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Thread: Is This Franchise In Trouble?!

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    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Default Is This Franchise In Trouble?!

    There's been grumblings that this franchise is in trouble, not deep. But, attendance has sunken(as to be expected with a rebuild), there is a general feeling of just... while actually that's the thing there is no feeling, let's say the majority of fans/people outside this website there is a general numbness.

    To me and I think some will agree, words to describe the atmosphere around this team are lack of excitement, dullness, mysterious, etc.

    In general the franchise is not healthy, Toronto fans are just so hopeful for a winner that everyone has hopped off the raptors band waggon and hopped on the jays. If baseball season more severely overlapped basketball season this team would probably have seen a severe drop in attendance and be in some serious trouble.

    The only thing this team has right now is hope and that's starting to wear thin with Toronto fans. There hasn't really been a whole lot of excitement around this team this year. I mean they aren't going to make the playoffs, aren't likely to get the first pick.

    Last years top pick isn't even with the team. There isn't really a top face or public figure on the team. I mean Bargnani is their top player. He's been playing well, but, he doesn't speak the best english and he's not really been put on a pedestal like a Stoudamire, Carter, Bosh, or even Turkoglu when he was here.

    This is probably the worst year of hype like the team hasn't been covered nearly as much in the local media... the publicity is way down this year then I think it ever has been before.

    Maybe this is just me, but, I used to consider myself a die hard fan and this year I have found myself with little interest or care of basically everything to do with the team this year.

    There is nothing to latch onto... for this year at least and if this team doesn't do something of more than just slight significance this offseason. The future is not looking bright.

    Personally, I hope they get a star in this draft and Valanciunas has a solid rookie campaign. To restore some faith around this team and at least start uprising.

    Thoughts?

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    Raptors Republic All-Star slaw's Avatar
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    No, not in trouble. Not going to go into but the franchise is solid despite all the losing.

    Personally, my interest level is way down this year. I usually watch 70+ games a season. I suspect this year I will come in somewhere around 35 out of 66. This is the first year where I've actually forgot they were even on TV for some games. My dad and I also cancelled our usual trip(s) to Toronto to catch games. He just wasn't interested.

    This franchise has survived a lot. I remember many people thought the whole thing was trouble when Isiaih Thomas bailed. I remember the doom and gloom here the year Vince was drafted. I remember the despair when Carter was traded for nothing. The 2012 Raptors aren't unique. This franchise has been a loser for most of its existence and it somehow plugs along making (from what I understand) a healthy annual profit. Fans will come back when they start winning.

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    Raptors Republic Starter AJ360's Avatar
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    Well considering this season began with Colangelo saying the goal for this year was to be ready to hit the ground running next year... I wouldn't at all say the franchise is in trouble, it's just building itself back up from the Bosh era.

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    There's been grumblings that this franchise is in trouble, not deep. But, attendance has sunken(as to be expected with a rebuild), there is a general feeling of just... while actually that's the thing there is no feeling, let's say the majority of fans/people outside this website there is a general numbness.

    To me and I think some will agree, words to describe the atmosphere around this team are lack of excitement, dullness, mysterious, etc.

    In general the franchise is not healthy, Toronto fans are just so hopeful for a winner that everyone has hopped off the raptors band waggon and hopped on the jays. If baseball season more severely overlapped basketball season this team would probably have seen a severe drop in attendance and be in some serious trouble.

    The only thing this team has right now is hope and that's starting to wear thin with Toronto fans. There hasn't really been a whole lot of excitement around this team this year. I mean they aren't going to make the playoffs, aren't likely to get the first pick.

    Last years top pick isn't even with the team. There isn't really a top face or public figure on the team. I mean Bargnani is their top player. He's been playing well, but, he doesn't speak the best english and he's not really been put on a pedestal like a Stoudamire, Carter, Bosh, or even Turkoglu when he was here.

    This is probably the worst year of hype like the team hasn't been covered nearly as much in the local media... the publicity is way down this year then I think it ever has been before.

    Maybe this is just me, but, I used to consider myself a die hard fan and this year I have found myself with little interest or care of basically everything to do with the team this year.

