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Wolstat: JJ not likely to return

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  • #61
    torch19 wrote: View Post
    James Johnson is our best perimeter defender who can also hold his own in the 4 spot. I don't get this speculation. I hope it's not true.

    We're already losing Bayless, not James Johnson too ...
    +1
    "Defense wins championships."

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    • #62
      Matt52 wrote: View Post
      I'm not sure JJ is the best defender. If you are going on steals and blocks, then yes, other metrics, then no.
      adjusted defensive +/- he is best on the team

      has the lowest defense rating on the team

      has the best defensive win share on the team

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      • #63
        SuperRaptor wrote: View Post
        I agree with you 100% joey. Bayless produced at an ELITE level whenever he had a chance to start, he has been referred to defensively by dwayne casey as: "Our best on the ball defender" and he shot 42% from the 3 pt line last year, which was a huge weakness for our team last year. James johnson became the first raptor to EVER lead the team in both steals and blocks, his shooting improved as the season went on and he is a stat stuffer.

        How people can be so happy that these guys will not be returning is beyond me.

        I've said this before and I will say it again, sometimes I think we need to change the name of this website to "HatersRepublic".
        Well ... we probably can't keep everyone if we want to improve and some people have a different opinion about who is any good and who isn't and there have been given valid reasons for it as well; this doesn't have a lot to do with hating.

        Sidenote, last time you refered to 'HatersRepublic' it was because of your own opinion about Bosh winning a championship, not because of other posters hating on players on the team.

        SuperRaptor wrote: View Post
        Do I want Bosh to win the championship? Well I guess we should change the name of this site to "HatersRepublic" because I don't want him to, I dont know why, I just want to see the heat lose this year, trade bosh next year, and win then, so Bosh can never win a championship. Is that mean?

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        • #64
          Craiger wrote: View Post
          adjusted defensive +/- he is best on the team

          has the lowest defense rating on the team

          has the best defensive win share on the team
          I stand corrected.

          I was thinking of oppPER and on/off court rating.

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          • #65
            And there are of course the situational stats from synergysports where James Johnson doesn't do that well.

            Personally I don't hold much value to defensive ratings as a singular stat because defense and offense are not separate zero sum games.

            For instance, Boston did very well on defense as a team, they had the best rating in the league (or 2nd best if you look at DeffEff at hoopdata.com) and (of course) they are a very good defensive team. But one of the reasons they were among the very best was because they didn't go after offensive rebounds, they were deadlast in the league on Offensive Rebound Rate. They wanted to get back on defensive positions. Clearly their offense suffered because of this (regardless of it being a good idea or not).

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            • #66
              Soft Euro wrote: View Post
              And there are of course the situational stats from synergysports where James Johnson doesn't do that well.

              Personally I don't hold much value to defensive ratings as a singular stat because defense and offense are not separate zero sum games.

              For instance, Boston did very well on defense as a team, they had the best rating in the league (or 2nd best if you look at DeffEff at hoopdata.com) and (of course) they are a very good defensive team. But one of the reasons they were among the very best was because they didn't go after offensive rebounds, they were deadlast in the league on Offensive Rebound Rate. They wanted to get back on defensive positions. Clearly their offense suffered because of this (regardless of it being a good idea or not).
              the Raps did the exact same thing aswell. But the entire team did it, so not one person had an edge over another player on the same team.

              Comparing defense rating from team to team may not be the best way to compare, but using it on the same team says alot. Which was what i was referring to.

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              • #67
                This is terrible and sad. I really won't know what to do without my Johnson...and the recent news that Amir might be amnestied... Both my Johnson's will be gone. I went from two to zero in the blink of one eye.

                I for one suggest a protest.

                We must go into the ACC chanting and screaming for our Johnson's back
                For still frame photograph of me reading the DeRozan thread please refer to my avatar

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                • #68
                  Mapko wrote: View Post
                  What would you "expect" for DD?
                  DD & JJ for D Williams? (apparently Minnie is "shopping" Williams).
                  I'd do it. Then Ross can have more time to develop at the 2.
                  NBADoppelgangers.tumblr.com

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                  • #69
                    Craiger wrote: View Post
                    the Raps did the exact same thing aswell. But the entire team did it, so not one person had an edge over another player on the same team.

