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Thread: Keeping DeRozen means passing on Barnes?

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    Raptors Republic Starter charlz's Avatar
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    Default Keeping DeRozen means passing on Barnes?

    Hereís the thing: if Toronto intends to hang on to DeRozan, then Kidd-Gilchrist is a much more sensible match on the perimeter. Thatís mostly because if DeRozan isnít scoring then he isnít doing much of anything at the NBA level.
    OUCH - but it is hard to argue otherwise

    Kidd-Gilchrist fills in all of the gaps on any team he plays for; he rebounds, he defends all three backcourt positions, heís got great passing acumen, he attacks the basket on offense and he oozes leadership in a way that no current Raptor does. He exemplifies the kind of basketball that Casey wants the Raptors to play and if he could shoot heíd be a no-brainer number two pick.
    A compelling case for Kidd-Gilchrist - seemingly cut in the mold of Duane Casey
    The problem is that he isnít much of a shooter and with DeRozanís range maxing out at about 16-feet that would make it hard for Toronto to open up the midrange for Bargnani and Valanciunas to operate in. In fact, to compensate the team would have Bargnani setting up from the perimeter too often, and the teamís offense really should be operating around him, not him being shuffled around to compensate for the weaknesses of others.
    A great article which takes in to account a lot of the things being weighed by Raptors (alleged) brain trust ...interestingly no mention of JLamb
    "I may be wrong ... but I doubt it"

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    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Default Key point:

    Colangelo drafts the top player available on his draft board and worries about the rest later. They're not going to pass on anybody because there is already a player playing that position.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
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    The article also suggests that if Beal is Colangelo's choice, that opens up the possibility of packaging DeRozan (perhaps with Davis), to fill another area of need.
    "I don't lie. I willfully participate in a campaign of misinformation." - Fox Mulder

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    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    If they take a wing I have no problem with DeRozan being moved to upgrade some other position, like the PG spot.

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    This is the money shot from the article, in my opinion:

    At this point it would be foolish to advocate for any of the three options. Each brings with him a certain logic as Torontoís pick, and by the time the draft rolls around they may not even have the chance to select from all three. However, as the Raptorsí season winds down and the fansí eyes start drifting towards next year itís encouraging to know that the club is well-positioned to make moves to significantly improve on the modest steps forward the club has made this year.
    Those 3 options from the article are Barnes, Beal, and MKG.

    Toronto could be a radically different team in 3-4 months.

    I definitely see major moves done prior to or during draft night.

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    Raptors Republic Starter SuperRaptor's Avatar
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    I think you go for Barnes if he is still on the board. This guy was projected to go 1st about 6 months ago, and has all star potential you don't pass up on that.

    MKG looks like a great pick too, but the way he is described reminds me too much of a ... role player. We have JJ to play defense at the 3 for us.

    Keep derozan unless we are packaging him with Davis for an upgrade at the 2.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    MKG strikes me as a guy Casey would petition for hard.
    @jerboat

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    Raptors Republic Starter charlz's Avatar
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    Quote Nilanka wrote: View Post
    The article also suggests that if Beal is Colangelo's choice, that opens up the possibility of packaging DeRozan (perhaps with Davis), to fill another area of need.
    ahem point guard

    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    Colangelo drafts the top player available on his draft board and worries about the rest later. They're not going to pass on anybody because there is already a player playing that position.
    yes but if both Barnes and Kidd-Gill are available it is hard to choose. Barnes is the long scoring juggernaut with passive tenancies - Kidd-Gill is the defensive hard nosed gamer. ... which mix carries more championship pedigree?

    OR do you draft Barnes and move DeRozen?
    Last edited by charlz; Tue Mar 20th, 2012 at 10:30 AM.
    "I may be wrong ... but I doubt it"

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    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
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    If it's a choice between Barnes and MKG, I would go with MKG and hope that with enough practice time, he can develop his offensive game.

    It's easy to convince players to shoot. It's not easy to get them to go balls out 24/7.
    "I don't lie. I willfully participate in a campaign of misinformation." - Fox Mulder

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    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    Yeah, you can't really teach motor, good point.
    @jerboat

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    Any chance we could trade DD or Ed for another top 5 pick and draft both?
    Im assuming it would not happen but its a possibility

    Any teams (im thinking maybe Washington) That would rather have a 2 year old player like DD who is more ready to play now, then get another rookie?

    Calderon
    Barnes
    MKG
    Bargs
    Val

    I do see a nice blend of offence and defence there.

