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Thread: Everything Kyle Lowry.

  1. #61
    Raptors Republic Superstar Rapstor4Life's Avatar
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    LOL! dude you are the biggest flip flop ever.

    Lowry had a bad game move on, everybody did.

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    Super Moderator ReubenJRD's Avatar
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    Yeah, TRex, you're flippin' and floppin' everywhere sir.

    Anyways, I don't think it's his fault. It's clearly the fault of Dwane Casey.

    1. Dwane Casey asked Lowry to have a bit of "Calderon" in him. Lowry has clearly TRIED to do so. Problem is, his name is Kyle Lowry. Not Jose Calderon. Trying to integrate one certain type of game into another's isn't easy, and it just isn't Lowry's game.

    2. With all of the guys on this team that need the ball, Lowry is being asked to give it up, and run the offense through system. Before Lowry came to Toronto - actually, even his first couple games as a Raptor - he is one of THE BEST in breaking down opposing defenses, getting into the lane, attacking, and pitching out to the perimeter. I think that's the best way to get this team success, Lowry attracting defenses, meaning help comes, pitch it out to either Gay/Derozan, and they have more room to create their shots, drive to the hoop, or swinging it to a side for a perimeter look.

    3. Pretty much repeating, but since Casey has asked him to balance his game, he's been in far too much of a pass-first mentality. He's an aggressive point guard, who thinks "rim first, pass next", and I think we've been very hesitant, because our point of attack is hesitant as well.

  3. #63
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    Quote RaptorReuben wrote: View Post
    Yeah, TRex, you're flippin' and floppin' everywhere sir.

    Anyways, I don't think it's his fault. It's clearly the fault of Dwane Casey.

    1. Dwane Casey asked Lowry to have a bit of "Calderon" in him. Lowry has clearly TRIED to do so. Problem is, his name is Kyle Lowry. Not Jose Calderon. Trying to integrate one certain type of game into another's isn't easy, and it just isn't Lowry's game.

    2. With all of the guys on this team that need the ball, Lowry is being asked to give it up, and run the offense through system. Before Lowry came to Toronto - actually, even his first couple games as a Raptor - he is one of THE BEST in breaking down opposing defenses, getting into the lane, attacking, and pitching out to the perimeter. I think that's the best way to get this team success, Lowry attracting defenses, meaning help comes, pitch it out to either Gay/Derozan, and they have more room to create their shots, drive to the hoop, or swinging it to a side for a perimeter look.

    3. Pretty much repeating, but since Casey has asked him to balance his game, he's been in far too much of a pass-first mentality. He's an aggressive point guard, who thinks "rim first, pass next", and I think we've been very hesitant, because our point of attack is hesitant as well.
    The thing is, ask Lowry to drive the lane and be himself doesn't result in kickouts, as per his history. We've already seen what he too often does in that scenario, which is grow blinders, put his head down and drive his way into a forest of bigs until his only option is to hoist up a prayer while twisting in some wild fashion. Yes, he's being asked to change his game, as in develop like many professionals do, especially PGs. That's not a bad thing, for him or the team. He's trying, but being a facilitator of any style is somewhat foreign to him. he's trying though, so that's a good sign.

  4. #64
    Super Moderator ReubenJRD's Avatar
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    Quote p00ka wrote: View Post
    The thing is, ask Lowry to drive the lane and be himself doesn't result in kickouts, as per his history. We've already seen what he too often does in that scenario, which is grow blinders, put his head down and drive his way into a forest of bigs until his only option is to hoist up a prayer while twisting in some wild fashion. Yes, he's being asked to change his game, as in develop like many professionals do, especially PGs. That's not a bad thing, for him or the team. He's trying, but being a facilitator of any style is somewhat foreign to him. he's trying though, so that's a good sign.
    Not a bad thing, but it's also clearly apparent it's not the best thing. If we get the play we got in the beginning of the season from Lowry, this team would play much, much better. Lowry is a good facilitator regardless of what way he's trying to play. Might not be as creative a passer, or as knowledgeable as Calderon is, but he is definitely a better, talented player than Jose, but we haven't gotten that side of him.


  5. #65
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    I don't know if he's the answer but he's who we have and he's not bad. Keep in mind that until 3 games ago things were working. Not only is it bad that we lost the last 3 games but the losses were to teams like Cleveland and Washington which is why the Lowry question may have arose. If so I don't think there's anything to worry about.
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    Raptors Republic All-Star ezz_bee's Avatar
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    I wasn't over the moon when we picked up Lowry, but I was interested to see how he'd do. I'm also okay with the Jose trade and anyone who wants to rehash the lowry vs. calderon debate is wasting everyone's time including their own. Let's move on.

    That said, Lowry hasn't impressed me at all. I'm willing to cut him some lack though because this team is kind of fucked in terms of facilators... Lowry, Derozan, Gay... and then add JLIII, Anderson, and Bargnani off the bench and who do you have to move the ball?