    There is nothing to latch onto... for this year at least and if this team doesn't do something of more than just slight significance this offseason. The future is not looking bright.

    Personally, I hope they get a star in this draft and Valanciunas has a solid rookie campaign. To restore some faith around this team and at least start uprising.

    Thoughts?
    Attendance is still very strong - better than more than a few playoff teams and playoff contenders.

    Franchise valuation is still very good in the upper third of the league.

    I disagree on the atmosphere of the team. Many, myself included, have not been as optimistic in 4-5 years.

    Baseball does not significantly overlap - so cross that worry off the list. NBA regular season is late ending due to lock out. As an aside, what has happened every year with the Jays of late? Come end of May, nobody gives a shit. What does that tell you? Winning cures all.

    The hope is well founded. The lottery has not been held. The draft has not been done. JV is not here yet (which is not a bad thing, contrary to opinion) and for the first time since Camby the Raptors have a true, young C. They have $12M in cap space to use before July 1st plus a $7.6M TPE. They have 2 second round picks to add to the asset pile. That of course is all forward looking. If you watched the games this year you would have seen the tremendous job Casey has done on the sidelines. They have been competitive in many more games. They have done a 180 in terms of style of play and focus on defense.

    Last year's top pick not with the team is a huge blessing moving forward. They get him one extra year on a rookie deal and he'll be that much more ready to contribute next year. How did that pedestal placement work out for Damon, Vince, Chris, and Hedo?

    All Raptors games are broadcast nationally. The Raptors get press in every major publication in Canada. Is it on par with hockey? No. But Stephen Harper doesn't get as much press as hockey, so there you go.

    I think all the above are your own biased opinions. You have stated previously you have barely watched a game all year. I think you have placed yourself as the centre of the Raptor universe.

    You might not have anything to latch on to but I do. The Raptors made considerable strides this year despite what the record says with essentially the same roster as last year.

    Final thought: I think you need some Zoloft or Prozac. This is probably the most depressing post I've read all year.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Maybe...

    but, jack armstrong was on mccown and both him and mccown leaned more towards my views than yours.

    Both agreed that the fans were sort of in a comatose.

    Listen, I don't disagree with you about next year and Casey is starting to grow on me. Hell, I even don't disagree I'm a depressed bastard.

    I think they are going to turn it around. But, I dont think you are all that right about this season.

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    Maybe...

    but, jack armstrong was on mccown and both him and mccown leaned more towards my views than yours.

    Both agreed that the fans were sort of in a comatose.

    Listen, I don't disagree with you about next year and Casey is starting to grow on me. Hell, I even don't disagree I'm a depressed bastard.

    I think they are going to turn it around. But, I dont think you are all that right about this season.
    You could be right afterall.

    I have a feeling somewhere between your view and mine is the truth (closer to mine though! jk).

    One thing to keep in mind about the fan base this year is Colangelo started the year saying, and I paraphrase, "We are purposely going to blow chunks now for a brighter future sooner."

    Things will certainly be much more clear after the first or second week of July. Who knows, I might be looking for a 'script myself if the Raptors end up selecting 7th and nothing of significance happens on the trade or free agent front.

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    Raptors Republic Starter pesterm1's Avatar
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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    Maybe...

    but, jack armstrong was on mccown and both him and mccown leaned more towards my views than yours.

    Both agreed that the fans were sort of in a comatose.

    Listen, I don't disagree with you about next year and Casey is starting to grow on me. Hell, I even don't disagree I'm a depressed bastard.

    I think they are going to turn it around. But, I dont think you are all that right about this season.
    I tihnk the whole league is in abit of a funk from the lockout. Its hard for fans to go to a game everyday of the week. I own season tix for clippers games with some friends and were even having some troulbe selling tix for the clips .
    (seats are behind visitor bench 15th row)

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    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    I don't think the team is in any trouble what so ever. Most fans are savvy enough now to understand that they've been restructuring since Bosh left town and the losing is nothing new to them during such an occurance. The attendance will come back when the product is better. Still even now with a horrible team they're still drawing decent gate numbers.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    You could be right afterall.

