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Johnson A Possible Amnesty Cut?

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  • #16
    mountio wrote: View Post
    ok .. sorry, Ill make it more PC. There is a very low probability that other NBA teams are willing to trade assets for either Jose or Amir given their contracts. Having said that, Im a guy on a message board and havent been involved in BC's conversations, so of course I dont know for sure (nor does anyone else).

    Better?

    If we only spoke about things that we knew to be absolutely true .. RR would be a pretty dull place ..
    I wasn't trying to offend, or to be sarcastic, I was just stating my impression from your post.
    Walking like I'm already there.

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    • #17
      joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
      Pfft, I don't believe it.

      In related news, look at this picture I found! (Awwwww)

      This is the "before I discovered porn" shot.

      Comment


      • #18
        10 000 Hours wrote: View Post
        I find your talk in "absolutes" to be off base. To say he has no value is way too much of a polarizing statement. Of course he has value, we just aren't privy to the conversations BC and Ed have behind closed doors.
        mountio wrote: View Post
        ok .. sorry, Ill make it more PC. There is a very low probability that other NBA teams are willing to trade assets for either Jose or Amir given their contracts. Having said that, Im a guy on a message board and havent been involved in BC's conversations, so of course I dont know for sure (nor does anyone else).

        Better?

        If we only spoke about things that we knew to be absolutely true .. RR would be a pretty dull place ..

        only a sith deals in absolutes.

        to say that jose has no value is wrong. even if "he" had no value his 10 million expiring that could save a team the poison of being 1 year over the cap is very valuable. he is a strong fundamental pg who takes care of the ball and runs a very low mistake offense. there is a lot of value in that.

        amir also has value but unfortunately there are a lot of players of his ilk in the league right now. so many athletic skinny 4/5s in the league that every team has at least one if not two of them.

        to say that "jose has no value" is more than "not absolutely true" it is a complete fallacy. like if a baby falls twenty stories and i say he almost made it. although not absolutely true it's pretty far from it

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        • #19
          10 000 Hours wrote: View Post
          I wasn't trying to offend, or to be sarcastic, I was just stating my impression from your post.
          I didnt take offense .. just pointing out that its kind of silly to try to discredit someone's opinion by saying "its too absolute" or "they dont know what conversations BC is having" .. because of course both of those things are true.

          If you have a difference of opinion and want to express why .. Im game for that .. but saying I dont know what Im talking about or my opinions arent valid because Im not privy to BC's conversations doesnt make a lot of sense to me ..

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          • #20
            I'm trying to understand why Jose's expiring contract has value to some other team. but not to the Raptors? Can someone help me out? Am I that dense. Don't be kind, feed me the truth.

            Comment


            • #21
              If amnesting Amir leads to the Raptors landing a really good piece then I'm sold. Just look at it as Amir were part of the trade. Essentially he would be as the trade could not happen in this scenario without him leaving the books.

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              • #22
                Puffer wrote: View Post
                I'm trying to understand why Jose's expiring contract has value to some other team. but not to the Raptors? Can someone help me out? Am I that dense. Don't be kind, feed me the truth.
                The way I've read comments about the value of Calderon's expiring contract, is specifically why other teams would value him, not only other teams though. Some teams would value Calderon just for what he offers on the court - veteran leadership, pass first PG, team player. Other teams might like the idea of dropping a big long-term contract for an expiring one, to clear cap space for next offseason.

                I think the Raptors see value for both reasons, or the idea of keeping him and re-signing him beyond next season, for much cheaper.

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                • #23
                  Puffer wrote: View Post
                  I'm trying to understand why Jose's expiring contract has value to some other team. but not to the Raptors? Can someone help me out? Am I that dense. Don't be kind, feed me the truth.
                  Because the Raptors aren't fighting to stay below the tax threshold. They don't need cap relief next year. All cap relief will do for them is reduce their payroll number closer to the salary cap. It won't reduce their payroll to the point that they can be free agent buyers next off-season, not to accomplish anything significant that they couldn't do with the MLE. If they can't be buyers with the expiring contract and they're not fighting the tax threshold then who is his expiring deal benefiting? Not you the fan when his deal runs out and he potentially leaves free.

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                  • #24
                    jbml wrote: View Post
                    Things slow down.They have to write something. Can't see this happening
                    +1 yes.

                    this is just a glorified blog hack looking up and down salary of Raps and throwing darts in the dark.
                    "I may be wrong ... but I doubt it"

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
                      Pfft, I don't believe it.

                      In related news, look at this picture I found! (Awwwww)



                      Huge fight with Carmelo for worst predraft pic ever...



                      Comment


                      • #26
                        \]
                        Puffer wrote: View Post
                        I'm trying to understand why Jose's expiring contract has value to some other team. but not to the Raptors? Can someone help me out? Am I that dense. Don't be kind, feed me the truth.
                        It has value in the sense that it could be included in a trade package for a larger, longer term contract. Think Joe Johnson .. if you were ATL (before you traded him to to the Nets) .. you can argue that swapping him for Jose + other stuff is a good thing because instead of oweing JJ another 4 years 80 mm, you owe Jose 10 mm next year and thats it. Similar if we traded JC to LAL for Artest. So .. its not so much value per se, its value relative to another, worse contract. The theory is that if you take on a worse contract, you would either get a better player (in the case of JJ) or get draft picks or something else thrown in (in the case of an Artest)

                        I think its actually a bit of an exageration of how people refer to expiring as so valuable. Yes, in the right situation, it provides a trade chip .. but there are lots of ways to trade for high contract players (see the Nets / Joe Johnson trade). The defense of the Fields contract as being ok because the $9mm will be an "asset" at the end is some of the worst logic I have ever heard ...

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                        • #27
                          most teams will try very hard to not be tax payers for 3 years out of 5. the penalties for this are very severe. new york and los angeles could most likely be the only teams willing to do it in the future. mark cuban is cutting his spending. thats how valuable that expirings are going to be.

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                          • #28
                            mountio wrote: View Post
                            \]

                            It has value in the sense that it could be included in a trade package for a larger, longer term contract. Think Joe Johnson .. if you were ATL (before you traded him to to the Nets) .. you can argue that swapping him for Jose + other stuff is a good thing because instead of oweing JJ another 4 years 80 mm, you owe Jose 10 mm next year and thats it. ...
                            So then the Raps are on the hook for the stupidly large contract.

                            Bite the bullet for a year, use Jose in the second unit, where he can work his magic with Jonas or Amir, or whoever, and then Raps can make him an offer on a new contract that is cheaper (4-5 million for a couple of years) and have some cap relief themselves. Jose would be an excellent back-up PG. If he is traded, will any new back-up PG bring equal value over the following few years? By all the stats available, Jose is one of the Raps better players. His defensive lapses will be diminished with the new staff coming on-board. That makes him more valuable, in my opinion.

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                            • #29
                              Keep in mind that after this season the luxury tax becomes quite punative. A team might be willing to get rid of a good/decent player with a long contract to avoid the massive luxury tax penalties.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                charlz wrote: View Post
                                +1 yes.

                                this is just a glorified blog hack looking up and down salary of Raps and throwing darts in the dark.
                                +1 again

                                why would we amnesty him? he will be even more useful this year in a reserve role....In fact we shouldn't be amnestying anybody unless it means we are picking up a superior talent. AMir and Calderon have value...it would be a completely idiotic move

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