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Thread: Raptors in discussion with 76ers for Igoudala (Thorn denies rumor (#163)

  1. #261
    Raptors Republic Rookie pillowmint's Avatar
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    Quote ebrian wrote: View Post
    Why stop there? Let's throw in Linas Kleiza and target Kevin Durant!
    +2

    Ahahahaha. Amen.
    i8theball.com it's a website...about, you know....basketball.

  2. #262
    Raptors Republic All-Star DoNDaDDa's Avatar
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    Quote DaveKim wrote: View Post
    I would have to think Derrick Williams is more attractive than Ed and Demar/Ross.
    Also, as noted above, i think that us being a division rival will play in their minds.
    why would derrick will. be more attractive?? because he was picked second?? with that logic.. beasley must be more attractive too then?? all Derrick Will.'s rookie season did was prove alot of doubters right, hes going to struggle to find a place in the NBA because he's a tweener.. why do u think T'Wolves are soo quick to movee him... he was overhyped

  3. #263
    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Quote CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
    Now BC needs to turn the Fields signing into something similar... 2013 2nd round pick & rights to Zubcic & $3.15M TPE to NYK for Fields (3yrs @ $6.3M per)... make it happen BC! NYK only get a TPE worth 50% of Fields' contract, due to it being a S&T, rather than a trade for a player under an existing contract.
    speaking of which. any further news on fields?
    If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?

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  4. #264
    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    speaking of which. any further news on fields?
    Not that I've heard. Though I suppose if they just went ahead and gave him an offer today, NYK have 3 days to match, so it could be a few days before we hear anything official.

  5. #265
    Raptors Republic Icon mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    JerryZgoda profile

    JerryZgoda Why there might never be Batum offer sheet if no S-T: Don't burn Martell, Miller, Darko moves in case you need them for move like Iggy



    Zgoda is a Doug Smith/Ryan Wolstat equivalent.

  6. #266
    Raptors Republic Starter bloodyhandedgod's Avatar
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    patience. damn.

    i saw a lot of good out of this group last year. hope for bargs to be a more complete player. (never thought i would type that) and for DD and Ed they deserve another year. with the additions of ross, lowry and jv we might be competitive and fun to watch. don't throw all of this out to try and fix it now. our future is youth and we are getting close. i doubt this will happen and i'm glad for that.

    ai is a great player, but do not mortgage the future for him. just keep it going.
    I have no idea who Chukwudiebere Maduabum is, but on his Draft Express profile, hes listed as Chu Chu. I think hes worthy of picking just for that. He immediately is in the running for best All-Time NBA name. -Tim W.

  7. #267
    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    Quote bloodyhandedgod wrote: View Post
    patience. damn.

    i saw a lot of good out of this group last year. hope for bargs to be a more complete player. (never thought i would type that) and for DD and Ed they deserve another year. with the additions of ross, lowry and jv we might be competitive and fun to watch. don't throw all of this out to try and fix it now. our future is youth and we are getting close. i doubt this will happen and i'm glad for that.

    ai is a great player, but do not mortgage the future for him. just keep it going.
    If a deal could be made around Calderon, Davis and JJ for Iguodala, I don't think there would be any "future mortgaging" going on at all (age during next season in brackets):

    - either Amir (25) or Davis (23) will be the 3rd string PF, being pushed by Acy (22).

    - JJ (25/26) is 5th on the wing depth chart, behind DeRozan (23), Fields (24), Ross (21/22) and Kleiza (27/28), with barely enough mintues for 4 players to get sufficient playing time / opportunity to develop, let alone 5.

    - Calderon (31) will be a backup PG on a $10.6M expiring contract next season.


    --> if these 3 players could be turned into Iguodala (28/29), I don't think the Raptors will even notice they're gone and they will still have a very talented young core of players in place for the long-term. Iggy will only turn 29 next season, so he should still have another 2-3 good years in him beyond the upcoming season.

    --> trading Calderon & Davis & JJ would actually SAVE the Raptors about $0.9M next season, so it's not as though Iggy's contract would be an albatross.

    --> Calderon would be the most missed, since a new backup PG would need to be acquired. Ironically, he's the most expendable though, given his age and contract status.


    LINEUP AFTER IGGY TRADE
    C: Valanciunas (20), Gray (27/28)
    PF: Bargnani (27), Amir (25), Acy (22)
    SF: Iggy (28/29), Kleiza (27/28)
    SG: DeRozan (23), Fields (24), Ross (21/22)
    PG: Lowry (26/27), ???