    I have a feeling somewhere between your view and mine is the truth (closer to mine though! jk).

    One thing to keep in mind about the fan base this year is Colangelo started the year saying, and I paraphrase, "We are purposely going to blow chunks now for a brighter future sooner."

    Things will certainly be much more clear after the first or second week of July. Who knows, I might be looking for a 'script myself if the Raptors end up selecting 7th and nothing of significance happens on the trade or free agent front.
    Actually, I don't think you are joking because I'm not going to deny that they are probably closer to yours.

    I'll tell you one thing I would have appreciated this year was a hardcore tanking.

    Just go all out to get at least an excellent chance at a top 3 pick. Then again it might be harder to make a move this offseason.

    I'm not saying it would make me watch the games. I'd just appreciate it.

    Then gain maybe the real reason I haven't found myself watching the games is because it's like "okay, I know they are going to be complete shit. So, why should I support that?"

    "I mean it's not going to be exciting, there isn't going to be any surprises."

    The book had basically already been written before the season began. I can tell you looking back, the lockout didn't help, I found that I lost respect for the league. And by the time the season rolled around I was more interested in Christmas and never really got back into the games.

    It's actually not like I haven't not watched only raptors games and watched other games. I literally have not seen a full quarter of any game all year.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Just thought I would point out the Jays game is on SNO, SNE, SNW, SNP

    and the raptors game has been shoved back onto SN1, which is in the 400's on my cable provider.

    It's not like they're facing the cavs either. This is against division rival and one of the best teams in the league Boston.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Puffer's Avatar
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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    ...It's actually not like I haven't not watched only raptors games and watched other games. I literally have not seen a full quarter of any game all year....

    Here's where I would disagree with you. I would say well over half of these games have been wildly entertaining. My wife hates to watch because of the number of games decided in the last 30 seconds. There have been remarkably few blow outs. The basketball has been more entertaining this year than in the last two for sure.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Well, if that's all you disagree with me on.

    I think we'll get along just fine.

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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    Well, if that's all you disagree with me on.

    I think we'll get along just fine.
    +1

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    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    Raps have the best coach they've ever had. Think about it, they just beat the best team since the all-star fielding 2 ten day contract players and without Bargs or Jose. It was a statement game. The statement was "we're not fucking around anymore."

    Just wait until next year when he's got some actual players.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Jury is still out on that one.

    Speaking of coaches, I still think Jay didn't get a fair shake.

    Alot of people still blame him for what was Colangelo's fault.

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    just confirming to me the fact that most people in hamilton are emotionally unstable

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    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Quote akashsingh wrote: View Post
    just confirming to me the fact that most people in hamilton are emotionally unstable
    I actually don't live in Hamilton, so uh... Pooh to your confirmation.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran NoPropsneeded's Avatar
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    Your kidding me right? Jay Triano is not fit to run an nba team. Dwane Casey has much more experience and he is a much better coach than jt ever was. He was given 3 seasons with the raps and he couldn't accomplish jack shit. Dwane Casey changed the entire fucking culture in a shortened season with no training camp that is insane. JT only wishes he could do something like that

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    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Default *Gasp*

    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    Speaking of coaches, I still think Jay didn't get a fair shake.

    .He should have never been given any shake.

    Last time I use that sound effect today. I swear.

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    How happy you are comes down to expectations.

    No, the talent level isn't there. But it DID outperform a lot of expectations despite some significant injuries. The bad news is that we didn't get to see whether Bargs could keep up his improved play because he got hurt, DeRozan didn't take much of a step forward, and we have no idea yet how Val will do or who this year's pick will be. So the Raps are still not really close to having a franchise player and a real shot at making any real noise. The good news is that Casey has been effective at improving the defense and the team is playing hard despite their record, so I'm happy that we may have finally found a genuinely effective coach. There's every reason to believe that they could fight for a playoff spot in a weak conference if they use their cap space effectively and some of their talent starts panning out. So if you just want to be fighting for the playoffs they're in good shape. If you want to contend for a championship, they're not.

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