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Do u ever watch IND wistfully? Does IND success change Raps prospects for you? (23)

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  • #31
    I think it's the ONLY choice that Toronto has really. With out the ability to attract star players the best we can do is go the route of Indiana and put together a team of good players in the hopes that sum are greater than the parts).

    The problem with this as can be seen in the Dallas example (though Dirk is a star) is that it's hard to keep championsip teams made up of good players together for long periods. When their contracts come up they generally can get more money elsewhere.

    Whereas if you pay the super stars and keep surrounding them with decent parts ala San Antonio, Los Angeles, Boston, they you have a shot at longevity.

    The best think that can happen to Indiana is that they don't win a championship or Hibbert's going to be looking for more money than he's worth. Ditto for David West who is on a one year contract I think.

    I'll be really impressed if OKC can sign Harden & Ibaka and keep that core in tact.

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    • #32
      My point is that teams like Indiana and Toronto have no choice but to go the route of assembling a bunch of good to decent players. The life span of a good team assembled in such a fashion is relatively short so you can expect Indiana to be a bottom dweller in a couple of years and possibly Toronto as well once we reach their level.

      Which is why the OKC blue print of drafting high picks in hopes that one or two are stars is imo the best method for success and longevity for a team that struggles to attract star power.

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      • #33
        Mediumcore wrote: View Post
        My point is that teams like Indiana and Toronto have no choice but to go the route of assembling a bunch of good to decent players. The life span of a good team assembled in such a fashion is relatively short so you can expect Indiana to be a bottom dweller in a couple of years and possibly Toronto as well once we reach their level.

        Which is why the OKC blue print of drafting high picks in hopes that one or two are stars is imo the best method for success and longevity for a team that struggles to attract star power.
        And you just have to hope that the #1 homegrown (via high draft pick) star decides to stay long-term, instead of bolting for greener pastures!

        It seems that Charlotte is following this path, per the news that their GM (Cho, formerly of Portland) asked ownership during his interview whether or not they were willing to take a further step back, in order to take two meaningful steps forward.... the result was a record setting bad year, but top-3 pick (25% chance at #1 pick) as a result. Bad this year and anti-tankers would claim its bad for the sport/league, but definitely in Carlotte's long-term best interest.

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        • #34
          This is the first time the Pacers have been over 500 since 2004-05. I guess they've been slightly better than the atrocious Raptors over that period (maybe) but let's calm down about how great the Pacers are.

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          • #35
            that's how good rising teams work, usually.
            @sweatpantsjer

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            • #36
              ceez wrote: View Post
              that's how good rising teams work, usually.
              Yeah, but what's the point here? Whatever route you go to respectability takes years. The Thunder approach takes years and same with the Pacers. Is the point that this is how Toronto should look to build? I don't see how it's any safer or predictable than the Thunder route, plus, isn't this basically what Colangelo already did from 2006-2010? So, we want him to do it again? I don't get it.

              Good for Indiana. They found lightning in a bottle and played a Howard-less Magic and are up early in a series against a Bosh-less Heat squad. Hands up whoever thinks this team is a long-term contender in the East?

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              • #37
                slaw wrote: View Post
                Yeah, but what's the point here? Whatever route you go to respectability takes years. The Thunder approach takes years and same with the Pacers. Is the point that this is how Toronto should look to build? I don't see how it's any safer or predictable than the Thunder route, plus, isn't this basically what Colangelo already did from 2006-2010? So, we want him to do it again? I don't get it.

                Good for Indiana. They found lightning in a bottle and played a Howard-less Magic and are up early in a series against a Bosh-less Heat squad. Hands up whoever thinks this team is a long-term contender in the East?
                I don't think anybody said Indy was the perfect team, but rather they are building the same way the champion pistons were built in the early 2000s, as a solid team without that single superstar type player. The Raptors tried marketing Bosh as a superstar to build around and look where that took us? The difference between BC during the Bosh years and the current BC, is that the current BC is truly building a good team, adding the best pieces he can. Obviously drafting/signing/trading for a superstar would help, but he's not going to market a false-supestar (ie: you don't hear him referring to Bargnani or DeRozan or even Valanciunas the way he used to talk about Bosh) and not going to try for a quick all-or-nothing fix. He is building a solid team, constrantly improving and adding assets, either to develop or use in trade. I like the building process.

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                • #38
                  Yeah I wouldn't say this is what BC did in the last 4 years, more like two.

                  Indiana is in a really good spot financially too. Barbosa is coming off the books next year and Granger is totally expendable because of George. And West's deal is only two years. They'll be good for a while.
                  Last edited by Employee; Fri May 18, 2012, 05:13 PM. Reason: typio
                  Eh follow my TWITTER!

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                  • #39
                    Matt52 wrote: View Post
                    That raises an interesting thought (at least to me):

                    Many, myself included, have talked about the dreaded purgatory of not good enough to draft a superstar but not bad enough to make the playoffs or, if they do, go deep. In a nutshell that was the Pacers for years. Looking at their roster we see (age in parenthesis):

                    Granger (29) picked 17
                    Barbosa (29) picked 28
                    Collison (24) picked 21
                    Hibbert (25) picked 17
                    Hill (26) picked 26
                    George (22) picked 10
                    Hansbrough (26) picked 13
                    West (31) picked 18th (by NOH) and signed as a free agent this year.



                    Does this change anyone's feelings about the current situation with Toronto? I know there was a lot animosity recently about the Raptors dropping to the 8th overall pick versus the top 5 that so many, myself included, thought was a given.
                    Just before reading this I posted in the "What do you think of BC's drafting" thread a list of guys coming out of the second round who had notable (or all-star appearance) careers. Ginobli is a great example.

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                    • #40
                      I strongly dislike teams that stunk right along with the raptors, and are now having mediocre success. Why should they be good while we still suck?LOL. So that would include those damn pacers (along with the bulls,knicks,etc..) I hope miami wins.

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                      • #41
                        I'm just cheering for Miami because everyone is totally ragging on them.

                        Am I jealous about what's going on in Indy? No, not really. Good on them for getting as far as they have this season, and they're in very good shape financially at the moment, as it'll be interesting to see how far they go over the cap when they have to sign guys like Hibbert, Collison, George, Hill to long term contracts.

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                        • #42
                          i think they're going to move Collison this offseason and Granger this or next. George is good but he's not really there yet.
                          @sweatpantsjer

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                          • #43
                            also i can't believe we're living in a world where people cheer for the Heat that don't live in Miami
                            @sweatpantsjer

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                            • #44
                              I'm cheering for Indy. Mostly because I don't think bosh gets enough credit in Miami (The Heat should have run the offense through him more in the 4th quaters of the Finals last year IMO) and I think a second round exit will really leave them confused about what to do with their roster. Plus without bosh during the loses the "trade bosh camp" is probably a little quieter, making the questions about what to do about the roster that much more fun.
                              "They're going to have to rename the whole conference after us: Toronto Raptors 2014-2015 Northern Conference Champions" ~ ezzbee Dec. 2014

                              "I guess I got a little carried away there" ~ ezzbee Apr. 2015

                              "We only have one rule on this team. What is that rule? E.L.E. That's right's, E.L.E, and what does E.L.E. stand for? EVERYBODY LOVE EVERYBODY. Right there up on the wall, because this isn't just a basketball team, this is a lifestyle. ~ Jackie Moon

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                              • #45
                                "Fuck Lebron Up"

                                White Mamba reminiscing, this song overshadows Black Mambas shitty song with Tyra, in NBA history.


                                NBADoppelgangers.tumblr.com

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