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Thread: Bargs admits to team's woes

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    Raptors Republic Starter phez's Avatar
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    Default Bargs admits to team's woes

    http://www.sportando.net/eng/usa/nba...situation.html

    "This is a strange season for me with too many ups and downs. One night I score 34 points, then just 4, then 21, again 4 and last game 23. It sounds like a joke. When things go wrong, also occurs a psychological component, but cannot be a justification. The stimuli must be found as well in the worst situations.

    We are playing badly and when all the team plays a bad basketball, even you, as a player, are affected. Rumors on me being traded? I have heard them. It is clear that when you play bad, the first thing you think is to shop your best player.

    The situation as a team is bad. After all the expectations last summer, the result is that we keep losing. We missed the playoffs the last four years and we have the second worst record in the NBA after the Wizards. Last season, despite the losses, we had a defensive identity. We won the match through the defense. This season we don't even have this. We alternate good performances with other games in which we concede a lot of points to out opponents.

    Honestly, I do not know the reason. We have new players, almost the entire starting five changed. We changed the key roles as the point guard and the center. But we are only at the beginning of the season. We still have time to correct this negative trend".
    I won't comment on whether he's right or wrong but it feels good to hear at least someone from the organization talk about the team's performance.

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Nice to see Bargnani thinks what everyone else is asking.

    The cynic in me cannot ignore the, "....the first thing youthink is to shop your best player." I don't think he is the best player on the team.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Craiger's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Nice to see Bargnani thinks what everyone else is asking.

    The cynic in me cannot ignore the, "....the first thing youthink is to shop your best player." I don't think he is the best player on the team.
    That stood out to me aswell.

    Along with only considering how many points he's scoring when discussing his 'ups and down' and the ironic discussion of defense/defensive identity.

    Maybe that me being cynical aswell or perhaps its a statement of how much he's been coddled by the organization over the years.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
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    Quote Craiger wrote: View Post
    That stood out to me aswell.

    Along with only considering how many points he's scoring when discussing his 'ups and down' and the ironic discussion of defense/defensive identity.

    Maybe that me being cynical aswell or perhaps its a statement of how much he's been coddled by the organization over the years.
    Good point. The Republic is more knowledgeable about the proper ways to evaluate a player than an actual NBA player himself. [I tried to type that without sounding arrogant, but it's just not possible].

    YAY POINTS!!!
    "I don't lie. I willfully participate in a campaign of misinformation." - Fox Mulder

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Mediumcore's Avatar
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    The thing that kills me the most is that usually a good player would say "I need to step my game up and do better at (fill in the blank) in order to help my team and be a leader". But I've never heard Bargnanni ever admit that anything is his fault or take it upon himself to put the blame squarely on his shoulders.

    A leader he is not.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
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    Quote Mediumcore wrote: View Post
    The thing that kills me the most is that usually a good player would say "I need to step my game up and do better at (fill in the blank) in order to help my team and be a leader". But I've never heard Bargnanni ever admit that anything is his fault or take it upon himself to put the blame squarely on his shoulders.

    A leader he is not.
    It's almost like he's been somewhat defiant over the years. Reporters have attempted to give him the hint of needing to improve HIS rebounding and defense, and more often than not, he answers the question from a team perspective (as opposed to an individual perspective).
    "I don't lie. I willfully participate in a campaign of misinformation." - Fox Mulder

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    Quote Mediumcore wrote: View Post
    The thing that kills me the most is that usually a good player would say "I need to step my game up and do better at (fill in the blank) in order to help my team and be a leader". But I've never heard Bargnanni ever admit that anything is his fault or take it upon himself to put the blame squarely on his shoulders.

    A leader he is not.
    He is not a leader nor mentally strong. When was the last time you saw AB dive for a loose ball? He does not give as much effort consistantly as he could.

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    Raptors Republic Superstar TheGloveinRapsUniform's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Nice to see Bargnani thinks what everyone else is asking.