                    Comparing defense rating from team to team may not be the best way to compare, but using it on the same team says alot. Which was what i was referring to.
                    It isn't a zero sum game on the same team as well. E.g. (random example): all other things equal I would assume a player who shoots a lot of corner threes does worse on defense in transition and will have a worse defensive rating because of this.

                    Btw, I have no research to back this up, it just seems logical to me that different individual offensive skillsets like this have an impact on team defense.

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                    • #70
                      Soft Euro wrote: View Post
                      It isn't a zero sum game on the same team as well. E.g. (random example): all other things equal I would assume a player who shoots a lot of corner threes does worse on defense in transition and will have a worse defensive rating because of this.

                      Btw, I have no research to back this up, it just seems logical to me that different individual offensive skillsets like this have an impact on team defense.
                      well if we assumed that, it would be logical to conclude that the person at the top of the key would therefore have the best defensive rating. However, Jose had the worst on the team.

                      Defense rating is how many points per 100 possessions a team allowed with said player was on the floor. It really doesn't matter where he was in transition, or on offense. But how many points the team gave up with him playing.

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                      • #71
                        Lol, that wasn't the first time I had made a reference to hatersrepublic, but its nice to see someone was paying attention lol.
                        "Defense wins championships."

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                        • #72
                          Craiger wrote: View Post
                          well if we assumed that, it would be logical to conclude that the person at the top of the key would therefore have the best defensive rating. However, Jose had the worst on the team.
                          Well, that's why I said "all other things equal". That's different from just taking the person who might be at the top of the key the most.

                          Defense rating is how many points per 100 possessions a team allowed with said player was on the floor. It really doesn't matter where he was in transition, or on offense. But how many points the team gave up with him playing.
                          I get that, but teams don't play the exact same way regardless of who is on the floor; the way they attack and defend changes according to their combined skillsets even if it may not differ as much with a few different players on the floor as it differs between teams.

                          The only thing about defensive or offensive rating that would make sense to me is using them in combination and look at the difference between on/off. And even then there are a lot of issues with it. For instance: there is a difference between playing against the first or second unit of the opposing team (and with whom you play the most on your own team). There is a lot of noise in this kind of data which makes it hard to draw farreaching conclusions (for me).

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                          • #73
                            Craiger wrote: View Post
                            well if we assumed that, it would be logical to conclude that the person at the top of the key would therefore have the best defensive rating. However, Jose had the worst on the team.

                            Defense rating is how many points per 100 possessions a team allowed with said player was on the floor. It really doesn't matter where he was in transition, or on offense. But how many points the team gave up with him playing.
                            While Soft Euro and I rarely disagree, this will be one of those times; I'm with you on this Craiger.

                            I think James Johnson has shown to be, in my opinion, one of the premier wing defenders in the League.
                            Contrary to what has been stated in here, I do not recall him being a huge gambler on defense, nor do I recall him straying from him man, into the key, just to block a shot. And the more experience he gains, the better he will be at being able to read plays, and be even more efficient with his defense. He's still young.

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                            • #74
                              He is still developing. Granted it has taken longer that most would of liked but he is getting better!

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                              • #75
                                Soft Euro wrote: View Post
                                Well, that's why I said "all other things equal". That's different from just taking the person who might be at the top of the key the most.



                                I get that, but teams don't play the exact same way regardless of who is on the floor; the way they attack and defend changes according to their combined skillsets even if it may not differ as much with a few different players on the floor as it differs between teams.

                                The only thing about defensive or offensive rating that would make sense to me is using them in combination and look at the difference between on/off. And even then there are a lot of issues with it. For instance: there is a difference between playing against the first or second unit of the opposing team (and with whom you play the most on your own team). There is a lot of noise in this kind of data which makes it hard to draw farreaching conclusions (for me).
                                well if thats the case than no stat, no watching or no interpretation can accurately judge how good or bad a player is. But I don't think thats the case at all.

                                As for 'noise', well thats an argument that can be made for anything. How much 'noise' in incorporated in watching a game? For example, when we watch Amir get a rebound, did we see Jose boxing out his man or not boxing him out? When Amir misses the rebound to his man did we see how he was positioned to help a teammate on D? Statistics, by using a large sample, leave that noise to a minimum. And by comparing against your own teammates, a chunk of that noise is relatively even.

                                Plus defensive win share and adjusted defensive +/- are saying something very similar aswell.

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