    That is a good, young lineup that clearly has the long-term future in mind. That is not a roster that is mortgaging its future (even if DeRozan happened to be involved in a trade for Iggy; though I'd prefer to get it done without giving up DeRozan).
    Last edited by CalgaryRapsFan; Wed Jul 11th, 2012 at 01:43 PM.

  8. #268
    Raptors Republic Starter bloodyhandedgod's Avatar
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    Quote CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
    If a deal could be made around Calderon, Davis and JJ for Iguodala, I don't think there would be any "future mortgaging" going on at all (age during next season in brackets):

    - either Amir (25) or Davis (23) will be the 3rd string PF, being pushed by Acy (22).

    - JJ (25/26) is 5th on the wing depth chart, behind DeRozan (23), Fields (24), Ross (21/22) and Kleiza (27/28), with barely enough mintues for 4 players to get sufficient playing time / opportunity to develop, let alone 5.

    - Calderon (31) will be a backup PG on a $10.6M expiring contract next season.


    --> if these 3 players could be turned into Iguodala (28/29), I don't think the Raptors will even notice they're gone and they will still have a very talented young core of players in place for the long-term. Iggy will only turn 29 next season, so he should still have another 2-3 good years in him beyond the upcoming season.

    --> trading Calderon & Davis & JJ would actually SAVE the Raptors about $0.9M next season, so it's not as though Iggy's contract would be an albatross.

    --> Calderon would be the most missed, since a new backup PG would need to be acquired. Ironically, he's the most expendable though, given his age and contract status.


    LINEUP AFTER IGGY TRADE
    C: Valanciunas (20), Gray (27/28)
    PF: Bargnani (27), Amir (25), Acy (22)
    SF: Iggy (28/29), Kleiza (27/28)
    SG: DeRozan (23), Fields (24), Ross (21/22)
    PG: Lowry (26/27), ???

    That is a good, young lineup that clearly has the long-term future in mind. That is not a roster that is mortgaging its future (even if DeRozan happened to be involved in a trade for Iggy; though I'd prefer to get it done without giving up DeRozan).
    just do not want it. still think ed and dd deserve a chance. agreed that we need jc for another year. otherwise we are a pg short. just after all this time do we not want to see what dd and ed can do given a full season? i know i do. it is worth the wait.
    I have no idea who Chukwudiebere Maduabum is, but on his Draft Express profile, hes listed as Chu Chu. I think hes worthy of picking just for that. He immediately is in the running for best All-Time NBA name. -Tim W.

  9. #269
    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    Quote bloodyhandedgod wrote: View Post
    just do not want it. still think ed and dd deserve a chance. agreed that we need jc for another year. otherwise we are a pg short. just after all this time do we not want to see what dd and ed can do given a full season? i know i do. it is worth the wait.
    I'd like to keep Davis and DeRozan. However, if I could turn Davis & JJ & Calderon into Iguodala, I'd do it in a heartbeat without thinking twice. Even if they demanded DeRozan be included, I might still consider it, though that would be a tough call...

    We'd still have Amir at backup PF, plus Acy, so Davis is expendable.

    Same goes for JJ at SF - we'd still have 5 wings even after trading JJ away, so he's definitely expendable. Not only does the trade make our starting wings better (Iggy & DeRozan), but by adding Iggy it pushes Fields to the bench (Fields, Ross and Kleiza), making our 2nd unit even stronger.

    Yes I would hate to see Calderon go, but it's the smart move to make. There are plenty of backup PG available via trade or free agency.

    I could see a 2nd unit of Amir, Kleiza, Fields, Ross and PG-TBD being very strong.

  10. #270
    Raptors Republic Rookie G-locity's Avatar
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    Give it a rest! its not happening! But keep dreaming though, its free!!

  11. #271
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    Quote CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
    Calderon would be the most missed, since a new backup PG would need to be acquired. Ironically, he's the most expendable though, given his age and contract status.
    I disagree.

    Calderon will be at least a good quality backup for the next few years and the Raptors will have an opportunity to tender him a fair-value extension.

    DeRozan, although talented, has yet to establish himself as an average starter-quality player. Unless he improves his game significantly this year, it's unclear whether he is the safer or best bet when comparing him to Ross or to Fields.

    I think the Raptors made a mistake by not interviewing Ed Davis before they drafted him. I don't see the high basketball IQ some see, quite the opposite actually. He's a reactive player who has yet to prove he can play well within a structured system. I like how he improved his ability to find space in the halfcourt offense last year but I also saw a player who was lost on defensive rotations all year. I am hoping his understanding of the defensive schemes will dramatically improve due to the increase of practice time but I would bet against it if it was a 50-50 bet.

    I hope DeRozan and Davis will both prove me wrong.