    The cynic in me cannot ignore the, "....the first thing youthink is to shop your best player." I don't think he is the best player on the team.
    And this is exactly why the team sucks, not because Bargnani thinks he is the team's best player, but because management believes that Bargnani is the team's best player. Why would Bargnani assume that? Because Casey runs almost everything through him. Thats why even with a 2-19 performance, he is still in the game because most of the plays are set for him. Whether we fans like or not, Bargnani is the heralded franchise player, its been fairly obvious the past few years, unless you're living under a rock.

    He can admit all the woes all he wants, what matters now is if he's going to do something about it. the problem is he's going 29% off the field and still only having 2-3 asts per game. If he realizes his struggles, he should pass more, set up teammates.

    The best thing that ive read in this article is that he's heard rumors about him being traded. I want that to light a fire under his butt, not for the team, but for the sake of him getting more value in a trade.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Axel's Avatar
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    "It is clear that when you play bad, the first thing you think is to shop your best player." - Is Barg's suggesting we trade Lowry, and Valanciunas?
    Whatever you do, do it the best you can

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    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Nice to see Bargnani thinks what everyone else is asking.

    The cynic in me cannot ignore the, "....the first thing youthink is to shop your best player." I don't think he is the best player on the team.
    Quote Axel wrote: View Post
    "It is clear that when you play bad, the first thing you think is to shop your best player." - Is Barg's suggesting we trade Lowry, and Valanciunas?
    lol, I was thinking the EXACT same thing when reading that. Is Bargnani our "best player"? Since he's been struggling to produce in the only category he's capable of providing (i.e. points), I'd have to lean towards Lowry.
    "I don't lie. I willfully participate in a campaign of misinformation." - Fox Mulder

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote Nilanka wrote: View Post
    lol, I was thinking the EXACT same thing when reading that. Is Bargnani our "best player"? Since he's been struggling to produce in the only category he's capable of providing (i.e. points), I'd have to lean towards Lowry.
    I wouldn't lean, I'd dive.

    I would put Lowry and DeRozan both ahead of Bargnani. Anyone notice DeRozan is getting 5 rebs a game?

    I could argue Calderon is better. Take out JV's rookie nights and he is better.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    I wouldn't lean, I'd dive.

    I would put Lowry and DeRozan both ahead of Bargnani. Anyone notice DeRozan is getting 5 rebs a game?

    I could argue Calderon is better. Take out JV's rookie nights and he is better.

    I will say, when you turn the page on a player, you really turn that page. lol

    Not even a shred of kindness for 'the Magician'?

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote sleepz wrote: View Post
    I will say, when you turn the page on a player, you really turn that page. lol

    Not even a shred of kindness for 'the Magician'?
    He is what he is. All past arguments were of the idea of what he could be. He showed what he could be but decides to return to what he is. See you, Andrea.

    He is one-dimensional who of late is half-dimensional.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
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    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    I wouldn't lean, I'd dive.

    I would put Lowry and DeRozan both ahead of Bargnani. Anyone notice DeRozan is getting 5 rebs a game?

    I could argue Calderon is better. Take out JV's rookie nights and he is better.
    he has fewer rookie nights than bargs has bargs nights
    @jerboat

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    Raptors Republic Starter RAPresenting's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    I wouldn't lean, I'd dive.

    I would put Lowry and DeRozan both ahead of Bargnani. Anyone notice DeRozan is getting 5 rebs a game?

    I could argue Calderon is better. Take out JV's rookie nights and he is better.
    Lowry would be ahead yes but not as much as a dive would deserve. Matt put the hate aside for a second and remember Lowry's ability to involve others then himself, shot selection and constantly getting burned defensively from gambling like an addict.

    Demar will be better yes but today he is not. Look no further then games with defensive stoppers (Tony Allen, Sefolosa, Brewer, Iggy) to completely make Demar invisable. He's grown a ton and yes he's been outstanding on the boards but he can be kept in check. Andrea offensively misses shots and his selection is questionable at best but he isn't shut down like Demar is. Andrea beats himself while Demar simply gets bullied (Most frustrating part of Andrea's game IMO). They are both poor playmakers for others and defensively Dre is defenitely better at keeping his man in check. I fully expect Demar to surpass him next year but today he's not.

