OFFICIAL: Landry Fields is a Toronto Raptor

[ceez]

He is playing with Houston's summer league team.

shit, i didn't see that

[Matt52]

I don't think you understand how win shares are calculated.

I don't see how the stats support your claim. The average PER always hovers around 15. His oppPER indicates that he'll be an average or marginally above average defender at best.
+/- is one of the most useless stats in basketball. It's more dependent on the quality of a player's teammates than any other stat.

Case in point: Josh Harrellson has a 8.5 +/-

Key phrase was 'sufficient minutes played'.

Harrellson doesn't quite meet the parameters of that phrase.

[Matt52]

I am thinking we didn't because we had to go the $6.67 route. Thusly used our cap space ??

I'm pretty sure this falls under the Gilbert Arenas provision.

It is same principle as what Houston is using to try and get Asik.

[sleepz]

All contract gripes aside, I'm not sure where this Fields-is-a-bad-defender stuff is coming from. I'm not going to throw out any stats, just a few observations to quell some of the vitriol.

1) Fields is a 3. He's got SF size, lacks SG speed, and rebounds like a forward. Everything about his game indicates that he should be played at the 3, not the 2. As a result, making him play the 2 (see: C. Anthony) is going to make it tougher for him on defense.

2) I watched a decent amount of knicks games. Fields was consistently asked to guard the best wing on the floor (whether that was to keep Anthony out of foul trouble, or just because Fields was the better defender, who knows). Again, that is going to (especially statistically) influence his perceived defensive abilities.

3) Nothing fancy here: he passes the eyeball test. Watch some footage -- the guy is a solid defender. Moves his feet, closes out well, rotates well, uses his weight effectively, boxes out well etc.

At no time did I indicate that Fields was a poor defender. I simply responded to the notion that he is a lock-down defender which is not true and a huge exaggeration.

[heinz57]

---

Will everybody slow the ^&*%$^& down. I can't keep up

for real... everytime i click on the next page, another page is added to the total pages

[DoNDaDDa]

I think even if you could do that, you'd never work as a GM again. Good luck talking to any agents.

for sure.... might aswell have MJ's rep as GM if u go pullin that

[Matt52]

Lol, my message had nothing to do with the Raps other options at SF. My comment had only to do with paying $20 million dollars to Landry Fields. I suggested nothing about other options for the Raptors so the whole `fold and head to Seattle stuff is you and your over-dramatization.`

It will be interesting to see how much of a lock-down defender Fields is next year.

No, I realize that.

My point is your comments are usually quite negative with the past, present, and future of the Raptors.

If I am mistaking you with another poster, then I sincerely apologize.

[jbml]

All contract gripes aside, I'm not sure where this Fields-is-a-bad-defender stuff is coming from. I'm not going to throw out any stats, just a few observations to quell some of the vitriol.

1) Fields is a 3. He's got SF size, lacks SG speed, and rebounds like a forward. Everything about his game indicates that he should be played at the 3, not the 2. As a result, making him play the 2 (see: C. Anthony) is going to make it tougher for him on defense.

2) I watched a decent amount of knicks games. Fields was consistently asked to guard the best wing on the floor (whether that was to keep Anthony out of foul trouble, or just because Fields was the better defender, who knows). Again, that is going to (especially statistically) influence his perceived defensive abilities.

3) Nothing fancy here: he passes the eyeball test. Watch some footage -- the guy is a solid defender. Moves his feet, closes out well, rotates well, uses his weight effectively, boxes out well etc.

+1

[Letter N]

Batum looks like he's getting overpaid (or maybe properly paid, since everyone is getting overpaid again). I don't really understand the Batum hype either but from what I've read he's off the charts on those metrics calculations the smart teams (Spurs, Rockets) use to find diamonds in the rough.

[Matt52]

I am not a GM and either is Chad Ford but have you heard any reports at all of any team offering Fields a contract let alone a 3 year $20 million dollar deal?

As for the comment of him being not as good as Batum that is my humble opinion. Perhaps you disagree but as our friend Nash has indicated, money is respect in the NBA and there has been more respect offered to Batum apparently than there has been for Fields.

How do you know what goes on? How do you know what Fields value is?

Obviously we have a difference of opinion but I do not think every credible rumour hits the Twitter feed especially when it comes to dollars and cents.

I did not bring up Batum.... did I? A lot of posts going on. I might have but don't remember. I certainly don't see it in the post you quoted.

[geo]

call me crazy but i would much rather have fileds at 6.67 mil for 3 years than batum for 4 years 10-12 mil. you are roughly saying batum is worth twice the player fields is which i completely disagree. nash + fields + ross + jonas is a pretty good off season, i am down for making another move only if it doesnt include derozan i think he is going to have a great year with nash

[sleepz]

I wouldn't call this offer sheet a typical attempt to sign an RFA. This has more to do with eliminating the NYK from Nash contention than it does with Fields.

Without this offer, NYK could include Fields in a S&T for Nash, while offering Nash up to $8M per season. Now Fields can't be included in any trade and the most NYK can offer Nash is $3M (or S&T for scrap players).

Batum was my 2nd choice after Gay for the Raptors to pursue, in the $8-10M per season range. Once the price went up to $14M, I think that's too much. I'd gladly offer $8-10M for potential, but if I'm paying $14M, I want the player to be a proven star! Batum has not yet proven to be worthy of that kind of money.

That is my problem with it. Signing Fields is not an issue with me. Signing him to prevent the Knicks from using him in a sign and trade for Nash is anoter issue entirely. I think it is contingent on one player signing with the team and that its not necessarily a sound basketball move from a GM that has no plan.

