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Thread: Article that sums up my feelings about the Raps and (some) Raptor fans

  1. #1
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    Default Article that sums up my feelings about the Raps and (some) Raptor fans

    http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/...hable-nba-game

    Detroit didn't overpay badly in these deals, but what was the team hoping to accomplish? To lock up the core of a team that when healthy can compete for the eighth seed in the Eastern Conference playoffs?
    Detroit fans are real. They saw their team win a championship eight years ago and play in Game 7 of the NBA Finals a year after that. They see this Pistons team, with its decent young core and guys like Prince and Bynum and Maxiell, who all seem like they could succeed in more limited roles, and they wonder: What if we could land a bona fide star? Unfortunately, this line of wishful thinking tumbles swiftly into delusion
    This is what I think we're building too: A team with assets that need to improve just to get us into a playoff spot. Supported by fans who wear raptor-rose coloured glasses and overvalue the talent that we have.

    And yeah, I read an article about a Bobcats-Pistons game, so I accept that I deserve no respect : )

  2. #2
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    Have you considered cheering for a new team or visiting anti-fan forums?

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    Raptors Republic All-Star slaw's Avatar
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    This offseason will clarify the direction of this team. I don't think you're the only who is nervous about Colangelo and his plans but, as a certified fire-Colangelo guy, I am resigned to waiting and seeing what happens from June-August. If they can add an elite perimeter prospect to play with Valancunias and another elite young talent, we can hopefully avoid the treadmill team fate.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran NoPropsneeded's Avatar
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    we aren't overvaluing shit. It seems you are undervaluing this team. If you don't like the raptors go jump on the miami heat bandwagon.

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    More time to respond now.

    Why the Raptors are not the Pistons*:

    1) The Raptors have one top 5 pick coming next year (JV) and hopefully another one on the way.
    2) The Raptors do not have $40M PER SEASON tied up in Ben Gordon, Rodney Stuckey, Tayshaun Prince, Charlie V, and Jonas Jerebko over the NEXT 3 YEARS and $50M over the next 2 years if you include Richard Hamilton (who plays for Chicago!) and Jason Maxiell to the aforementioned list of players.
    3) The Raptors are not $8M over the salary cap before this off season even starts and are not already at the salary cap for 2013-14.
    4) The Raptors have $12M in cap space to use before July 1st and a $7.6 TPE for trades.
    5) The Raptors have anywhere from $10-20M to use on free agency should no trades be made before July 1st.

    In summary, the Raptors are not the Pistons because they have flexibility whereas the Pistons have very little to none.



    *I attempted to remove the rose-coloured glasses but I recognize I might have failed.



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    Raptors Republic Superstar Bendit's Avatar
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    "Watching the Bobcats play is kind of like prying open a manhole to look in on the NBA's sewer and see what kind of scum is floating around."

    Ouch.

    Has anyone said anything close to that about the Raps I wonder. I hope our forums dont come across quite as delusional (there maybe a couple) as the Pistons one. My fear is that if this off season is not negotiated deftly and successfully talent wise then the Pistons shall be our fate. They have certainly locked themselves in with not much wiggle room. The writer certainly didnt think much of either Biyombo or Walker two favorites here prior to the draft last year (I admit I was a Kemba fan).

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    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Have you considered cheering for a new team or visiting anti-fan forums?
    You know Matt, not everyone accepts failure and lingers on hope.

  8. #8
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Default Focus on the plan

    The man has all the assets and flexibility in place to have a great Q3. We all need to seriously think about what we all feel is a realistic outcome should Colangelo make all the right moves this summer. It seems we have three groups in here. Those who trash every move. Those who overvalue most moves and the players on roster and then those in the middle who occasionally fall into either category. We shouldn't be expecting a historical Celtics recovery from earlier last decade but we should have firm expectations in Colangelo sticking to the plan he laid out when he was lucky enough to get extended. He needs to live up to what he promised, not to what we expect. Judgement from the board won't be influence based on what we expect in here. He's going to get judged by them based on what he promised to deliver and the results that follow. We need to keep that in mind if somebody is inbound who we don't personally appreciate. We need to step back and ask if it fits what the stated plan is. If so then maybe we need to take one more step back and let things develop and see how it goes...