    This is why our record is so poor simply because the overall talent on this team is not good enough. I'm a die heart fan, watch every game and have had been fooled by BC many times. Fact of the matter is they just aren't good enough if Andrea is in the conversation for "best player" and unfortunately today I see him as the second best behind Lowry.

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote RAPresenting wrote: View Post
    Lowry would be ahead yes but not as much as a dive would deserve. Matt put the hate aside for a second and remember Lowry's ability to involve others then himself, shot selection and constantly getting burned defensively from gambling like an addict.

    Demar will be better yes but today he is not. Look no further then games with defensive stoppers (Tony Allen, Sefolosa, Brewer, Iggy) to completely make Demar invisable. He's grown a ton and yes he's been outstanding on the boards but he can be kept in check. Andrea offensively misses shots and his selection is questionable at best but he isn't shut down like Demar is. Andrea beats himself while Demar simply gets bullied (Most frustrating part of Andrea's game IMO). They are both poor playmakers for others and defensively Dre is defenitely better at keeping his man in check. I fully expect Demar to surpass him next year but today he's not.

    This is why our record is so poor simply because the overall talent on this team is not good enough. I'm a die heart fan, watch every game and have had been fooled by BC many times. Fact of the matter is they just aren't good enough if Andrea is in the conversation for "best player" and unfortunately today I see him as the second best behind Lowry.
    There is no hate in my analysis of Bargnani.

    Hate is a result of the analysis.

    **Hate is used for Andrea's game, not talking about him as a person, hate would just be psychotic then**

    I respectfully agree to disagree that Bargnani is a better player than Lowry or DeRozan. This discussion for me has 'better player' meaning contributes more to winning. There is no question Bargnani's skills are phenomenal but skills don't win games without heart, hustle, and desire.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran white men can't jump's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post

    I would put Lowry and DeRozan both ahead of Bargnani. Anyone notice DeRozan is getting 5 rebs a game?
    Yep, and also just that, while he still is a better home than road player, DeRozan has been our "best" player by default by being the most consistent and the least damaging out of he, Bargs and Lowry. Though with Lowry, it's clearly a combination of coming back early and trying to do too much. I wish Bargs tried. At all.
    DeRozan has been a nice surprise. I expected a bit of a stabilization of his game after last year, at least in scoring, but the rebounding has been nice, and he just seems much more aware and deliberate. He's making fewer bad decisions on both sides of the court, and his effort level is more consistent.

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    Super Moderator ReubenJRD's Avatar
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    Quote white men can't jump wrote: View Post
    Yep, and also just that, while he still is a better home than road player, DeRozan has been our "best" player by default by being the most consistent and the least damaging out of he, Bargs and Lowry. Though with Lowry, it's clearly a combination of coming back early and trying to do too much. I wish Bargs tried. At all.
    DeRozan has been a nice surprise. I expected a bit of a stabilization of his game after last year, at least in scoring, but the rebounding has been nice, and he just seems much more aware and deliberate. He's making fewer bad decisions on both sides of the court, and his effort level is more consistent.
    +1.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran NoPropsneeded's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    I wouldn't lean, I'd dive.

    I would put Lowry and DeRozan both ahead of Bargnani. Anyone notice DeRozan is getting 5 rebs a game?

    I could argue Calderon is better. Take out JV's rookie nights and he is better.
    DeRozan is a top 10 rebounding guard in the league right now!
    "You never heard of DeMar just google him, the defense don't know what to do wit him"

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    Raptors Republic Rookie Jkwasia's Avatar
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    Quote NoPropsneeded wrote: View Post
    DeRozan is a top 10 rebounding guard in the league right now!
    Quote enlightenment wrote: View Post
    DD's rebounding is my favorite part of his development
    If he could only show the hunger to go at the defensive stoppers(i.e Tony allen.Iggy,thabo sefolosha,etc) he would be an allstar this year plus if the team could win....sigh

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