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Thread: Who do you realistically see as the Point Guard of the future?

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    Raptors Republic Icon mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Default Who do you realistically see as the Point Guard of the future?

    This is not a 'trade Jose' or 'keep Jose' thread - remember that.

    The fact is Bryan Colangelo has said on numerous occasions this year that a focus of his is, one way or another, acquiring a point guard of the future.

    Like it or not, that would strongly imply the point guard of the future is NOT Jose Calderon considering he is already under contract.

    So if Jose is not the point guard of the future, who would you REALISTICALLY like to see?


    Some ideas to get you thinking:

    Trade? Jennings? Bledsoe?

    Free agency? Augustin? Felton?

    Draft? Lillard? Marshall? Kabongo? Teague?

    Other thoughts?

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    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    That's just it, I don't see any true PG-of-the-future available right now.

    Draft - I'm not convinced any of the PG in this year's draft are future all stars

    Free Agency - the stud PGs won't sign in Toronto, several of the flashiest names are more combo type score-first PGs and other pass-first PGs are a lateral move from Calderon at best

    Trade - hard to say who's really available and what it would take to get them

    That's why I think either Calderon or Nash would be ideal to have running the team for the next 1-3 years, while the team looks for the PG-OTF. I'm curious, does anybody know what PG are potentially on the horizon for the 2013 draft? Will it be a stronger PG draft than the upcoming 2012 draft? And also, it would be interesting to scan a free agency list for the next two years as well, to see who might be available over the next couple offseasons.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Quote CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
    That's just it, I don't see any true PG-of-the-future available right now.

    Draft - I'm not convinced any of the PG in this year's draft are future all stars

    Free Agency - the stud PGs won't sign in Toronto, several of the flashiest names are more combo type score-first PGs and other pass-first PGs are a lateral move from Calderon at best

    Trade - hard to say who's really available and what it would take to get them

    That's why I think either Calderon or Nash would be ideal to have running the team for the next 1-3 years, while the team looks for the PG-OTF. I'm curious, does anybody know what PG are potentially on the horizon for the 2013 draft? Will it be a stronger PG draft than the upcoming 2012 draft? And also, it would be interesting to scan a free agency list for the next two years as well, to see who might be available over the next couple offseasons.
    when are you ever convinced that someone whos never played a game in the nba is going to be a future all star?

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    Raptors Republic Icon mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Here is a thought I had today: Nick Calathes. I read his name in a chat on HoopsWorld.com and I realized I had totally forgot about him (by the way, Dallas owns his draft rights).

    For those of you who don't know who he is, he played for the Florida Gators his freshman and sophomore years in '07/08 and '08/09. He used his Greece family background and, with his Greek passport, gave up his junior and senior years at Florida to go professional in Greece. More background here.

    DraftExpress.com profile

    All stats (NCAA, Europe) via Draft Express.com

    He is just turned 23 in February. He is 6'6". DraftExpress lists his best case as Jose Calderon and his worst case as Sarunas Jasikevicius - not bad company. For those Euro-phobes around here, he put up stellar stats at Florida - equal to or better than Deron Williams in my opinion (Williams had a clear advantage in assist to turnover but that is it). He has played the last 3 years at the highest level of competition outside of the NBA - and arguably the most intense basketball in the world. His stats aren't that eye catching from the last few years in Europe but, as Ricky Rubio showed, stats in Europe can be misleading - especially for a PG - due to the style of and approach to the game.

    From DraftExpress.com:

    What makes Calathes so effective is in his ability to control the pace of a game. He can play an up-tempo style or run an offense in the half-court and in either fashion he seems to make good decisions. He makes great passes at the right times and to go along with his 6.5 assists a game he makes countless passes that lead to assists - contributing to the team's ball movement.

    Calathes' passing ability is far and beyond his greatest skill. He sees the court unlike any other player in the country relative to his size and repeatedly makes difficult passes with either hand, creating easy shots for his teammates. At 6-5, he has great size and therefore can see over the defense - making passes that most point guards in college cannot. His great strength is also a weakness however, as he can get into trouble, attempting unreasonably difficult passes at times, which is why he's averaging 3.3 turnovers a game, which is 20th worst in the country.

    From DraftExpress.com http://www.draftexpress.com#ixzz1oZJcdBUK
    http://www.draftexpress.com


    If Deron Williams ends up in Dallas, I'd be making the call to Donnie Nelson. Actually, I'd be making the call anyways.