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    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Quote NoPropsneeded wrote: View Post
    we aren't overvaluing shit. It seems you are undervaluing this team. If you don't like the raptors go jump on the miami heat bandwagon.
    Before getting outraged. I recommendTaking a second and consider what this guy is saying and why he might feel that way.

    Be more Bruce Banner and less Incredible Hulk. More Bixby, Less Ferigno.

    I know you won't understand that last reference. But, that's why Wikipedia was formed.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Puffer's Avatar
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    The Raptors have two players that could start on more than half of the teams in the league in Jose and Bargnani. Maybe DeRozan as well. Next year they get JV who will be a solid starter before the year is out and another one who will be in the upper half of centers in the league. They have enough cap space and that they could land two more solid pieces or one All star type player. They will be picking in the top six in the draft and will land another solid player who could be starting in his second year. Three players coming in over the next year who will likely be starter, which means moving some current starter to the bench. That would leave them with a half decent bench as well. Their bench players have performed unevenly this year but in at least a dozen games have outperformed the starting 5. Their depth will be that much better in 2012-2013.

    I don't think ther eis anything to worry about, and everything to look forward to. And they still have a 8.7% (estimated) chance to land Davis. :-)

  11. #11
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    You know Matt, not everyone accepts failure and lingers on hope.
    Watch some games and you'll see success and reason for optimism.

  12. #12
    Raptors Republic All-Star stretch's Avatar
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    I have expectations for a much more competitive Raptors team for next season. I have faith in Dwayne Casey, not so much in Bryan Colangelo.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Watch some games and you'll see success and reason for optimism.
    There are small succeses in overall failure.

    Not saying their shouldn't be optimism... for the future.But, in the now, How are you going to sell me as to why I should watch one of the remaining games?

    Without preaching to me about the futute. Sell me on a game. You have my word that if you convince me I will watch one of the remaining games in it's entirety.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Quote stretch wrote: View Post
    I have expectations for a much more competitive Raptors team for next season. I have faith in Dwayne Casey, not so much in Bryan Colangelo.
    Colangelo has two executive of the year awards.

    Casey has a losing record and not so good track record as head coach.

  15. #15
    Raptors Republic Veteran NoPropsneeded's Avatar
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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    Before getting outraged. I recommendTaking a second and consider what this guy is saying and why he might feel that way.

    Be more Bruce Banner and less Incredible Hulk. More Bixby, Less Ferigno.

    I know you won't understand that last reference. But, that's why Wikipedia was formed.
    Sorry I just hate fans like that who bash every move the raps make. Like seriously if you do not have faith in the team just leave, no one is forcing you to watch. That statement can go for you too

  16. #16
    Raptors Republic Veteran NoPropsneeded's Avatar
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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    Colangelo has two executive of the year awards.

    Casey has a losing record and not so good track record as head coach.
    He's only been a head coach for like 2 seasons and it was on a mediocre team so Give the man a break. I think both our GM and coach are good. Give them the summer and you'll see

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    I wish the Raptors followed in the Bobcats footstep!

    At least they're on to something. If we were serious about tanking then we would have traded Barbosa a long time ago as he's won a few games for us - and made some other moves too. They want to win now but build for the future??? I have no idea what BC is on but it seems like he's building another mediocre team of overpaid underachievers.

    Matt52~ What was that about Detroit with 5 players tied up with 40 mil? How about them Raptors with 4 players @ close to 40mil: Calderon, Bargs, Turk(Barbosa), Amir - next up Demar... if they don't pay Bayless a ridiculous amount first.

    What else is wrong with the Raptors?
    Not-a-one of em has a killer instinct. A burning desire to just ram the ball down the opponents throat.
    Demar looks like he's on weed half the time (a little like Mcgrady). Bargs seems like he's spaced out most of the time. Amir and Jose seems just too nice.
    The only one that seems to have that juice is the one that hasn't joined the Raptors yet in Jonas.
    We don't need any more passive players like a Barnes or a Drummond. We need go get-ers like a MGK, Davis, Beal, etc

    I could go on and on and on about my frustrations with the Raptors but I'll wait til the draft and hope that they miraculously win it... and then pray that they trade Bargs, Demar, Ed (or their 'future') for some young stud picks/prospects... and hope they put in a max offer for Eric Gordon... and then resign Jose to half the money he's making now...

