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Thread: How does Colangelo make the Lowry trade work with all the other ASSETS?

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Default How does Colangelo make the Lowry trade work with all the other ASSETS?

    **If anything here is wrong, correct me please**


    Remember the magic number for the Fields offer is $51.744M. The committed salaries + cap holds is what makes up the magic number.

    Raptors payroll from ShamSports:

    $50.273M for 10 players with a roster looking like this:

    PG: Lowry, Calderon
    SG: DD, Ross
    SF: JJ, LK
    PF: Bargnani, Amir, Davis
    C: JV

    Cap holds from ShamSports.com that in my opinion matters:

    Bayless - $7.605 (250% last year's salary) and $9.126 according to HoopsWorld.com
    Gray - $3M (120% of last year's salary)

    *Alabi, Uzoh, Andersen, Magloire can all be signed for minimum contracts after renouncing their cap hold. In my opinion they are not worth anything more.

    Exceptions:
    MLE - $5M
    Barbosa TPE - $7.6M



    Again, the magic number in all of this is $51.744M. The Raptors cannot have more than $51.744M in committed salary and cap holds before making the offer to Fields. In terms of committed salary alone, according to ShamSports.com, the Raptors are good with $50.273M.


    So how do the Raptors make it all work?

    One way:
    Renounce Barbosa TPE, MLE, Bayless, and Gray.
    **This is the 'drop everyone and everything not on a contract' method**

    A second way:
    Amnesty Jose, renounce Barbosa TPE & MLE, resign Bayless and Gray to contracts for less than $12.033M (however if they make $12M between them, I am pissed!).

    A third way:
    Amnesty Jose, renounce Barbosa TPE & MLE, keep rights to Bayless and Gray, use the $12.033M in cap space to facilitate trades.

    A fourth way:
    Trade Jose with assets coming back, renounce exceptions, and resign Bayless/Gray/whoever came in Jose trade to total salaries not exceeding $12.033M.

    A fifth way:
    Trade or amnesty of other players. I have made the assumption only player under contract likely to be sent packing is Calderon.

    The 'themasao Way':
    Sign Fields before trading for Lowry leaving Toronto with $5.7M in options for cap holds in their own free agents or exceptions (MLE only). Would not involve trading or amnestying Jose.

    The 'themasao Way' plus an amesnty or trade:
    Sign Fields before trading for Lowry and amnestying or trading players as well. $5.7M + whatever salary sent out in trade/amnesty available to keep exceptions and own free agents.


    Are there any other ways you see that I am missing?




    Three final things to remember:

    1) The only thing that seems constant is the Barbosa TPE and the MLE are going to have to be renounced.
    2) After signing Fields, the Raptors are going to have the $2.5M room exception to add a player.
    3) After signing Fields, the Raptors will be limited to minimum contracts along with #2.
    Last edited by mcHAPPY; Thu Jul 5th, 2012 at 06:03 PM. Reason: Fifth way added & a third final thing to remember & thank you themasao

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Red and White's Avatar
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    So if we do it the first way (I am not keen on losing Jose), what flexibility do we have (if any) in getting a back up C? We would have like 2 mil to work with right?I always get confused with the Cap stuff in a situation like this.

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote Red and White wrote: View Post
    So if we do it the first way (I am not keen on losing Jose), what flexibility do we have (if any) in getting a back up C? We would have like 2 mil to work with right?I always get confused with the Cap stuff in a situation like this.
    The $2.5M room exception or a minimum contract.

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    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    Nice job Matt.

    Could Fields be acquired via S&T with the NYK, whereby Toronto uses the TPE and throws NYK a 2nd round pick? Would that allow Toronto to maintain cap holds on Bayless and Gray, as well as the exceptions? Or would Toronto need to get up to the salary cap level via trade(s) first, in order to be able to use the TPE?

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    Does ACY not fit in your equation or did you forget about him?

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    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    Quote Stahmenah_Vybz wrote: View Post
    Does ACY not fit in your equation or did you forget about him?
    I don't believe 2nd round picks have any cap-hold, since they are basically paid minimum salary.

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    Quote CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
    Nice job Matt.

