bigger name guy who they assume is better than jose
    Or it could hinge on the draft pick details... As mentioned in many different posts before yours'. *hint*

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    I agree 100%. Jose has been a tru professional & always gave 100%. Whats more, he is one of the few players that puts the team first.
    We pine for Steve Nash. While Steve Nash is by far the best Canadian player ever, his glory days are gone. Still more than decent PG. Now compare his style of play, stats last 1-2 years with Jose. I see a lot of similarity (no, fact that both are white, 6:3' is not it).
    So, my friends, enjoyee Jose as much as he enjoyes being in To. Forget what he cannot do -play D like CP3. Focus on what he can do, run a team & do whatever it takes for it to be better.

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote Mapko wrote: View Post
    I agree 100%. Jose has been a tru professional & always gave 100%. Whats more, he is one of the few players that puts the team first.
    We pine for Steve Nash. While Steve Nash is by far the best Canadian player ever, his glory days are gone. Still more than decent PG. Now compare his style of play, stats last 1-2 years with Jose. I see a lot of similarity (no, fact that both are white, 6:3' is not it).
    So, my friends, enjoyee Jose as much as he enjoyes being in To. Forget what he cannot do -play D like CP3. Focus on what he can do, run a team & do whatever it takes for it to be better.
    Incredible he is still able to make the all-star game while being led to the glue factory.

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    Raptors Republic Starter knickz's Avatar
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    Quote Miekenstien wrote: View Post
    i want jose either traded for very good prospects or to free up space for nash this summer. is it wrong to assume that nash is better then jose?

    i think that jose isn't part of the "core" so is therefor expendable to improve it. i have also stated that trading jose for the sake of change isn't a good idea because he will be great in the pick and roll.

    hypothetically if he were to play here next year we would either trade him at the deadline as a 10 million expiring or hold him into the summer. if he were to complete the year and play as good as this year at 31 he might get another 4 or 5 year UFA offer near his current salary. that is something we cant afford.

    it isn't that we think jose is the root of problems, i think he deserves a chance to play for something. it wont be here for the next couple years.
    typical clown who actually believes nash wants to suit up for the raptors ***
    "the raptors were my fav team growing up"-kevin durant

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    Raptors Republic Starter knickz's Avatar
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    Quote Miekenstien wrote: View Post
    i never gave him that contract either
    so bash the guy who did
    "the raptors were my fav team growing up"-kevin durant

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    Raptors Republic All-Star hateslosing's Avatar
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    Quote knickz wrote: View Post
    it makes me laugh when I hear guys say we should trade jose for this pg. some people in raptor nation just like the flashier, bigger name guy who they assume is better than jose
    I think Raps fans like the idea of getting a pick back, not Devin Harris. To be clear: I don't want to trade Jose at all, but this is a much better deal than getting nothing but a late 1st rounder from the Lakers.
    "When Life gives you lemons, you clone those Lemons to make super lemons!"
    -Scudworth

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