    ... and then I think then i'll be able to forgive BC

    What are they doing beating the Celts? ARG!

  18. #18
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    Quote raptors2012 wrote: View Post
    I wish the Raptors followed in the Bobcats footstep!

    At least they're on to something. If we were serious about tanking then we would have traded Barbosa a long time ago as he's won a few games for us - and made some other moves too. They want to win now but build for the future??? I have no idea what BC is on but it seems like he's building another mediocre team of overpaid underachievers.

    Matt52~ What was that about Detroit with 5 players tied up with 40 mil? How about them Raptors with 4 players @ close to 40mil: Calderon, Bargs, Turk(Barbosa), Amir - next up Demar... if they don't pay Bayless a ridiculous amount first.

    What else is wrong with the Raptors?
    Not-a-one of em has a killer instinct. A burning desire to just ram the ball down the opponents throat.
    Demar looks like he's on weed half the time (a little like Mcgrady). Bargs seems like he's spaced out most of the time. Amir and Jose seems just too nice.
    The only one that seems to have that juice is the one that hasn't joined the Raptors yet in Jonas.
    We don't need any more passive players like a Barnes or a Drummond. We need go get-ers like a MGK, Davis, Beal, etc

    I could go on and on and on about my frustrations with the Raptors but I'll wait til the draft and hope that they miraculously win it... and then pray that they trade Bargs, Demar, Ed (or their 'future') for some young stud picks/prospects... and hope they put in a max offer for Eric Gordon... and then resign Jose to half the money he's making now...

    ... and then I think then i'll be able to forgive BC

    What are they doing beating the Celts? ARG!
    Ah yes, the Bobcats. How happy Raptors fans would be in their situation.

    The Raptors are a team in transition with a roster in transition. You should compare the salaries on the rosters over the next 2-4 years of the Pistons and Raptors before making inaccurate statements. What does Turk or Barbosa have to do with anything? They are not on the team and their salary is certainly not being counted in to 2013-14. Who says DeMar gets extended? He has one year left on his rookie contract plus a restricted free agency. Who says Bayless is back? Colangelo has talked about the PG of the future and that excludes Bayless; he has talked about having him be a combo guard off the bench while Bayless has talked about starting - hardly two guys on the same page.

    The rest is not worth responding to. It reminds me of the kid throwing the tantrum because Mommy won't buy the candy bar at the grocery store. No amount of logic or rational discussion will diffuse the situation.
    Last edited by Matt52; Sat Apr 14th, 2012 at 07:33 AM.

  19. #19
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    There are small succeses in overall failure.

    Not saying their shouldn't be optimism... for the future.But, in the now, How are you going to sell me as to why I should watch one of the remaining games?

    Without preaching to me about the futute. Sell me on a game. You have my word that if you convince me I will watch one of the remaining games in it's entirety.
    Sorry, LBF. I'm not selling you on watching the Raptors on a Raptor fan forum. If you are not interested in watching the games, why waste the pixels here?

    If you watched the games with an understanding of basketball you'd see the progress and reason for optimism. Things don't miraculously get better over night. The disappointment will continue with this mentality. The rebuild is less than 2 years old and on going. Much progress has been made with much more to come in the next 3 months.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Balls of Steel's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Watch some games and you'll see success and reason for optimism.
    Missed the Boston game but saw the highlights. Things could be a lot worse, like Bobcats worse! Also, I second the sentiment on cap space. Everyone's talking about game-changing players switching teams but the reality is that a ton of cap-space after the new agreement may just be the best franchise altering element any team could have!
    “The saving of our world from pending doom will come, not through the complacent adjustment of the conforming majority, but through the creative maladjustment of a nonconforming minority.” - Martin Luther King

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