    Could Fields be acquired via S&T with the NYK, whereby Toronto uses the TPE and throws NYK a 2nd round pick? Would that allow Toronto to maintain cap holds on Bayless and Gray, as well as the exceptions? Or would Toronto need to get up to the salary cap level via trade(s) first, in order to be able to use the TPE?
    I doubt N.Y would want to do anything to help T.O out at this point after messing up their plans lol. Loved it.

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    Quote CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
    I don't believe 2nd round picks have any cap-hold, since they are basically paid minimum salary.
    Thank you very much. I Forgot about that. My Bad.

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    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    Quote Stahmenah_Vybz wrote: View Post
    I doubt N.Y would want to do anything to help T.O out at this point after messing up their plans lol. Loved it.
    Had we landed Nash I would have agreed completely. However, since Nash spurned both teams, I can't see NYK being nearly as pissed at us. At least that way they'd get something in return. Maybe even JJ & 2013 2nd round pick for Fields, allowing us to acquire him with the TPE while simultaneously clearing up the wing logjam and shedding $2.81M in salary (JJ).

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    Raptors Republic Starter themasao's Avatar
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    without actually looking at any details, my guess would be that BC either trades Jose or sign and trades Bayless to a team like Indiana that needs PG help and that can absorb some salary. We obviously aren't keeping both of them with Lowry here, and better to get something back than use the amnesty (which will probably have to be used if no one bites on the trade proposal).

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote Stahmenah_Vybz wrote: View Post
    Does ACY not fit in your equation or did you forget about him?
    Minimum contract ($473k) or BC could give him some of the $1.471M in cap space they have below $51.744M.

    He gave Alabi a larger contract than he had to.

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote Stahmenah_Vybz wrote: View Post
    I doubt N.Y would want to do anything to help T.O out at this point after messing up their plans lol. Loved it.
    +1

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    Raptors Republic Starter themasao's Avatar
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    Or what if we wait till the 11th to consummate the Lowry deal and sign Fields first and then absorb Lowry into the TPE. Would that even work?

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote themasao wrote: View Post
    Or what if we wait till the 11th to consummate the Lowry deal and sign Fields first and then absorb Lowry into the TPE. Would that even work?
    All transactions have to wait until the 11th to be consummated.

    To your question, yes it could work.

    The Raps would have $46.0M in committed contracts (have to include Forbes).

    Signing Fields takes them to $52.323M.

    They would have to renounce everything except $5.7M* in free agent rights or exceptions barring losing other salary.

    *I don't think the numbers are exact but it gives you an indication.

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    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    All transactions have to wait until the 11th to be consummated.

    To your question, yes it could work.

    The Raps would have $46.0M in committed contracts (have to include Forbes).

    Signing Fields takes them to $52.323M.

    They would have to renounce everything except $5.7M* in free agent rights or exceptions barring losing other salary.

    *I don't think the numbers are exact but it gives you an indication.
    So theoretically, the Raptors could do the following transactions in this order, after July 11th:
    1. S&T Bayless for a 2nd round pick (to get somethig instead of just renouncing)
    2. Sign Fields
    3. Complete Lowry trade
    4. Re-sign Gray

    PG: Lowry, Calderon
    SG: DeRozan, Ross
    SF: Fields, Kleiza, JJ
    PF: Bargnani, Davis, Amir
    C: Valanciunas, Gray

    They are also free to sign Acy (and Uzoh and/or Magloire) to a minimum contract


    --> in that scenario, would they still have the TPE, MLE, Room Exception at that point, or would they have lost the TPE/MLE?

    --> this is all assuming no other trades go down prior to July 11th (ie: PF/SF logjams)
    Last edited by CalgaryRapsFan; Thu Jul 5th, 2012 at 06:08 PM.

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
    So theoretically, the Raptors could do the following transactions in this order, after July 11th:
    1. S&T Bayless for a 2nd round pick
    2. Sign Fields
    3. Complete Lowry trade
    4. Re-sign Gray

    PG: Lowry, Calderon
    SG: DeRozan, Ross
    SF: Fields, Kleiza, JJ
    PF: Bargnani, Davis, Amir
    C: Valanciunas, Gray

    They are also free to sign Acy (and Uzoh and/or Magloire) to a minimum contract


    --> in that scenario, would they still have the TPE, MLE, Room Exception at that point, or would they have lost the TPE/MLE?

    At first I said no but I think now Yes!

