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Thread: David Aldridge's off-season grades. Toronto Raptors: 18

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    Super Moderator ReubenJRD's Avatar
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    Default David Aldridge's off-season grades. Toronto Raptors: 18

    David Aldridge handed out his off-season grades in three columns, the top 10, middle 10, and the bottom 10, surprisingly we are at 18. Thought we were gonna be either ranked from 25-30 cause of the recognition the Raptors get, or top 15 because of the additions of young talent.

    What do you think? Good spot, should've been higher, or lower?

    http://www.nba.com/2012/news/feature...t-2/index.html

    No. 18 -- TORONTO RAPTORS
    2011-12 RECORD: 23-43, fourth place, Atlantic Division; did not make playoffs.
    ADDED: G Kyle Lowry (acquired from Houston); G Landry Fields (three years, $20 million); G Terrence Ross (first round, eighth pick overall) C Jonas Valanciunas (Lietuvos Rytas); G John Lucas III (two years); F Quincy Acy (second round, 37th pick overall).
    LOST: F Gary Forbes (signed with Houston); F James Johnson (traded to Sacramento).
    RETAINED: C Aaron Gray (two years); F Alan Anderson.

    THE KEY MAN: C Jonas Valanciunas.
    He's just 20 and he'll certainly have his ups and downs as a rookie adjusting to the NBA game, but Toronto needs its young center to get his feet wet in a hurry. His skills are substantial, though, and when he does figure things out, Toronto will be a much different team. His presence should end the Andrea Bargnani can play some center discussion once and for all, allowing Bargnani to play the four, his more natural position. Valanciunas is going to be a good one.
    THE SKINNY: The Raptors stopped hemorrhaging points with first-year Coach Dwane Casey putting in his defensive structure, and that should continue with more weapons at his disposal next season. Toronto didn't get native son Steve Nash, but wound up a lot deeper and younger than it would have been had Nash taken its three-year, $36 million offer. Lowry and Lucas will combine for a little more than half of what Nash would have made alone. Signing Fields was part of the lure to get Nash (the offer sheet gummed up a potential Knicks sign-and-trade opportunity), but Toronto has him now and will need to figure out how he, DeMar DeRozan and Ross, the University of Washington rookie, can divvy up all of those minutes at shooting guard. Someone will move over to the three. But someone could also be potentially packaged along with incumbent point guard Jose Calderon, who will be dealt.
    Again, big news on the Raptors is the situation on Jose Calderon, which I hope at some time will just shut up and stop. Jose on this team would be my preference, I just don't see an elite wing player in our hands at deadline, because they'll all probably be key players on their respective teams...

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    Raptors Republic Starter theycallmeZZ's Avatar
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    Quote RaptorReuben wrote: View Post



    Again, big news on the Raptors is the situation on Jose Calderon, which I hope at some time will just shut up and stop.
    Hah!

    You think the guys at NBA.com have anything else to talk about the Raptors? The only constants are the Jose story, Landry=overpaid, and not getting Steve Nash.

    Before that it was Val, and Ross being a reach.

    I doubt they know anything else about our team to ride on.
    TORONTOOOOOO RAPTORSSSSSS

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Quote David Aldridge wrote:
    but Toronto has him now and will need to figure out how he, DeMar DeRozan and Ross, the University of Washington rookie, can divvy up all of those minutes at shooting guard. Someone will move over to the three.
    DA is one my absolute favourites ... but I'm a littler disappointed in him.
    Colangelo has stated on numerous occasions that as the Roster stands now, Landry Fields would be our Starting 3.
    In Masai we Trust.

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    Administrator Dr. James Naismith's Avatar
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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    DA is one my absolute favourites ... but I'm a littler disappointed in him.
    Colangelo has stated on numerous occasions that as the Roster stands now, Landry Fields would be our Starting 3.
    DA just stirring the pot. Most of these NBA media types really don't have a clue regarding anything when it comes to the Toronto Raptors. I always take whatever they have to say with a grain of salt. It's mostly rubbish.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Craiger's Avatar
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    Quote Doc Naismith wrote: View Post
    DA just stirring the pot. Most of these NBA media types really don't have a clue regarding anything when it comes to the Toronto Raptors. I always take whatever they have to say with a grain of salt. It's mostly rubbish.
    While people may disagree with Aldridge's opinion on where Toronto ranks with their moves, what he discusses in that peice is pretty much the same heavily discussed issues Raps fans talk about

