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Thread: Evaluating players defensively

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    Super Moderator thead's Avatar
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    Default Evaluating players defensively

    was tweeting back and forward with Alex Rucker a bit today. Thought I would share the exchange.

    Alex Rucker ‏@Alex_Rucker
    There is almost nothing about a player's on-ball or help defense that you can glean from the box score.

    Timothy Hedden ‏@trhedden
    @Alex_Rucker doesn't blocked shots point towards good help defense?

    Alex Rucker ‏@Alex_Rucker
    @trhedden Yes, it absolutely suggests that. But there are plenty of players who get blocks and are very poor help defenders, esp in the post

    Naveed ‏@NaveedDawg
    @Alex_Rucker Are there better publicly available stats for this? http://82games.com has opponent PER, JJ was ok, anything else?

    Alex Rucker ‏@Alex_Rucker
    @NaveedDawg No...public stats are based on data which does not support accurate defensive analysis.


    Timothy Hedden ‏@trhedden
    @Alex_Rucker what do you look at then in order to evaluate great defenders? Points against, +/-


    Alex Rucker ‏@Alex_Rucker
    @trhedden None of the above. We have orders of magnitude more data than the public sphere.

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    Super Moderator thead's Avatar
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    Tom Liston ‏@Liston
    #Raptors James Johnson had the 7th highest turnover rate out of 69 small forwards (min 10mpg, 10g). Hedo 2nd

    Timothy Hedden ‏@trhedden
    @Alex_Rucker casual fans think we gave up a good defender for a 2nd rounder. Being connected 2 the team I'd understand if you can't comment

    in regards to why JJ was shipped out

    Tim Chisholm ‏@timpchisholm
    A major schism between player/team vision of JJ. @trhedden: @timpchisholm did they give a reason? I know there was the flare up in practice.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Soft Euro's Avatar
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    This is in line with what Rucker said in the Q&A with Tom Liston (in statophile 35).

    I’d also offer that the media’s perspective of player values is interesting, but it doesn’t always align with pro team’s perspectives – and one of those two enjoys a significant information advantage by virtue of the resources invested into the draft process.
    In my opinion too many people draw too many conclusions from so-called 'advanced stats' like PER, WP, Defensive Rating, etc. All of these stats are making pretty extreme statements about the value of players based on extremely reductionistic versions of the reality on a basketballcourt.

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    And how confident are we all that BC has a guy or a team working on better defensive stats? Fans of Houston, Boston, Dallas, etc would be very confident without hesitation... Toronto fans... not so much.

    May this thread now be merged.

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    Raptors Republic Icon mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Stay away from lightening storms. That tinfoil is dangerous.

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    Lightening storms are more dangerous than darkening storms? Me need a new tinfoil hat.

    By the way Matt, whose idea was it to darken your Username from orange/yellow to black?

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    Raptors Republic Superstar ReubenJRD's Avatar
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    Quote Hugmenot wrote: