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Thread: Raptors weigh plusses of Drafting a Homegrown Talent

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Default Raptors weigh plusses of Drafting a Homegrown Talent

    Nice Article on NBA.com:


    Toronto weighs plusses of drafting a homegrown talent

    Bryan Colangelo has lived in Toronto six years as Raptors president and general manager. Raised in Phoenix, schooled at Cornell, he has started the application process to become a Canadian citizen. He gets national pride and how it connects to the only NBA team in a country with six time zones and a reach from the Pacific to the Atlantic to the Arctic.

    Having a player from Canada on the team from Canada, in a prominent role for the long term, would be a big deal. Toronto's own Jamaal Magloire is there now, but with limited duty as a short-timer at age 33. And as much as the skies would open to thousand-mile rainbows and dancing unicorns if Steve Nash, the Nashional Hero, signed on, it would still be a relatively brief visit. Nash is 38. This is about younger players.

    The Raptors are in building mode at the same moment the country suddenly has an uncommonly high profile in the Draft, with Tristan Thompson and Cory Joseph going in the first round last year and Myck Kabongo a possibility for the same in 2012 (if he leaves Texas). Gonzaga senior Robert Sacre is a potential second rounder. Kentucky's Greg Wiltjer, from Portland but the son of as Canadian basketball Olympian, is also on the radar.

    This intersection of time and place has lined up perfectly. The Raptors could not have envisioned picking in the lottery two years in a row. And it just so happens that Canadian prospects are grouped together in a small window of the Draft. Toronto had the fifth choice last season, right in Thompson territory, before the high-energy power forward went fourth to the Cavaliers. The Raptors also have been point-guard shopping just as Joseph begins his pro career and Kabongo closes in on his NBA moment.

    "Having a hometown kid come back home," Thompson said, "it's almost like the Derrick Rose effect times two."

    But a Canadian -- from Ontario or elsewhere -- on the Raptors would be way more than Chicago following its hometown hero with the Bulls. A Canadian-born player suiting up for Toronto would be something that was followed by an entire basketball nation.

    "I'd be lying if I said there wasn't pressure," Thompson, from the Toronto suburb of Brampton, said of local fans wanting it to happen. "I think it is pressure."

    Thompson was considered in the weeks leading to the Draft before it was decided that he was a duplication for Ed Davis, the lottery pick the year before. But Thompson would not have been the choice even if he was still on the board. The Raptors took Lithuanian Jonas Valanciunas, with the understanding he would be spending another year in Europe, and would have decided among another center (Bismack Biyombo) or point guards Kemba Walker or Brandon Knight if Valanciunas was gone. The local product was not an option.

    The Raptors tried to acquire another selection later in the first round to draft Toronto native Joseph. No deal was completed, though. Joseph went 29th to the Spurs.

    "I think clearly it could affect business to some degree on a positive note," Colangelo said. "But there's no telling. It just all depends on who that individual is. It comes down to a case-by-case basis. I think that we are making basketball decisions. If there's a component that moves the ticker, if you will, or moves the dial from a financial standpoint, you hope that it's the wins that you produce as a basketball team, not the ability for someone local to push ticket sales. Winning does push ticket sales. That's the ultimate end goal, to win basketball games.

    "If an individual that did grow up down the street or was part of the Canadian basketball program or a local player of interest and had a chance to facilitate winning, that's what would drive that decision. There may be pressure from the outside world, being fans, media, et cetera, but as normally is the case, you make decisions that are best for the organization and best for the franchise and you have to sometimes make unpopular decisions."


    Last June, they had a shot, and the Raptors could have a chance in the next two years, possibly, to bring home a homegrown talent. The chances have been growing, and so have the stakes. National pride.

    Source
    Would you want BC to take Kabongo if there was an OBVIOUSLY better player on the board? Or should nationalism come first?
    Last edited by Joey; Tue Feb 7th, 2012 at 02:43 PM.
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    Raptors Republic Icon mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    Nice Article on NBA.com:




    Would you want BC to take Kabongo if there was an OBVIOUSLY better player on the board? Or should nationalism come first?
    At the end of the first round, I'd rather see the Raptors draft on need. It just so happens right now they need a PG moving forward and Kabongo fits the bill.