    -THE KEY MAN: C Jonas Valanciunas.
    -end the Andrea Bargnani can play some center discussion once and for all, allowing Bargnani to play the four, his more natural position.
    -The Raptors stopped hemorrhaging points with first-year Coach Dwane Casey putting in his defensive structure, and that should continue with more weapons at his disposal next season
    -didn't get native son Steve Nash, but wound up a lot deeper and younger
    -Signing Fields was part of the lure to get Nash
    -[Fields], DeMar DeRozan and Ross, the University of Washington rookie, can divvy up all of those minutes at shooting guard. Someone will move over to the three.
    -point guard Jose Calderon, who will be dealt

    (apparently I should have just posted the article again)

    Looking at that I think Aldridge has a very good read as to whats happening in Toronto (Now I may be wrong here but I thought that in the past he admitted being a fan of the Raptors is one of his 'dirty little secrets'. So him being up on the significant happenings in Toronto shouldn't be a suprise)

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Mediumcore's Avatar
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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    DA is one my absolute favourites ... but I'm a littler disappointed in him.
    Colangelo has stated on numerous occasions that as the Roster stands now, Landry Fields would be our Starting 3.
    In all fairness to DA, I don't think he hangs on every word which comes out of BC's mouth as we Raptor fans do. And just because BC says Fields is our starting 3 it doesn't mean it's the best fit for him as far as how the rest of the league perceives Fields. Sometimes an outside perspective is much more clear than ours.

    I would say 18th is a good spot for a team pulling itself together. If Jose has to be dealt I hope they can acquire a young PG with some potential. I shudder at the thought of Lucas being the first PG off the bench.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star ezz_bee's Avatar
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    The Sixers @ 2 and the Rockets @ 8 are had scratchers for me, he has them in the top ten, but it seems to me that general consensus is both teams have gotten worse. The raptors aren't a top 10 team in offseason moves, but I think they deserve to be a few slots higher. 12-16 ranges seems right to me.

    Other than that I have no major complaints with his off-season ranking.
    "We only have one rule on this team. What is that rule? E.L.E. That's right's, E.L.E, and what does E.L.E. stand for? EVERYBODY LOVE EVERYBODY. Right there up on the wall, because this isn't just a basketball team, this is a lifestyle. ~ Jackie Moon

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    Raptors Republic Starter omgsomuchpotential's Avatar
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    Quote ezz_bee wrote: View Post
    The Sixers @ 2 and the Rockets @ 8 are had scratchers for me, he has them in the top ten, but it seems to me that general consensus is both teams have gotten worse. The raptors aren't a top 10 team in offseason moves, but I think they deserve to be a few slots higher. 12-16 ranges seems right to me.

    Other than that I have no major complaints with his off-season ranking.
    Rockets seems to me are rebuilding very nicely. They've got a huge amount of talent in their rookies. It seems to me their situation is so much better than Raptors, and they definitely beat Raptors in their off-season moves.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Primer's Avatar
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    Ugh, just read through the rankings and they make very little sense to me. The Hawks are a bottom 10 team? OK, I guess he's just looking at stats of players in and out, and not contract values or salary cap implications. But wait, he specifically says in his methodology that he does take into account contract value and cap space? So which one is it?

    I would argue the Hawks are a top 10 team for unloading the worst value contract in the NBA, Joe Johnsons deal, plus another horrible value contract in Marvin Williams deal, in exchange for a very reasonable deal to Lou Williams, a far superior player (shorter contract too) in Devin Harris in exchange for Marvin Williams, all while creating huge cap space for next summer. The Hawks maybe lose 5 more games this season with the players that were exchanged, plus they finally have flexibility. I can't see any way that this was a bottom 10 offseason. Especially considering who he put nearer the top.

    The Sixers had the 2nd best offseason? Are you fucking kidding me? In what Bizzarro universe does this clown live in. They replace an extremely efficient Lou Williams with an abysmal Nick Young, they lose their best frontcourt player in Brand for absolutely nothing, and they explicitly state they are going to start their other absymal acquisition, Kwame Brown, at Center. How the fuck is a team that basically swapped Williams and Brand for Young and Brown considered the 2nd best offseason mover? The sixers have gotten much worse and did nothing to improve their future cap flexibility.

    I also cannot see how you rate the NY Knicks offseason above the Raptors. They lost Lin and replaced him with Felton and Kidd, a huge mega downgrade unless Kidd and Felton find a time machine in the offseason. They lost Fields and replaced him with no one. The only position they improved at was C by getting Camby. How is that better than the Raps offseason adding Lowry, Fields, Valanciunas, and Ross? It isn't.

