Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 1 2 3 LastLast
Results 21 to 40 of 54

Thread: The art of 'hitting the ground running': What realistic piece would help HTGR? (39)

  1. #21
    Raptors Republic Superstar Bendit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    4,704
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Apart from the good points made in the op re: the return for LB being not enough I would make the point that this presupposes that the Raptors did not have a conversation with EVERY team and finally deemed that this was the best return all aspects considered (in the op). I would also point out that BC would have been working on a LB deal for at least a couple of months...and possibly a Calderon one as well.

  2. #22
    Raptors Republic Starter
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    208
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    I wouldn't read too much in to it. McCown asked him what the max was and the max is around $20M. You are absolutely right it would mean Calderon (or Bargnani) was amnestied. But the question asked was answered with fact. Now if McCown followed up with, "Are you going to avail of the maximum amount of cap space you could have?" and BC answered, "Yes." Then i would read a lot more in to it.


    Hey Matt, I think I read somewhere that the Raps can only deal with non playoff teams and then with teams as they are eliminated from the playoffs. Is that correct? I know that this would not impact draft night but wonder what type of players are available or desirable from non playoff teams etc.

  3. #23
    Raptors Republic Rookie Phat Farmer's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Tdot
    Posts
    78
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Personally, I applaud BC for this move, even if it doesn't work out and we dont capitalize on the cap space created ( I fully expect us to by the way). Nothing is ever guaranteed, but you have to applaud him for thinking out of the box and trying to get a head start on some moves before July 1st. One thing Colangelo has never been shy about is taking a risk, and I think this is what has the naysayer's worried. However from hearing BC talk since the end of last year, I think he is looking at this rebuild from a different perspective compared to 2006. I for one am excited to see what the next months have in store

  4. #24
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    17,776
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote CT2010 wrote: View Post
    Hey Matt, I think I read somewhere that the Raps can only deal with non playoff teams and then with teams as they are eliminated from the playoffs. Is that correct? I know that this would not impact draft night but wonder what type of players are available or desirable from non playoff teams etc.
    That is my understanding on post season trades prior to July 1st. I could be wrong and if I am I hope someone sets me straight.

    I don't know who might be available. I check HoopsHype.com daily to find out the latest gossip on who might be available.

    I would imagine:

    - anyone on a bad contract would be available (Ben Gordon, Charlie V in Detroit or Blatche on Washington, for example) but obviously you wouldn't want them.

    - any team facing salary cap or luxury tax issues would also be a possibility.

    - any team looking to clear a contract to make a run in free agency.

    (and remember any unrestricted free agent or restricted free agent cannot be traded).

    Wesley Matthews is a player I'd have interest in and he was reportedly available at the deadline.

  5. #25
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    17,776
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Phat Farmer wrote: View Post
    Personally, I applaud BC for this move, even if it doesn't work out and we dont capitalize on the cap space created ( I fully expect us to by the way). Nothing is ever guaranteed, but you have to applaud him for thinking out of the box and trying to get a head start on some moves before July 1st. One thing Colangelo has never been shy about is taking a risk, and I think this is what has the naysayer's worried. However from hearing BC talk since the end of last year, I think he is looking at this rebuild from a different perspective compared to 2006. I for one am excited to see what the next months have in store
    +1

  6. #26
    Raptors Republic Rookie
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    LA
    Posts
    1
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    With the new cap space maybe BC can steal Aaron Brooks from Phoenix, using the same logic in trying to sign Wilson Chandler. The Suns are currently capped out and Brook is RFA. So if the Suns don't want to pay luxury tax BC can sign Brooks to a contract of 8-9mill per season. The roster may look like this next year

    C - Jonas
    PF- Bargs
    SF -MKGilchrist / H. Barnes (2012 pick)
    SG- Demar
    PG- Aaron Brooks

  7. #27
    Super Moderator ReubenJRD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Vancouver, BC.
    Posts
    4,004
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote gmforce74 wrote: View Post
    With the new cap space maybe BC can steal Aaron Brooks from Phoenix, using the same logic in trying to sign Wilson Chandler. The Suns are currently capped out and Brook is RFA. So if the Suns don't want to pay luxury tax BC can sign Brooks to a contract of 8-9mill per season. The roster may look like this next year

    C - Jonas
    PF- Bargs
    SF -MKGilchrist / H. Barnes (2012 pick)
    SG- Demar
    PG- Aaron Brooks
    If it takes overpaying all over again don't want it. We could use the money for something even bigger.

  8. #28
    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    6,146
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Just say no to Aaron Brooks
    @jerboat

  9. #29
    Raptors Republic Starter
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    275
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote gmforce74 wrote: View Post
    With the new cap space maybe BC can steal Aaron Brooks from Phoenix, using the same logic in trying to sign Wilson Chandler. The Suns are currently capped out and Brook is RFA. So if the Suns don't want to pay luxury tax BC can sign Brooks to a contract of 8-9mill per season. The roster may look like this next year

    C - Jonas
    PF- Bargs
    SF -MKGilchrist / H. Barnes (2012 pick)
    SG- Demar
    PG- Aaron Brooks
    PHX gave up a lot to get him, I doubt they let him walk away that easily. I feel like they could dump salary if they needed to to keep him.