    The other thing to remember is the draft is never a sure shot with anyone but to answer your question, if a player was OBVIOUSLY better than player on the board:

    - go with the better player if that player addresses a need.
    - if the better player does not address a need (i.e. better players or prospects are already on the roster) draft the homegrown.

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    Super Moderator MangoKid's Avatar
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    Kabongo is nowhere ready. Looking at his games as of late and the kid really looks lost. He'd be better spending another season at Texas. If we're hoping for Kabongo to enter this draft and be this team's savior, we're in more trouble than I thought.

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    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Take the best player on the board.

    Colangelo could have selected Denham Brown back in 2006. He was within range to be taken but instead they drafted a PF with the body of SG... Brown no doubt is a borderline talent but you have to think he would have lasted longer than PJ Tucker did. To me it seemed blatantly obvious that Brown was a better player than Tucker but what do I know...

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    Raptors Republic Icon mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote MangoKid wrote: View Post
    Kabongo is nowhere ready. Looking at his games as of late and the kid really looks lost. He'd be better spending another season at Texas. If we're hoping for Kabongo to enter this draft and be this team's savior, we're in more trouble than I thought.
    He has shown flashes and there is still 2 more months of ball. He has similar stats to Corey Joseph with not near the talent to work with.

    I'd love to see what Kabongo would do on Kentucky.

    Just to clarify, I was talking about a late first round draft pick. I don't know how that got in my head because, looking back, Joey made no mention of that.

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    At the end of the first round, I'd rather see the Raptors draft on need.
    Agreed. If they so happen to be from here, than its a bonus I guess.


    Quote MangoKid wrote: View Post
    Kabongo is nowhere ready. Looking at his games as of late and the kid really looks lost. He'd be better spending another season at Texas. If we're hoping for Kabongo to enter this draft and be this team's savior, we're in more trouble than I thought.
    Well I put Kabongos name in there, as he is the 'Default' Canadian Draftee at the moment.
    The question was more about Talent vs. Nationality. At what point, if any, do you sacrifice on the Talent front, to acquire a homegrown athlete. Which in itself, is of course a rare commodity.

    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    Take the best player on the board.
    Agreed.

    Colangelo could have selected Denham Brown back in 2006. He was within range to be taken but instead they drafted a PF with the body of SG... Brown no doubt is a borderline talent but you have to think he would have lasted longer than PJ Tucker did. To me it seemed blatantly obvious that Brown was a better player than Tucker but what do I know...
    HAHA Oh god ... PJ Tucker ... brutal.

    Ya I never figured out why Brown couldn't get on as even a 10th man.
    He's actually playing in the NBL right now, in Oshawa of all places!
    Last edited by Joey; Tue Feb 7th, 2012 at 03:32 PM.
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    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
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    If we're talking lottery picks, I would go with the best player available (always). But in the late 1st round/2nd round, I wouldn't mind taking a flyer on Canadian player if it means selecting him a few spots ahead of schedule.
    "I don't lie. I willfully participate in a campaign of misinformation." - Fox Mulder

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    Andrew Wiggins will be the next Canadian lottery pick if you can wait until 2015. He is number one right now on ESPN's class of 2014 recruiting class.

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Quote Nilanka wrote: View Post
    If we're talking lottery picks, I would go with the best player available (always). But in the late 1st round/2nd round, I wouldn't mind taking a flyer on Canadian player if it means selecting him a few spots ahead of schedule.
    Great points. Suppose I should have added a bit more context. I'm on board with the above.

    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Just to clarify, I was talking about a late first round draft pick. I don't know how that got in my head because, looking back, Joey made no mention of that.
    Indeed. I should have clarified.
    Last edited by Joey; Tue Feb 7th, 2012 at 04:13 PM.
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    He has shown flashes and there is still 2 more months of ball. He has similar stats to Corey Joseph with not near the talent to work with.

    I'd love to see what Kabongo would do on Kentucky.