    Basically, this guys rankings are shit.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran NoPropsneeded's Avatar
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    Quote Primer wrote: View Post
    Ugh, just read through the rankings and they make very little sense to me. The Hawks are a bottom 10 team? OK, I guess he's just looking at stats of players in and out, and not contract values or salary cap implications. But wait, he specifically says in his methodology that he does take into account contract value and cap space? So which one is it?

    I would argue the Hawks are a top 10 team for unloading the worst value contract in the NBA, Joe Johnsons deal, plus another horrible value contract in Marvin Williams deal, in exchange for a very reasonable deal to Lou Williams, a far superior player (shorter contract too) in Devin Harris in exchange for Marvin Williams, all while creating huge cap space for next summer. The Hawks maybe lose 5 more games this season with the players that were exchanged, plus they finally have flexibility. I can't see any way that this was a bottom 10 offseason. Especially considering who he put nearer the top.

    The Sixers had the 2nd best offseason? Are you fucking kidding me? In what Bizzarro universe does this clown live in. They replace an extremely efficient Lou Williams with an abysmal Nick Young, they lose their best frontcourt player in Brand for absolutely nothing, and they explicitly state they are going to start their other absymal acquisition, Kwame Brown, at Center. How the fuck is a team that basically swapped Williams and Brand for Young and Brown considered the 2nd best offseason mover? The sixers have gotten much worse and did nothing to improve their future cap flexibility.

    I also cannot see how you rate the NY Knicks offseason above the Raptors. They lost Lin and replaced him with Felton and Kidd, a huge mega downgrade unless Kidd and Felton find a time machine in the offseason. They lost Fields and replaced him with no one. The only position they improved at was C by getting Camby. How is that better than the Raps offseason adding Lowry, Fields, Valanciunas, and Ross? It isn't.

    Basically, this guys rankings are shit.
    +1 idk wtf DA was thinking. I think he was high when he wrote this

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    Super Moderator ReubenJRD's Avatar
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    Quote ezz_bee wrote: View Post
    The Sixers @ 2 and the Rockets @ 8 are had scratchers for me, he has them in the top ten, but it seems to me that general consensus is both teams have gotten worse. The raptors aren't a top 10 team in offseason moves, but I think they deserve to be a few slots higher. 12-16 ranges seems right to me.

    Other than that I have no major complaints with his off-season ranking.
    I totally agree with this. DA is usually very spot on when it comes to the business side of the game along with the on-court game it self.

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    Raptors Republic Starter charlz's Avatar
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    Quote RaptorReuben wrote: View Post

    Again, big news on the Raptors is the situation on Jose Calderon, which I hope at some time will just shut up and stop. Jose on this team would be my preference, I just don't see an elite wing player in our hands at deadline, because they'll all probably be key players on their respective teams...
    I am always ripping on Calderon and even I don't want them to move him at least until the allstar break.

    If you are winning and holding down a playoff spot - even then don't trade him unless it really helps.

    Packaging Calderon and Ross for iggy is not good - esp. considering Raps already owe a first round pick to Houston for Lowry deal.
    "I may be wrong ... but I doubt it"

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    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    JV will get all the attention heading in but this season is all about Bargnani when we're talking how successful the team is. They're going to need him to score his 20-22PPG for sure but more importantly he's going to need to step up and not only do his job on defense but take it to another level and be a leader to JV. He needs to take a major step forward and if he doesn't do it this team won't improve nearly as much as many fans expect. I believe this is the make or break year for Bargnani. This is his final test as a Raptor and if he fails this one he's gone.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Primer's Avatar
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    Really tired of writers incorrectly reporting Landry Fields contract when the correct info is available all over the internet. It's a 3 year, $18.725M contract. Not a 3 year $20 million contract. The $1.275M difference doesn't seem like a lot, but it becomes pretty damn important when we're splitting hairs over whether he is overpaid or not. I just don't see why they can't start reporting the correct number, since it's been out for nearly a month now. Further proof of how little research goes into writing those fluff pieces.

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote Primer wrote: View Post
    Really tired of writers incorrectly reporting Landry Fields contract when the correct info is available all over the internet. It's a 3 year, $18.725M contract. Not a 3 year $20 million contract. The $1.275M difference doesn't seem like a lot, but it becomes pretty damn important when we're splitting hairs over whether he is overpaid or not. I just don't see why they can't start reporting the correct number, since it's been out for nearly a month now. Further proof of how little research goes into writing those fluff pieces.
    +1

    Same with Amir Johnson's supposed 5 year, $35M deal.