And paying Batum 12-14 million a year is indeed an overpayment as well but if I am going to overpay I would prefer it to be done with the notion that you project a player to be a star or close to it. Not for a role player.

[sleepz]

No, I realize that.

My point is your comments are usually quite negative with the past, present, and future of the Raptors.

If I am mistaking you with another poster, then I sincerely apologize.

Lol, I comment on what I see.

I would have been fine with JJ coming back as starting 3 next year, hoping that he improved his wonky jumper. I was even fine with a DD and Ross interchanging at the 3.

Maybe even drafting your boy Q.Miller (yes I remember) in the 2nd round and seeing if he can grow into the role.

I did not expect to see the Raps salary cap be consumed by Nash and Fields. I can not do anything regarding Nash as it appears the decision has been made by management. Nash is a baller so it might turn out great, might not, but I think the Fields signing is over the top.

[geo]

That is my problem with it. Signing Fields is not an issue with me. Signing him to prevent the Knicks from using him in a sign and trade for Nash is anoter issue entirely. I think it is contingent on one player signing with the team and that its not necessarily a sound basketball move from a GM that has no plan.

And paying Batum 12-14 million a year is indeed an overpayment as well but if I am going to overpay I would prefer it to be done with the notion that you project a player to be a star or close to it. Not for a role player.

disagree 100%....as a gm i think your job is to improve the team...if that means signing a player that can potentially allow you to sign hall of fame player you do it. I don't think signing a unproven player 14 mil on potential is sane. I honestly believe that if BC offered batum a 14 mil contract people would bash him for it. I think playing 6.67 mil for basically 2 years since the last year he is an expiring asset is alot safer and could be the better move with nash pending

[jbml]

I'm pretty sure this falls under the Gilbert Arenas provision.

It is same principle as what Houston is using to try and get Asik.

This loophole was addressed starting with the 2005 CBA (although not closed completely -- see below). Teams are now limited in the salary they can offer in an offer sheet to a restricted free agent with one or two years in the league. The first-year salary in the offer sheet cannot be greater than the Non-Taxpayer Mid-Level exception (see question number 25). Limiting the first-year salary in this way enables the player's original team to match the offer sheet by using the Early Bird exception (if applicable -- see question number 25), or Non-Taxpayer Mid-Level exception (provided they have it and haven't used it already)1.


If the raise in the third season exceeds the standard raise (4.5% of the salary in the first season of the contract), then an additional restriction exists. In order to determine how large the offer can be, the team doesn't just have to fit the first-year salary under the cap. Instead, they must fit the average salary in the entire contract under the cap. So a team $8 million under the cap is limited to offering a total of $24 million over three years, or $32 million over four years. If the offer sheet does not contain a third-season raise larger than 4.5% of the first-season salary, then they only have to fit the first season salary under the cap.

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q44[/QUOTE]

[heinz57]

whew..... finally got through this thread...

my opinion... it's a DIRTY move by BC.... risky? yup.. but what big massive testicles on that bryan fellow.

it's kinda like a high school kid (NYK) decides one day... "hey, im pretty sexually active and like to experiment... i'm going to an orgy.. that's right down my alley"

he shows up, and the big hairy dude in the ass-less chaps covered from head to toe in a weird mix of KY and Crisco (BC) looks at him and goes "oh, you want to play with the big boys now"... stands up and shows him his prince albert and the tribal band tattoo on his shaft

[Matt52]

Lol, I comment on what I see.

I would have been fine with JJ coming back as starting 3 next year, hoping that he improved his wonky jumper. I was even fine with a DD and Ross interchanging at the 3.

Maybe even drafting your boy Q.Miller (yes I remember) in the 2nd round and seeing if he can grow into the role.

I did not expect to see the Raps salary cap be consumed by Nash and Fields. I can not do anything regarding Nash as it appears the decision has been made by management. Nash is a baller so it might turn out great, might not, but I think the Fields signing is over the top.

If you comment on what you see, I'm not sure where Batum came from.

Yes, I was very high on Miller last year (remember too). Unfortunately he never did regain the promise pre-ACL injury. Throughout the year I was also high on MKG, Barnes, Lamb, Ross, Beal. So there you go.

[Dr. James Naismith]

whew..... finally got through this thread...

my opinion... it's a DIRTY move by BC.... risky? yup.. but what big massive testicles on that bryan fellow.

it's kinda like a high school kid (NYK) decides one day... "hey, im pretty sexually active and like to experiment... i'm going to an orgy.. that's right down my alley"

he shows up, and the big hairy dude in the ass-less chaps covered from head to toe in a weird mix of KY and Crisco (BC) looks at him and goes "oh, you want to play with the big boys now"... stands up and shows him his prince albert and the tribal band tattoo on his shaft

ROTFLMAO ... thanks, you just made my day heinz.

[Michel G]

And paying Batum 12-14 million a year is indeed an overpayment as well but if I am going to overpay I would prefer it to be done with the notion that you project a player to be a star or close to it. Not for a role player.

Unfortunately, Batum is a role player. Whoever signs him for that money, better hope he lives up to it. A guy under-performing making 6.7 million is a lot easier to deal with than somebody making twice as much, especially with the new CBA.

[Prime]

Key phrase was 'sufficient minutes played'.

Harrellson doesn't quite meet the parameters of that phrase.

Okay, how about Steve Novak's 8.3?

I can give you another shit ton of examples if you want.