    Added: EuroBasket 2011 profile:

    Team 2010-11: Panathinaikos (Greece-ESAKE)

    Career: .Lake Howell High School (Winter Park, Florida-USA), University of Florida (USA-NCAA 2007-09), Panathinaikos (Greece-ESAKE, 2009-2011)

    Nick Calathes is slowly but surely beginning to realise all of the potential he showed during his college career when he was a marquee player for the Florida Gators. He is learning at a rapid rate and with each passing month and tournament, he continues to have more of an impact. He made his National Team debut two years ago at EuroBasket 2009 in Poland and since that time has not only played well at the FIBA World Championship but also played a big part in helping Panathinaikos lift the Euroleague title earlier this year. In fact, he was the key player of the weekend and shined most in the semi-final. This is further evidence that he does have the temperament and ability to be a big game player at the elite level. Defensively he is excellent and while offensively he needs to work on his perimeter game, he is still only 22-years-old with time to continue evolving and eventually become a leader in years to come.
    Last edited by mcHAPPY; Thu Mar 8th, 2012 at 06:05 PM.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star saints91's Avatar
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    Personally I think Dragic could be a guy we could groom. He has the athletic ability, great ball handling. Decent shooter, has the foot speed to defend fast guards. He needs to improve his assist to turnover ratio. Perhaps Jose can mentor him. I would like us to spend the bulk of our free agent money on a SF or SG.

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    when are you ever convinced that someone whos never played a game in the nba is going to be a future all star?
    When his name is Harrison Barnes. Boom. haha



    Who would I like to see as the Future Point Guard leading our Playoff bound team?
    I'd like to see Kabongo; however, right now I'm not totally convinced he's even a few years away from contributing, let alone ever truly developing into the player we all hope/envision him becoming.
    But I've been totally stoked about this guy for the past 2 years, and I can't waste all that time now doubting him.
    So I'll stand by him.

    Or Kendall Marshall. I have the biggest crush on this guy, its ridiculous.

    That being said, I think keeping Jose around until its the 'future' and there is a legit replacement at the Starting spot, is a good idea.
    "That was Nasty right? Cocked that Joint back and banged on 'em." -James Johnson

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    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    Draft, I think. Hard to trade for a good PG and this years crop of FA's isn't that great. Couple guys I'd roll with for 2-3 years but no clear cut franchise dudes.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star saints91's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Here is a thought I had today: Nick Calathes. I read his name in a chat on HoopsWorld.com and I realized I had totally forgot about him (by the way, Dallas owns his draft rights).

    For those of you who don't know who he is, he played for the Florida Gators his freshman and sophomore years in '07/08 and '08/09. He used his Greece family background to gain Greek citizenship and gave up his junior and senior years at Florida to go professional in Greece.





    DraftExpress.com profile

    All stats (NCAA, Europe) via Draft Express.com

    He is just turned 23 in February. He is 6'6". DraftExpress lists his best case as Jose Calderon and his worst case as Sarunas Jasikevicius - not bad company. For those Euro-phobes around here, he put up stellar stats at Florida - equal to or better than Deron Williams in my opinion (Williams had a clear advantage in assist to turnover but that is it). He has played the last 3 years at the highest level of competition outside of the NBA - and arguably the most intense basketball in the world. His stats aren't that eye catching from the last few years in Europe but, as Ricky Rubio showed, stats in Europe can be misleading - especially for a PG - due to the style of and approach to the game.

    From DraftExpress.com:





    If Deron Williams ends up in Dallas, I'd be making the call to Donnie Nelson. Actually, I'd be making the call anyways.

    Added: EuroBasket 2011 profile:

    Hopefully our European scouts have their eyes on this kid! Sounds good to me!

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    Raptors Republic All-Star saints91's Avatar
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    Ya, I like some of the guys in this years draft as well. I hope we can get another pick.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    I remember him, actually. We could have a Florida backcourt in 12/13 WINK

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    Raptors Republic Superstar Puffer's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Here is a thought I had today: Nick Calathes. I read his name in a chat on HoopsWorld.com and I realized I had totally forgot about him (by the way, Dallas owns his draft rights).

    For those of you who don't know who he is, he played for the Florida Gators his freshman and sophomore years in '07/08 and '08/09. He used his Greece family background and, with his Greek passport, gave up his junior and senior years at Florida to go professional in Greece.
    Sounds very interesting. Could get him on a rookie contract I assume. Best suggestion I've seen. Been playing professionally and doing extremely well according to the story. Immediately more interesting then any of the unrealistic trade scenarios that I have seen suggested.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Miekenstien's Avatar
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    i would like it to be kabongo as well. great story. augustin is a nice point guard. i would have said felton last year but he sucked a lot this year.

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    Raptors Republic Superstar ReubenJRD's Avatar
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    Draft. Lillard, Marshall, or Kabongo I'm totally fine with.

    As much as Marquis Teague has an NBA game, he's just another Jerryd Bayless. Shooting guard in a point guard's body.

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    Raptors Republic Starter jimmie's Avatar
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    A. Sign a FA in 2013-14 (or trade before they become FAs). There's a ton of guys who could step in immediately: Wall, Curry, Irving, Holiday, Lawson, Jennings, Rubio, Lowry.