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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    +1

    Same with Amir Johnson's supposed 5 year, $35M deal.
    +1 again

    sometimes they just need to write something quickly in order to meet deadlines....The problem is a story builds around these fluff points and all of a sudden we are being lambasted for certain moves based on inaccurate information

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    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Quote Primer wrote: View Post
    Really tired of writers incorrectly reporting Landry Fields contract when the correct info is available all over the internet. It's a 3 year, $18.725M contract. Not a 3 year $20 million contract. The $1.275M difference doesn't seem like a lot, but it becomes pretty damn important when we're splitting hairs over whether he is overpaid or not. I just don't see why they can't start reporting the correct number, since it's been out for nearly a month now. Further proof of how little research goes into writing those fluff pieces.
    Exaggeration greases the wheel of the bus people are getting tossed under.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Mediumcore's Avatar
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    Not sure why some are down on DA about this article. It's not a ranking of how teams will do next season. It's a ranking of off season moves and the grade he feels they merit isn't it? I'd say for the most part it's spot on.

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    Raptors Republic Superstar TheGloveinRapsUniform's Avatar
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    I actually thought that the Raps should have been ranked way higher than 18.

    The moves that theyve made so far were to address the needs, and i think theyve done at least 80% of what needed to be done. The 20% missing is the scoring wing and trading Calderon.

    They needed a scoring, defensive PG, they got Lowry, a solid backup in LucasIII, a scorer in Ross, and a 5 in JV to put Bargnani in the 4.

    On paper, definitely looks good.

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    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    Quote TheGloveinRapsUniform wrote: View Post
    I actually thought that the Raps should have been ranked way higher than 18.

    The moves that theyve made so far were to address the needs, and i think theyve done at least 80% of what needed to be done. The 20% missing is the scoring wing and trading Calderon.

    They needed a scoring, defensive PG, they got Lowry, a solid backup in LucasIII, a scorer in Ross, and a 5 in JV to put Bargnani in the 4.

    On paper, definitely looks good.
    I agree fully. #18 offseason ranking seems way too low for the Raptors.

    ROSTER MOVES
    Bayless --> Lowry
    Uzoh --> Lucas III
    Magloire --> Valanciunas
    Alabi --> Acy
    Johnson --> Fields
    Forbes --> Ross

    STARTING UNIT
    Gray --> Valanciunas (learning curve for sure, but should become the better player at both ends very quickly)
    Bargnani (a healthy season with improved lineup around him, both with more scorers and better point-of-attack defense, should see his numbers improve)
    Johnson --> Fields (similar all-around game at both ends, but much more controlled/consistent)
    DeRozan (should/better continue improving; end of season play and Olympic select team experience should help)
    Calderon --> Lowry (significant upgrade defensively, much better penetrator)

    2ND UNIT
    Amir/Magloire --> Amir/Gray (depending on matchups, depth at C/PF is even better this season, meaning there should be lots of competition for playing time)
    Davis (first full offseason, likely with a chip on his shoulder and something to prove, I am quietly/hopefully optimistic)
    Kleiza (appears to be fully healthy for first time in two years)
    Forbes --> Ross (will have a learning curve, but will have much more leeway to learn and be streaky shooter on 2nd unit)
    Bayless --> Calderon (due to poor defense, he goes from being a below-average starter to a seriously above-average backup)

    BENCH
    Alabi --> Acy
    Anderson
    Uzoh --> Lucas III


    The Raps are solid, young team, full of players with loads of potential. When you consider the fact that Raptors made all these changes and still enter the season only about $3.5M over the salary cap and have Calderon's $10.6M contract expiring (Gray (TBC), Lucas III (Team Option), Anderson and DeRozan (QO) are also expiring) to give them even more roster/cap flexibility next offseason, so I can't understand how they could possibly be ranked so low. Even the slightly overpaid Fields contract should be more than offset by the Lowry contract, which is widely regarded as one of the best value contracts in the league.

    I still think they need a true impact #1 option type wing (likely SF), but they have Calderon (expiring contract), PF depth (likely Davis, possibly Amir) and SG depth (possibly DeRozan, if Fields returns to rookie year form and Ross proves worth of being a lottery pick) to offer in trade. As an FYI, Calderon ($10.6M) + Davis ($2.2M) + DeRozan ($3.3M) would allow the Raps to bring back more than $20.2M in salary (as a maximum), if they so desired.
    Last edited by CalgaryRapsFan; Wed Aug 8th, 2012 at 01:22 PM.

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