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Thread: Trade the pick: ESPN late to the party (274)

  1. #81
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Some key words I think you're missing here:
    • If
    • Might
    • for example
    While I appreciate your opinion, I got those key words Matt. I just dodn't appreciate how you used them. You missed the mark in my opinion.

    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Some key concepts I think you're missing here:
    • any draft pick trade would happen on draft night when who is available at what selection is known
    Really? Because I don't recall you ever mentioning exact time. You never mentioned the trade would happen after the draft. Is that what you're saying now?


    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    • trading the draft pick a month or two out of the draft is not very bright.
    I'm not suggesting you said that Matt. I'm suggesting if the Raptors name is called at#5, they're on the clock, they don't know who the heck is going to be there at #16. Typically when teams swap picks the team with the higher pick drafts the guy the other team wants. So, unless you have a crystal ball and have Colangelo on speed dial there are flaws to your "hypothetical" plan.

    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    • remembering all this happens on draft night, but one of the points was say Moe Harkless or Quincy Miler (again, hypothetical) was atop BC's draft board. All the mock board and other GM's have those guys in the high teens but BC with his great talent evaluation skills in the draft feels those guys are better than the consensus picks in the 5-10 range. Why wouldn't he trade the pick if he can get another asset AND the player he truly covets at a lower pick? So putting it all together at the Raptors selection, they take the best player available or the player another team wants and then another team takes the player BC wants later along with acquring another asset(s).
    Right. And so they trade they swap picks, move to #16 and Quincy Miller hypothetically gets drafted at #15. Bravo.

  2. #82
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    While I appreciate your opinion, I got those key words Matt. I just dodn't appreciate how you used them. You missed the mark in my opinion.

    Really? Because I don't recall you ever mentioning exact time. You never mentioned the trade would happen after the draft. Is that what you're saying now?



    I'm not suggesting you said that Matt. I'm suggesting if the Raptors name is called at#5, they're on the clock, they don't know who the heck is going to be there at #16. Typically when teams swap picks the team with the higher pick drafts the guy the other team wants. So, unless you have a crystal ball and have Colangelo on speed dial there are flaws to your "hypothetical" plan.

    Right. And so they trade they swap picks, move to #16 and Quincy Miller hypothetically gets drafted at #15. Bravo.
    Hypothetical trade would happen draft night. I don't recall you saying the trade would not happen draft night - so there you go.

    I thought we've agreed all along this is hypothetical. The crystal ball comment and Colangelo on speed dial is inappropriate given the parameters of the conversation. At what point have I claimed that anything I'm saying is what BC is thinking? I've gone out of my way to make that clear. Remember the title of this thread is "trade the pick". Maybe you should start a thread, "For the love of all that is sacred and pure, no matter what happens or is available on draft night, don't trade the pick under any circumstances!"

    I don't think you did get my point because the best player available was taken by the Raptors. If a trade can't be worked out, they still have the best player available.
    Last edited by Matt52; Tue Apr 10th, 2012 at 09:42 AM.

  3. #83
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    I don't think you're getting it. The holder of the #16 pick will want Colangelo to select his guy. Holder of the #16 pick calls Colangelo on draft night:

    #16 pick Owner: Yo, Bry, Bry, how's it going? We want the #5 pick and two of those big collars you're always sporting. We're willing to give you the #16 pick plus that dude we took a few years back that we know you like.

    Colangelo: Sounds good. I'm looking to draft Quincy Miller and Chad Ford says he'll be on the board at #16. This works out great for us.

    #16 pick Owner: Alright. Draft Cody Zeller for us. We love that guy and Chad Ford says he's going in the top six.

    Colangelo: Done. You select Quincy Miller, just like we said.

    An hour later...

    David Stern: And with the 15th pick in the draft, "hypothetical team" hypothetically selects Quincy Miller.

    Colangelo: Dammit!

  4. #84
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    I don't think you're getting it. The holder of the #16 pick will want Colangelo to select his guy. Holder of the #16 pick calls Colangelo on draft night:

    #16 pick Owner: Yo, Bry, Bry, how's it going? We want the #5 pick and two of those big collars you're always sporting. We're willing to give you the #16 pick plus that dude we took a few years back that we know you like.

    Colangelo: Sounds good. I'm looking to draft Quincy Miller and Chad Ford says he'll be on the board at #16. This works out great for us.

    #16 pick Owner: Alright. Draft Cody Zeller for us. We love that guy and Chad Ford says he's going in the top six.

    Colangelo: Done. You select Quincy Miller, just like we said.

    An hour later...

    David Stern: And with the 15th pick in the draft, "hypothetical team" hypothetically selects Quincy Miller.

    Colangelo: Dammit!
    I think you have tunnel vision.

    Your scenario is one way in which it can play out. It may or may not be the most likely.

    How have so many draft night trades happened where picks are exchanged. Any trade would be contingent on the wanted players being available. This is why the Raptors would pick the best player available at their pick and if a possible trade does not work out, so be it. A perfect example is the Indiana-San Antonio trade. Do you think San Antonio handed over Hill before it was known Leonard would be available?

    Here is something else I don't feel that has been considered and it is another unknown so I'll apologize now for making assumptions on Colangelo's behalf. What IF Colangelo feels Holiday is better than any player he could use his pick on. What if he traded the Raps pick for Holiday and 76er pick. So in keeping with hitting the ground running and getting the best player available, the Raps have that with Holiday then at the 76er pick they take the best player available no matter who it is or who BC hopes is available.