    B. In the meantime, draft a PG this summer if they get a 2nd 1st-rounder. Ride with Jose in 2012-13 and hope you got lucky and the kid is ready for 2013-14. Do this whether you do A or not.
    Definition of Statistics: The science of producing unreliable facts from reliable figures.

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    Raptors Republic Icon mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote jimmie wrote: View Post
    A. Sign a FA in 2013-14 (or trade before they become FAs). There's a ton of guys who could step in immediately: Wall, Curry, Irving, Holiday, Lawson, Jennings, Rubio, Lowry.

    B. In the meantime, draft a PG this summer if they get a 2nd 1st-rounder. Ride with Jose in 2012-13 and hope you got lucky and the kid is ready for 2013-14. Do this whether you do A or not.
    Wall, Curry, Irving, Holiday, Lawson, and Rubio are not going to happen via free agency. They are all (minus Rubio who is locked up until 2015/16) restricted next summer and their team won't let them walk.

    Lowry is locked up until the 2014/15 season at which point he is unrestricted.

    Jennings is a possibility but, again, restricted.

    Of all of those listed, I think Jennings would be the most likely via free agency.



    Now trades are another matter but I can't see Toronto's assets parlaying in to one of those point guards without seriously setting the franchise back.

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    I don't see the Calathes/D Will comparison. I know it was a statistical comparison but they are very different players with Williams much more athletic. Calathes will be a NBA player sooner rather than later but I think he will get burnt by Rondo types.

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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Here is a thought I had today: Nick Calathes.
    DraftExpress lists his best case as Jose Calderon and his worst case as Sarunas Jasikevicius - not bad company.
    Not to insult your idea at all, because he does sound intriguing.. But on a team that already has Jose Calderon under contract playing arguably the best in this league he has ever played, why would we shift our focus to a point guard who, best case scenario, eventually develops into the guy we already have?
    The thing with our point guard now is that, worst case scenario, he's still Jose Calderon.

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    Raptors Republic Superstar ReubenJRD's Avatar
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    I think the best way for us to not give up good assets is by draft, first of all because we can grab a cheap player on a rookie contract, who may be able to develop into a good guard in the league. If we don't strike, we don't let up a large sum of cap, or assets for a player who doesn't become who we want overtime. Who can be amnestied or traded for a pick or etc, etc.

    Bryan Colangelo hasn't been the best at bringing in players from the free agency i.e Turkoglu. He was the best in the class of free agents, but we ended up over-paying and the rest is history.

    I think trade is the second best option, but like I said, we could be giving up assets for another player who won't perform, not saying they won't though.

    IMO, the draft is the smartest and most convenient. Trade may give up assets that receive a player that won't work, and with the free agency we could go through another Turk type situation.

    BUT, there are the positives of the two, but I don't need to mention them because we've seen what good trades do to teams. I.e Denver Nuggets, & we all know about the free agency positives when made. I.e Miami Heat

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    Raptors Republic Starter SuperRaptor's Avatar
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    Default No love for Bayless.

    I don't know why their is no love for bayless on these forums. Everyone is a Bayless hater when all the guy does is average 20+ pts a game when he starts. People say that he doesn't pass enough but his assist numbers are probably average for a PG when he starts. He is a better ball stopper than Jose, and he is more physical. He could explode for 40+ pts in a game one day, and he is still improving.

    I would rather continue developing him then spend another 3 years developing a rookie, or trading for a slightly above average PG like the ones that are out there.

    A healthy Jerryd Bayless can be a huge asset for this team, if he gets like 30+ min. a game you better believe he will average 18-20 pts a game and around 5-7 assists with good defense.

    P.S I love Jose too, but im not impressed with the rookie hype or the free agents available, I like our PG's.

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    Raptors Republic Starter jimmie's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Wall, Curry, Irving, Holiday, Lawson, and Rubio are not going to happen via free agency. They are all (minus Rubio who is locked up until 2015/16) restricted next summer and their team won't let them walk.

    Lowry is locked up until the 2014/15 season at which point he is unrestricted.

    Jennings is a possibility but, again, restricted.

    Of all of those listed, I think Jennings would be the most likely via free agency.

    Now trades are another matter but I can't see Toronto's assets parlaying in to one of those point guards without seriously setting the franchise back.
    Maybe, maybe not. A lot can change for a lot of franchises over a year. No offense, but you have no idea who of those names might be available for one reason or another, and no idea what our assets might get us. We've all seen enough trades by now to realize there is ALWAYS a deal out there.

    Getting one of them is a surefire a way to fill the PG role as counting on a rookie. I see acquiring one of them as a "possibility" as reasonable/probable as drafting a star. Don't aim so low.
    Definition of Statistics: The science of producing unreliable facts from reliable figures.

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