    Just to clarify, I was talking about a late first round draft pick. I don't know how that got in my head because, looking back, Joey made no mention of that.
    +1

    In fact, if you put him on the Texas team from last year, he looks incredibly better and he starts before Cory.

    Put him on Kentucky and it's lights out as Teague can't run a team the way Myck can.

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Quote sleepz wrote: View Post
    Put him on Kentucky and it's lights out as Teague can't run a team the way Myck can.
    Completely agree. But this is probably a certainty for any Pass First PG and that specific Kentucky Line up. They need someone to move it around more.
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    Raptors Republic Superstar TheGloveinRapsUniform's Avatar
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    For starters, BC and the coaching team should first establish who theyre really intent on keeping on the current roster, and stick with that decision. This team badly needs stability. Eventhough the rebuilding process is underway, there should still be a core that has to move forward.

    However, if they land a Top 5 pick then pick the best player available. After that, pick for need. pick the player who will fit the system, and would be the most ideal fit with the core.

    I really dont think being "canadian" should be a deciding factor.
    Last edited by TheGloveinRapsUniform; Tue Feb 7th, 2012 at 04:46 PM.

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    Raptors Republic Starter Deadallus's Avatar
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    I'm not one of the guys to stick out my chest because "one of our own" is playing. I'd rather have a player from Timbuktu that can improve the team than one from Oakville that sits on the end of the bench.
    Deadallus

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    Well, why not get a bit more specific? If both Kendall Marshall and Kabongo were available for the Raptors (if they picked up a late first round pick, or early in the second), who would you take? Would Kabongo being from Canada have an influence?

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    Quote stretch wrote: View Post
    Andrew Wiggins will be the next Canadian lottery pick if you can wait until 2015. He is number one right now on ESPN's class of 2014 recruiting class.
    When did Ender Wiggin gained a "s" in his last name?

    All things considered, the speaker of the dead is the most likely person to rise the Raptors from obscurity.

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    Quote Hugmenot wrote: View Post
    When did Ender Wiggin gained a "s" in his last name?

    All things considered, the speaker of the dead is the most likely person to rise the Raptors from obscurity.
    I hadn't heard of Ender Wiggin until I just looked it up. I am very ignorant of this science fiction character though I have been reading about the prep basketball star who is playing relatively close to where you are at Huntington Prep.

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    The first book of the series, Ender's Game, is very good example of the american minimalist writing style. The story is engaging and layered enough to appeal to readers age 10 and up, especially males.

    The second book, Speaker of the Dead, is much more layered and is unlikely to be appreciated by younger readers in my opinion.

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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    Take the best player on the board.

    Colangelo could have selected Denham Brown back in 2006. He was within range to be taken but instead they drafted a PF with the body of SG... Brown no doubt is a borderline talent but you have to think he would have lasted longer than PJ Tucker did. To me it seemed blatantly obvious that Brown was a better player than Tucker but what do I know...
    Now we're letting patriotism get the better of us. Denham Brown was selected 40th by Seattle. He was waived during training camp and no other NBA team picked him up. His attitude has always been questioned - even at Connecticut. He's worn out his welcome on the Canadian National Team and never really contributed much when he did play for them. He bounced around Europe for a few years and now plays for the Oshawa Power.

    PJ Tucker was a risk but aren't all picks in the mid-20's? In a crap-shoot I think Tucker was a good wager. Some mock drafts had projected him as a First Round selection. And compared to Brown, he's proved he was the better pro. Tucker at least hung around the Raptors' roster for a couple years, and he's really developed in Europe. He was the MVP of the Israeli League and he's currently playing in Euroleague - the top hoops level in Europe.

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    Interesting that BC is applying for Canadian citizenship. Nice to see the commitment to the team, the city, and the country.

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    Quote Raptomist wrote: View Post
    Interesting that BC is applying for Canadian citizenship. Nice to see the commitment to the team, the city, and the country.
    Maybe that is a sign that BC will not be sticking around. Grunwald and Swirski got their citizenship papers and were soon back in the USA.

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