    I can't think right now. I'm sure you'll figure it out. Gotta run for a bit.
    Last edited by mcHAPPY; Thu Jul 5th, 2012 at 06:10 PM.

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    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    The TPE and MLE are gone.

    Room exception and minimum contracts remain.
    That's what I figured.

    So the only way the Raps get everything, is if the Fields signing becomes a S&T deal, right?

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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    **If anything here is wrong, correct me please**


    Remember the magic number for the Fields offer is $51.744M. The committed salaries + cap holds is what makes up the magic number.

    Raptors payroll from ShamSports:

    $50.273M for 10 players with a roster looking like this:

    PG: Lowry, Calderon
    SG: DD, Ross
    SF: JJ, LK
    PF: Bargnani, Amir, Davis
    C: JV

    Cap holds from ShamSports.com that in my opinion matters:

    Bayless - $7.605 (250% last year's salary) and $9.126 according to HoopsWorld.com
    Gray - $3M (120% of last year's salary)

    *Alabi, Uzoh, Andersen, Magloire can all be signed for minimum contracts after renouncing their cap hold. In my opinion they are not worth anything more.

    Exceptions:
    MLE - $5M
    Barbosa TPE - $7.6M



    Again, the magic number in all of this is $51.744M. The Raptors cannot have more than $51.744M in committed salary and cap holds before making the offer to Fields. In terms of committed salary alone, according to ShamSports.com, the Raptors are good with $50.273M.


    So how do the Raptors make it all work?

    One way:
    Renounce Barbosa TPE, MLE, Bayless, and Gray.
    **This is the 'drop everyone and everything not on a contract' method**

    A second way:
    Amnesty Jose, renounce Barbosa TPE & MLE, resign Bayless and Gray to contracts for less than $12.033M (however if they make $12M between them, I am pissed!).

    A third way:
    Amnesty Jose, renounce Barbosa TPE & MLE, keep rights to Bayless and Gray, use the $12.033M in cap space to facilitate trades.

    A fourth way:
    Trade Jose with assets coming back, renounce exceptions, and resign Bayless/Gray/whoever came in Jose trade to total salaries not exceeding $12.033M.

    A fifth way:
    Trade or amnesty of other players. I have made the assumption only player under contract likely to be sent packing is Calderon.

    The 'themasao Way':
    Sign Fields before trading for Lowry leaving Toronto with $5.7M in options for cap holds in their own free agents or exceptions (MLE only). Would not involve trading or amnestying Jose.

    The 'themasao Way' plus an amesnty or trade:
    Sign Fields before trading for Lowry and amnestying or trading players as well. $5.7M + whatever salary sent out in trade/amnesty available to keep exceptions and own free agents.


    Are there any other ways you see that I am missing?




    Three final things to remember:

    1) The only thing that seems constant is the Barbosa TPE and the MLE are going to have to be renounced.
    2) After signing Fields, the Raptors are going to have the $2.5M room exception to add a player.
    3) After signing Fields, the Raptors will be limited to minimum contracts along with #2.
    lol Matt, you are the most amazing/dedicated person on this forum. I appreciate this so much

  19. #19
    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    At first I said no but I think now Yes!

    I can't think right now. I'm sure you'll figure it out. Gotta run for a bit.
    Haha no worries, I am unsure as well. I'm not sure if any signing under the cap will cause a team to lose their MLE/TPE or not, since it would technically be the trade bringing them up to the cap level.

    Even if they did lose both, the Raps would have a solid roster and lots of assets/flexibility to further change/improve their lineup.

  20. #20
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
    Haha no worries, I am unsure as well. I'm not sure if any signing under the cap will cause a team to lose their MLE/TPE or not, since it would technically be the trade bringing them up to the cap level.

    Even if they did lose both, the Raps would have a solid roster and lots of assets/flexibility to further change/improve their lineup.
    I was wrong the first time and the second time.

    1. Renounce S&T Bayless - whatever, point is he is gone.
    2. Sign Fields taking payroll to $52.3M. Raps could keep MLE but have to renounce TPE and Gray.
    3. Trade for Lowry.
    4. Sign Gray for or in MLE (MLE can be divided numerous ways among players), room exception, or minimum contract.


    After acquiring Fields and Lowry, Raps would have about $1.45M to sign a rookie like Acy or an undrafted player like, say, Scott Machado.

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