    We someone how can pass in the starting unit and that means either Lowry or Derozan has to go, I'm thinking probably derozen. If you traded derozen for a guy who can pass and shoot threes then I think the offense in general is more effective. The only other place where it's possible would be to somehow land a PF who is an amazing passer and I don't see that happening. Bargnani to lakers for Pau would be great, but unlikely i think.

    The honey moon with Gay is over and unfortunately the short comings of the line ups are becoming more evident. Hopefully, through more practices the team can figure out and Casey can develop more schemes that address ball movement.

    I guess it sounds like I'm give Lowry a free pass, and I guess that's true... for now.
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    Super Moderator ReubenJRD's Avatar
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    Quote Eric Akshinthala wrote: View Post
    I don't know if he's the answer but he's who we have and he's not bad. Keep in mind that until 3 games ago things were working. Not only is it bad that we lost the last 3 games but the losses were to teams like Cleveland and Washington which is why the Lowry question may have arose. If so I don't think there's anything to worry about.
    Lowry's doing his best to make this team move, but I really, really do believe he has to start being more of a score first guard again. He seems to better his facilitating because it comes to him, and it forces defenses to adjust. Whilst Toronto still has Derozan and Gay on the perimeter.

    Remember, before Lowry came to Toronto, and the first couple games of the season, he was playing at an all-star level. This guy is a near all-star calibre point guard.

  8. #68
    Raptors Republic Starter torch19's Avatar
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    He's at his best in a drive and kick game, which I think we should adapt to. Unleash the real Lowry since he will never be Jose. He takes too long to decide what set to run and we start off our plays with 14 seconds left. Make it easy. He's more Ty Lawson than Steve Nash.

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    Quote RaptorReuben wrote: View Post
    Lowry's doing his best to make this team move, but I really, really do believe he has to start being more of a score first guard again. He seems to better his facilitating because it comes to him, and it forces defenses to adjust. Whilst Toronto still has Derozan and Gay on the perimeter.

    Remember, before Lowry came to Toronto, and the first couple games of the season, he was playing at an all-star level. This guy is a near all-star calibre point guard.
    If shooting more is part of his natural game he should shoot more. Lowry is no Jose when it comes to running an offence but I don't think he's a terrible passer either. Just play his natural game is what I think Lowry should do.
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    casey is a terrible offensive coach and doesnt know how to put guys in a position to suceed. he has failed to use bargnani and lowrys abilites horibly and asks them to be something theyre not. lowry more of a facilitator and bargs as a pilon/ floor spacer.

  11. #71
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote Eric Akshinthala wrote: View Post
    If shooting more is part of his natural game he should shoot more. Lowry is no Jose when it comes to running an offence but I don't think he's a terrible passer either. Just play his natural game is what I think Lowry should do.
    That is the answer.

    He has been asked to play Calderon's game (since well before the Gay trade). The Raptors have a coach who's idea of running an offense is creating opportunities for jump shots and - until the acquisition of Gay - had no one who could create their own shot consistently.

    Lowry has been neutered.
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  12. #72
    Raptors Republic All-Star DoNDaDDa's Avatar
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    i think Lowry is either hurt or hes unhappy with the coach..he clearly isnt playing upto potential right now..that being said im ok with giving him a chance..he has the tools, i wouldnt invest time into him though, by that i mean he should have a very short rope...if after 15-20 games next season hes still not gettin the job done id be looking real hard for a REAL starting PG for the future..were clearly stocking up for a run the next few seasons & we cant afford to have starters not contributing at there highest levels. PF spot is the real pressing issue at the moment

  13. #73
    Raptors Republic All-Star tucas's Avatar
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    Quote TRex wrote: View Post
    Another mediocre performance tonight by Lowry. He's been average since the Calderon trade and really he's been average the whole year except for the first 5 games of the season. No playmaking skills, overrated defensively, likes to play hero ball, makes a lot of poor/dumb decisions on offense and on defense.

    Colangelo took a big gamble trading a potential lottery pick for an unproven PG and looks like it's going to bite him in the ass.

    If you look at Lowry's career, he's been a career backup. He was a backup in Memphis. Lost his starting job to Dragic in Houston. Lost his starting job to Jose earlier in the season. Now that he's getting the chance to prove that he's a starting caliber PG in this league he hasn't impressed. To me he's looking like your protoypical backup PG. A guy that is more suited as a backup PG but will show flashes from time to time.
    Name 30 pg's who are better?

  14. #74
    Raptors Republic Superstar iblastoff's Avatar
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    Meh. Once Lowry starts shooting more and has a bad game with it, everyone will start whining that he should pass more.