  12. #12
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    Quote Nilanka wrote: View Post
    It's easy to convince players to shoot. It's not easy to get them to go balls out 24/7.
    Amen.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
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    Quote Hello wrote: View Post
    Calderon
    Barnes
    MKG
    Bargs
    Val

    I do see a nice blend of offence and defence there.
    That's a drool-worthy starting lineup. But I wonder if Colangelo/Casey have the stomachs to deal with 3 rookies playing heavy minutes.
    "I don't lie. I willfully participate in a campaign of misinformation." - Fox Mulder

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    Raptors Republic Veteran NoPropsneeded's Avatar
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    its not drool worthy when you got three new guys not knowing wtf to do half the time. Too many rookies is never good and starting them from day 1 is even worse unless their name is Jonas Valanciunas

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    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
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    lol, why is Jonas the exception to the rule? Barnes and MKG are considered "NBA-ready" too.

    Besides, that lineup may not be drool-worthy in November 2012, but it will be in 2-3 years (which is much more important).
    "I don't lie. I willfully participate in a campaign of misinformation." - Fox Mulder

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    Raptors Republic Rookie Jon_Wade's Avatar
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    IMO although MKG doesn't have the most complete offensive game I find that there are some good offensive parts to his game i mean obviously the rebounding and passing but he is a pretty good slasher and pretty solid at posting up at the right time.
    Whoever told you skies the limit is looking dumb because I'm 22 and i'm moonwalking on the sun.

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    Quote Hello wrote: View Post
    Any teams (im thinking maybe Washington) That would rather have a 2 year old player like DD who is more ready to play now, then get another rookie?

    After shipping out Mcgee and Young, they might actually bite.

    Calderon
    Barnes
    MKG
    Bargs
    Val

    This line up excites me...even if it takes a year for barnes and MKG to get their legs under them.

    Bayless/ Forbes
    (crop of free agent SG pietrus/allen/ vet?) Forbes
    JJ/Kleiza
    Amir/ Kleiza
    Free agent Center(s) ( asik/gray)

    not too bad for a bench if you ask me....plenty of versatility.

  18. #18
    Raptors Republic Starter draftedraptor's Avatar
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    Another season of disappointment would be inexcusable. The raptors draft the best player available to them even if it means they take minutes off Andrea or Demar. Then we make moves in the free agency and trades. If we are not competing for playoff spot next year I will go mad. 4 top draft picks in Andrea, Jonas, Demar and MKG/Barnes/Beal means we have to stop making excuses and get there.

  19. #19
    Raptors Republic Veteran NoPropsneeded's Avatar
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    I'm still high on miller. He has soo much potential at the 3, I'm talking all star or maybe superstar. He can do a lot of things on the court. He extremely versatile and can handle the ball and be very effective in isolation situations. So when the game is on the line with 10 seconds left and the raptors down by 2 and Miller pulls up and drains the buzzer beater lol.

    http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Quincy-Miller-5764/

    check out what draft express has to say about him

  20. #20
    Raptors Republic Rookie bounty's Avatar
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    Gilchrist

    -Is the best perimeter defender, on the best defensive team in the NCAA.

    -He's one of the best wing rebounders in college averaging 7.7 rpg

    -Has good court vision/passing ability (possible point forward) averaging 2.1 apg

    -Shooting .48 FG% as a 17/18yo freshman

    -Averaging 13 ppg on 8 atpg as a 3rd option.

    -76% from the FT, which means there's potential for his shot, though he's shooting .300 % from 3 (same as a 20yo freshman Wade).

    -He's got all the intagibles you want in a player/leader.

    -Biggest negative being his advanced handles.

    Taking into consideration he's shown on occasion that he can break his man down with either his left or right. At 18 combined with the previous points made, he's clearly my top choice for the best wing in the draft for the mere fact that his weaknesses upon his broad strengths are correctable.

    #1 MKG -18yo freshman
    #2 Barnes -20yo sophmore
    #3 Lamb -20yo sophmore

    Watching Barnes/Lamb fail their teams the past couple games because their shot wasn't falling, I'm taking this time to remind those who are looking for offensive fit, that when Kentucky struggled against top competition, MKG has stood out as the teams best player & carried them to wins.

    In the Indy loss dont know if you guys still remember it was a while ago Davis sat most the game with foul trouble, Jones disappeared & they lost the game on a last sec 3, by one point because MKG who can't create or shoot, carried them.

    MKG impacts wins = my definition of a franchise player. Not someone who can create & score like Melo without impacting wins like he should.

    Valanciunas-----/Amir
    Bargnani--------/Ed
    MKG--------/Johnson
    DeRozan------------/someone
    Nash-----------/Bayless

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