    I don't think it is a stretch that a 21 year old, 6'4", defensive minded, NBA proven PG who can create for himself and has a solid outside shot would be the best player the Raptors can get with a pick in the 6-10 range. No, he is not a draft pick but he could fall under the umbrella of the best player available - thinking outside the box, of course.

  5. #85
    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    Mod fight! Mod fight!

  6. #86
    Super Moderator ReubenJRD's Avatar
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    Quote ceez wrote: View Post
    Mod fight! Mod fight!
    LOL.

    Wow, I ain't gettin' in this one.

  7. #87
    Raptors Republic Veteran NoPropsneeded's Avatar
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    that is actually a sweet idea. We trade our pick for Holiday and 76ers pick and we draft Miller with their pick and we're all set

  8. #88
    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    We'd probably be able to draft Miller with our second rounder at this point

  9. #89
    Raptors Republic Veteran NoPropsneeded's Avatar
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    Quote ceez wrote: View Post
    We'd probably be able to draft Miller with our second rounder at this point
    nah he's projected just outside the lottery. And i'm talking about Quincy Miller

  10. #90
    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    So am I. If he does declare (I don't think he will) he'll be a late first round pick at best.

  11. #91
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    I think you have tunnel vision.

    Your scenario is one way in which it can play out. It may or may not be the most likely.

    How have so many draft night trades happened where picks are exchanged. Any trade would be contingent on the wanted players being available. This is why the Raptors would pick the best player available at their pick and if a possible trade does not work out, so be it. A perfect example is the Indiana-San Antonio trade. Do you think San Antonio handed over Hill before it was known Leonard would be available?

    Here is something else I don't feel that has been considered and it is another unknown so I'll apologize now for making assumptions on Colangelo's behalf. What IF Colangelo feels Holiday is better than any player he could use his pick on. What if he traded the Raps pick for Holiday and 76er pick. So in keeping with hitting the ground running and getting the best player available, the Raps have that with Holiday then at the 76er pick they take the best player available no matter who it is or who BC hopes is available.

    I don't think it is a stretch that a 21 year old, 6'4", defensive minded, NBA proven PG who can create for himself and has a solid outside shot would be the best player the Raptors can get with a pick in the 6-10 range. No, he is not a draft pick but he could fall under the umbrella of the best player available - thinking outside the box, of course.
    Ok, so you've blown past the main idea of the thread. The thread questioned should they trade the pick and not should they trade the player they've picked after the fact. So yeah, I have tunnel vision. It's calibrated to the exact specifications of post #1 by Ceez. My answers are influenced by the thread topic.
    Last edited by Apollo; Tue Apr 10th, 2012 at 12:09 PM. Reason: .

  12. #92
    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    Ok, if the Raps trade the pick I'll buy everyone wings.
    Cool beans!

  13. #93
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    Ok, so you've blown past the main idea of the thread. The thread questioned should they trade the pick and not should they trade the player they've picked after the fact. So yeah, I have tunnel vision. It's calibrated to the exact specifications of post #1 by Ceez. My answers are influenced by the thread topic.
    I could have gone astray, it wouldn't be the first time. Apologies for that.

    Personally, unless you are drafting #1 or in this year's case #2 where #1 is a given, I wouldn't trade a pick until draft night for the very reasons you have outlined.

  14. #94
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Quote ceez wrote: View Post
    Cool beans!
    No, I remember it going more like this:
    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    Ok, if the Raps trade the pick I'll let Ceez buy everyone wings.

  15. #95
    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    You can't take back what you promised Apollo!

  16. #96
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Alright, if they trade the pick I'll send you that Paul McCartney CD you're always bugging me for. He's not my cup of tea but whatever. Maybe they'll change the Raptors' intro song to "Hey Jude" or something for 2012/13. It would please the growing "Tank Nation" that's for sure.

  17. #97
    Super Moderator ReubenJRD's Avatar
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    Raptors Intro livin' in Rack City.

    I thought they shouldv'e stayed with Ni**as in Paris.

  18. #98
    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Hypothetical trade would happen draft night. I don't recall you saying the trade would not happen draft night - so there you go.

    I thought we've agreed all along this is hypothetical. The crystal ball comment and Colangelo on speed dial is inappropriate given the parameters of the conversation. At what point have I claimed that anything I'm saying is what BC is thinking? I've gone out of my way to make that clear. Remember the title of this thread is "trade the pick". Maybe you should start a thread, "For the love of all that is sacred and pure, no matter what happens or is available on draft night, don't trade the pick under any circumstances!"

    I don't think you did get my point because the best player available was taken by the Raptors. If a trade can't be worked out, they still have the best player available.
    i didn't realize this was parent/teacher interviews. lol
    If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?

    Sometimes, I like to buy a book on CD and listen to it, while reading music.

  19. #99
    Raptors Republic All-Star Puffer's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Of course, this is all hypothetical and the odds of it happening in any respect is equivalent to me getting a call up to replace Gray in the starting lineup as the season continues onwards.
    I didn't realize how tall you were.

  20. #100
    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Quote Puffer wrote: View Post
    I didn't realize how tall you were.
    maybe, because you've never seen him before and he's never mentioned it.
    ... ya, i know buzzkill of the day.

    please,hold the applause.
    If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?

    Sometimes, I like to buy a book on CD and listen to it, while reading music.

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