  12. #272
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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    speaking of which. any further news on fields?
    I believe they put the offer sheet on the table. NY has 3 days to match as Fields is an RFA.

  13. #273
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    didn't realize that someone already beat me to the answer.

    FRom hoopshype, there is some rumblings that NYK might consider matching fields. Highly doubtful given their salary commitments but it should be an interesting next couple of days, with Dwight situation settled, along with 2nd tier guys like E Gordon or Hibbert settled.

  14. #274
    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    another former Raptor on the move, in an expanded Wright-to-Philly deal:

    ESPNSteinLine Marc Stein
    Warriors to get Jarrett Jack & Hornets only have to take back draft rights to Edin Bavcic (originally Philly-bound) to complete the trade
    My guess is NO is clearing cap space to match Gordon.

  15. #275
    Raptors Republic Superstar planetmars's Avatar
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    The Wright trade makes less and less sense to me know.. I thought GSW was looking at a salary dump, but then they took Jarret Jack from NO. Doesn't make much sense to me.

    @ESPNSteinLine:
    Just going online: Philly trade for Dorell Wright is expanding to include Hornets, who have agreed to send Jarrett Jack to Warriors

  16. #276
    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    Quote planetmars wrote: View Post
    The Wright trade makes less and less sense to me know.. I thought GSW was looking at a salary dump, but then they took Jarret Jack from NO. Doesn't make much sense to me.

    @ESPNSteinLine:
    Just going online: Philly trade for Dorell Wright is expanding to include Hornets, who have agreed to send Jarrett Jack to Warriors
    GSW needed a reliable backup PG behind Curry, given how injury prone he's been. My guess is that Jack was better and/or cheaper than any other backup PG option out there, or the available PGs weren't satisfied (yet) signing to be a backup (just like how several PG said "no" to Memphis before they signed Bayless).

  17. #277
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    Should we move this to the trade thread in the "Let's NBA" sub-forum?

  18. #278
    Raptors Republic Superstar planetmars's Avatar
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    oops sorry - didn't see your post.

  19. #279
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    What is all the hype around Iggy about??? We just got a good defensive and rebounder in Fields, so why not give DeRozan and Landry a chance? Personally, I think that Iggy is a bit overrated and don't forget that Philly was just horrible in the second half of the season. I like what we are doing, no need to rush and give away good young promising players for two years as the 7th or 8th seed in the playoffs. I know that it's tough, but please have patience. It'll be worth it.

  20. #280
    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    Quote Walnut wrote: View Post
    What is all the hype around Iggy about??? We just got a good defensive and rebounder in Fields, so why not give DeRozan and Landry a chance? Personally, I think that Iggy is a bit overrated and don't forget that Philly was just horrible in the second half of the season. I like what we are doing, no need to rush and give away good young promising players for two years as the 7th or 8th seed in the playoffs. I know that it's tough, but please have patience. It'll be worth it.
    The problem is that without making any additional roster moves, there simply won't be enough playing time to provide all these young players sufficient opportunity to improve individually, let alone develop team chemistry among the core group (since the core group isn't yet defined).

    PF
    - Bargnani is starting and will likely play around 32 mins at least
    - Amir/Davis/Acy will be fighting for the remainnig 16 mins of playing time, as well as some time at C on the 2nd unit
    --> either Amir or Davis needs to be traded (likely Davis), so that the remaining player will get enough playing time

    WING
    - DeRozan, Ross, Kleiza, JJ and likely Fields will be fighting for playing time
    - there won't be enough time to go around for all 5 players, even if Kleiza spends some time at PF on the 2nd unit
    --> at least one of them needs to be traded (likely JJ), so that the remaining players will get enough playing time


    It's great in theory to stockpile young players and hope that they develop into something special. However, there comes a time when a team needs to decide whether they're going to stick with a bunch of 2nd unit players in the hopes that one of them finally blossoms into a legitimate starter, or whether they're going to package a couple of them to acquire a proven starter.

    Yes, there is a risk of trading away a player and watching him develop into something special for another team. However, there is also a risk that none of them ever develop into anything more than 2nd unit rotation players, at which time they are no longer in demand for their "potential" and their trade value has been greatly diminished. There's no point watching all this young potential waste away being buried on the bench, simply because the team is so deep - but deep in 2nd unit talent, not starting talent.

    Toronto has a roster full of young, talented players who ooze potential, but sometimes these kids need a proven veteran to come in and show them first-hand how to harness all the talent and realize their potential. If Toronto wants to take the next step and become a playoff team, they need to turn some of their dearth of "potential" into at least one established star.
    Last edited by CalgaryRapsFan; Wed Jul 11th, 2012 at 05:09 PM.

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