  15. #75
    Administrator Dr. James Naismith's Avatar
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    Quote iblastoff wrote: View Post
    Meh. Once Lowry starts shooting more and has a bad game with it, everyone will start whining that he should pass more.
    Not I. I'll just happy when he starts passing.

  16. #76
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    Quote DoNDaDDa wrote: View Post
    i think Lowry is either hurt or hes unhappy with the coach..he clearly isnt playing upto potential right now..that being said im ok with giving him a chance..he has the tools, i wouldnt invest time into him though, by that i mean he should have a very short rope...if after 15-20 games next season hes still not gettin the job done id be looking real hard for a REAL starting PG for the future..were clearly stocking up for a run the next few seasons & we cant afford to have starters not contributing at there highest levels. PF spot is the real pressing issue at the moment
    I have a similar view...though I don't think he has any issue with the coach. I think he's a good, cheap, stopgap PG who has the tools to be something more so it's nice to be able to give him a look. If he's not performing next year, he should be very easy to trade with his low, expiring contract. Raps just have to keep an eye out in case a real top tier PG becomes available. Lowry could easily be part of a package to get such a player.

  17. #77
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    Quote DoNDaDDa wrote: View Post
    i think Lowry is either hurt or hes unhappy with the coach..he clearly isnt playing upto potential right now..that being said im ok with giving him a chance..he has the tools, i wouldnt invest time into him though, by that i mean he should have a very short rope...if after 15-20 games next season hes still not gettin the job done id be looking real hard for a REAL starting PG for the future..were clearly stocking up for a run the next few seasons & we cant afford to have starters not contributing at there highest levels. PF spot is the real pressing issue at the moment
    First bold: I don't think Lowry is hurt nor unhappy, he's just playing the game coach is asking of him to do, which is totally wrong because he's not a pass first point guard. We've all seen how good this team becomes, and how hard they are to guard on the defensive end when Lowry decides to look for his own, or starts being aggressive.
    Usually, when this team struggles in a quarter to score, Lowry typically steps up i.e. New York game, and he opens up the floor for the others. We NEED this from Lowry, like Eric Akshinthala said, he needs to play his natural game.

    Second bold: I disagree, Lowry is a really, really good point guard when - like I said in the above - plays his natural game. Even right now, where he's being less assertive, he's still a player that defenses have to try and stop. He's definitely worth being the point guard of the future, because what IF he walks away, where are we going to look? Draft? Nope, team is looking to contend by next season. Free agency or trade? Nope, cap space is minimal, and not many point guards better or as talented as Lowry.

  18. #78
    Raptors Republic Superstar Rapstor4Life's Avatar
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    I think Lowry is unhappy with what happens when hes off the court a lot of this is on the bench our starters are really it, the bench is just so incompetent cause there is nobody leading them... And I do think he isnt 100 percent.

    The team right now is crazy athletic we have to get much better on scoring off our defense nobody really knows where to be yet especially on teams that get back after a shot is put up (Celtics) the team is too athletic to not get some easy buckets in defense to offense transition.
    Last edited by Rapstor4Life; Sat Mar 2nd, 2013 at 12:59 PM.

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    Quote Rapstor4Life wrote: View Post
    I think Lowry is unhappy with what happens when hes off the court a lot of this is on the bench our starters are really it, the bench is just so incompetent cause there is nobody leading them... And I do think he isnt 100 percent.

    The team right now is crazy athletic we have to get much better on scoring off our defense nobody really knows where to be yet especially on teams that get back after a shot is put up (Celtics) the team is too athletic to not get some easy buckets in defense to offense transition.
    Problem is, it often happens when Lowry is on the floor, Lucas rarely looks up the court, and usually settles for quick shots in the clock. Yes, it's an exceptionally athletic team, but you can't run the floor if the defense initially doesn't create the opportunity. In my opinion, the defense has regressed from the last season because of Bargnani originally being the starting power forward, and having a rookie anchor.

  20. #80
    Raptors Republic Superstar TRex's Avatar
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    Quote tucas wrote: View Post
    Name 30 pg's who are better?
    Ok.

    Derrick Rose
    Rajon Rondo
    Chris Paul
    Deron Williams
    Steph Curry
    Jrue Holliday
    Jose Calderon
    Ty Lawson
    Eric Bledsoe
    Steve Nash
    Ricky Rubio
    Goran Dragic
    Kyrie Irving
    Brandon Jennings
    Mike Conley
    Greivis Vazquez
    John Wall
    Mike Conley
    Tony Parker
    Kemba Walker
    Russell Westbrook
    Jeff Teague
    Damian Lillard
    Tyreke Evans
    George Hill

    All these guys are a BETTER PG than Lowry.

    And like i said before, Lowry is an unproven PG. He's a career backup. And so far he's proving me right.
    Last edited by TRex; Sat Mar 2nd, 2013 at 02:31 PM.
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