  10. #30
    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    6,146
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Plus he's a selfish chucker that doesn't play defense and we want nothing to do with him
    @jerboat

  11. #31
    Raptors Republic All-Star tucas's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Hamilton
    Posts
    1,301
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Chandler has only JUST talked to the Nuggets. There is still some chance Raptors could get him now they could offer him more aswell

  12. #32
    Raptors Republic All-Star tucas's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Hamilton
    Posts
    1,301
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    scratch that just read an article from an hour ago saying he's signing long term with denver.

  13. #33
    Raptors Republic All-Star Jclaw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    1,383
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I'm ok with the kool aid. I think it takes into account some basic truths. If a free agent could take $8 million from us or $8 million from another "big market" team, they tend to go to that other team. So having this money after july1st, when everyone comes to the table, is only so helpful. The other truth is that belts are tighter these days and it seems like there is more of a trend of good players being paid like great players that other teams might want to unload. You don't have to look too far back to see teams that have firesales to clear room for free agency. That's the sub-market that the raps can hopefully exploit. Nobody here thinks we're going to get deron williams but other teams think they will and they're going to have to make some room.
    Btw, do you want to merge my thread from yesterday with this one? Lots of overlap. Let's hope this plan comes together

  14. #34
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    17,776
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote tucas wrote: View Post
    Chandler has only JUST talked to the Nuggets. There is still some chance Raptors could get him now they could offer him more aswell
    The only team that Chandler can sign with after March 1st is Denver regardless of Toronto salary cap situation.

  15. #35
    Raptors Republic All-Star
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Mississauga
    Posts
    1,570
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Didn't the grizzlies just trade Sam young simply to avoid tax? It will get worse moving forward with Gasol Randolph and Gay and the amount they will have to shell out for Mayo who they love again. Perhaps they make Mayo their focus wing, cheaper and Matt gets his man crush RGay in a lopsided salary trade, and if we get Beal in the draft.......

  16. #36
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    11,664
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default What comes to mind when I read the title:


    There's your thread theme song.

  17. #37
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    17,776
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post

    There's your thread theme song.
    Works for me!

  18. #38
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    17,776
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Alex B.
    Why weren’t the Raptors included in your “NBA’s best salary cap teams” article on ESPN?

    Larry Coon
    They led my “And the rest…” group because there is a LOT of cap room to go around, and I didn’t see them pushing ahead of other teams to sign some of the big name free agents. I had the Nuggets and Kings in the same situation.

    http://www.hoopsworld.com/nba-salary...rry-coon-32112
    Something else to consider.

    In my opinion this gives even more importance to the Barbosa trade and the possibility of having little cap space this summer should the Raptors make some trades.

    They may very well hit free agency with just their exceptions. Given the year and the players available who are actually unrestricted in addition to Colangelo's free agency history, that may not be a bad thing.

  19. #39
    Raptors Republic Starter The Coach's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Edmonton, AB
    Posts
    319
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default "Hitting the ground running"

    The Long-Term Future Of The Thunder
    By: Jonathan Tjarks
    Apr 06, 2012 12:41 PM EDT


    With the development of Serge Ibaka and James Harden to go along with Kevin Durant and Russell Westbrook, the Oklahoma City Thunder have become one of the best teams in the NBA. The bad news? They’re not going to be able to pay all of them.

    Durant and Westbrook have already received maximum contract extensions, and over the next two years, Harden and Ibaka will be up for lucrative new deals as well.

    Harden, at only 22 years old, is an athletic 6’5, 220 five-tool shooting guard with a 6’10 wingspan. There are no holes in his game: he can create his own shot (shooting 49% from the floor), shoot from the perimeter (shooting 39% from beyond the arc), create shots for others (averaging 4.3 assists and 2.5 turnovers), defend both backcourt positions and rebound (4.6 per game).

    With both Dwyane Wade and Kobe Bryant over 30, Harden is the future of the shooting guard position. The only comparable young player is Eric Gordon, but he’s missed nearly the entire season with a knee injury. When Harden is a restricted free agent at the end of next season, there could be a number of attractive young teams (the Cleveland Cavaliers, Portland Trail Blazers, Houston Rockets, Washington Wizards) with the cap room to offer him a max contract.

    Ibaka, at only 22 years old, is an athletic 6’10, 235 power forward with a 7’4 wingspan who combines two valuable skills: elite shot-blocking and the ability to knock down a mid-range jumper. There are very few 6’10+ big men with the athletic ability to protect an NBA rim; there are even fewer who aren’t a liability offensively.

    To see how attractive he will be in free agency, all you have to do is look at what centers were getting last off-season: Nene ($67 million), Tyson Chandler ($60 million), Marc Gasol ($55 million), DeAndre Jordan ($44 million). Kwame Brown even received a $7 million one-year deal!

    The new CBA, with its punitive luxury tax penalties, is designed precisely to ensure that teams can’t afford to pay four players near maximum salaries. Leaving aside whether it’s actually in the best interests of the NBA to break up the Thunder, that leaves Oklahoma City with a tough decision: do they keep Harden or Ibaka?

    While Harden has much better statistics, Ibaka is a more important piece. A championship team needs length and athleticism at the rim, and there’s no one else on their roster who can replace him.

    Harden, in contrast, is a luxury. He’s the best passer of their three young perimeter stars, but having that many ball dominant players is a bit of a zero-sum game, as there’s only one basketball to go around. Giving him the ball at the end of games takes it out of the hands of Durant and Westbrook. The Thunder didn’t invest $170 million in their two All-NBA players to turn them into decoys.

    However, Oklahoma City would still need to replace his bench production, as well as the below market price they currently receive it at. There’s only one place to do that: the top of the NBA Draft.

    If Gerald Wallace is worth a first-round pick with only Top-3 protections, what would Harden fetch on the trading block? There could be two teams with multiple lottery picks in 2012: the Utah Jazz (who have the Golden State Warriors pick if it falls out of the Top-7) and the Portland Trail Blazers (who dealt Wallace to the Nets). Even in one of the most loaded drafts in a decade, as long as neither had the first overall pick, both would probably be willing to deal their two first-rounders, as well as a 2014 one, for Harden.

    Such a deal would setup Oklahoma City well into the next decade.

    Ever since the publication of “Moneyball”, every team in professional sports has been trying to exploit “market inefficiencies”. However, Michael Lewis’ book, while extremely entertaining, buried the lead: Oakland was able to field a great with a low payroll because they had a bumper crop of young All-Stars making relative peanuts. In professional sports, the greatest market inefficiency is, and will always be, the ability to accurately scout and develop talent.

    Over the last few years, the Oklahoma City front office has proven they are well ahead of the curve in terms of drafting philosophy. Anyone could have picked Durant, but Westbrook (No. 4 in 2008), Harden (No. 3 in 2009) and Ibaka (No. 24 in 2009) weren’t no brainers at the time. Even their misses -- Jeff Green (No. 5 in 2007), Byron Mullens (No. 24 in 2008) and Cole Aldrich (No. 11 in 2010) -- could still develop into usable 6’9+ players. In an industry where Jared Sullinger is considered a lottery pick, there are plenty of inefficiencies left to exploit.

    More intriguingly, there is a bumper crop of young shooting guards in the 2012 draft, at least four of them with All-Star ceilings: Terrence Ross (Washington), Jeremy Lamb (UConn), Bradley Beal (Florida) and Dion Waiters (Syracuse). With a top shooting guard guaranteed to fall, the Thunder could use their other lottery pick to gamble on an extremely talented 6’11+ project like Andre Drummond (UConn) or Perry Jones III (Baylor).

    No one is going to be perfect in the draft, but the Thunder have had a much higher success rate than most of the league. Why not give themselves as many chances as possible to use their competitive advantage?

    Dealing Harden would lower their chances of winning a championship in 2013, but it could open up a much larger title window. Let’s say they hit on one of the two picks they could acquire in 2012. In four years, they could spin this cycle forward again, flipping elite young talent looking for a payday into more elite young talent on cost-controlled salaries.

    Oklahoma City has one of the NBA’s most forward-thinking front offices. If they leverage Harden’s contract situation correctly, they could get so far ahead of the rest of the league their competition will never be able to catch up.



    Read more: http://basketball.realgm.com/article...#ixzz1rMfBF0KW
    I brought this up in a different thread; however, thought this article could lead into a different discussion.

    What realistic piece would be best to "hit the ground running" next year?

    Harden is on the top of my list. Is he worth our first round pick? Would it take more?
    “Be more concerned with your character than your reputation, because your character is what you really are, while your reputation is merely what others think you are.”
    ― John Wooden

  20. #40
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    17,776
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I'd be shocked if Harden was moved.

    The premise of this article is trade Harden for a great prospect before you have to pay Harden. Unfortunately, any draft pick is going to take time to develop. By the time he does, it will be time to pay him. That doesn't make sense, in my opinion. It is certainly not going to get the Thunder any farther ahead than what they get from Harden, again, in my opinion.


    So keeping with what you asked, I don't see Harden as being realistic.

    As for what piece would be realistic, I like Wesley Matthews. No where near the talent Harden is but a very good 3 and D player which is what Casey said he is looking for (25-28, shooter, defenders, experience).
    Last edited by mcHAPPY; Sat Apr 7th, 2012 at 11:27 AM.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •