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Thread: Big V headed to the bench! Are you kidding me????

  1. #61
    Raptors Republic Starter The Coach's Avatar
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    Quote DoNDaDDa wrote: View Post
    Val will be starting tonight..http://www.sportsnet.ca/basketball/2..._jazz_preview/

    glad to see..Val hasnt been our prob. PRIMO PASTA is!
    I'm a huge JV fan... just ask anyone in the dynasty fantasy basketball pool. I think he is going to be great; however, lately I have started to think that when he is on the floor the Raps are worse defensively. I decided to look up the Raps +/- statistics for this year (20 games) and my fears were actualized. Now, I know that plus/minus is not viewed the same as in hockey, and some people give it little merit in basketball, but when their is this much discrepancy between Amir and JV (or Bargs) for that matter, it makes me think that there is a strong case to put JV on the bench to start the game and start Amir.

    Here is the link: http://www.nba.com/statistics/plusmi...9&team=Raptors

    Notice that Amir is one of only 2 Raps in the plus (+31), while JV is the worst (-116) and Bargs is second worst (-108). JV has also had about 270 less minutes than Bargs to accumulate that poor stat.

    I watch JV with rose-colored glasses and think that any time he touches an offensive board, or makes an aggressive move, he is doing well... Amir on the other hand only gets my praise when he does something truly great. In other words, I have a double standard and so do the commentators.

    JV will be good, very good, but we are definitely sacrificing good starts, and possibly wins, to get there.

  2. #62
    Raptors Republic Starter The Coach's Avatar
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    Quote The Coach wrote: View Post
    I'm a huge JV fan... just ask anyone in the dynasty fantasy basketball pool. I think he is going to be great; however, lately I have started to think that when he is on the floor the Raps are worse defensively. I decided to look up the Raps +/- statistics for this year (20 games) and my fears were actualized. Now, I know that plus/minus is not viewed the same as in hockey, and some people give it little merit in basketball, but when their is this much discrepancy between Amir and JV (or Bargs) for that matter, it makes me think that there is a strong case to put JV on the bench to start the game and start Amir.

    Here is the link: http://www.nba.com/statistics/plusmi...9&team=Raptors

    Notice that Amir is one of only 2 Raps in the plus (+31), while JV is the worst (-116) and Bargs is second worst (-108). JV has also had about 270 less minutes than Bargs to accumulate that poor stat.

    I watch JV with rose-colored glasses and think that any time he touches an offensive board, or makes an aggressive move, he is doing well... Amir on the other hand only gets my praise when he does something truly great. In other words, I have a double standard and so do the commentators.

    JV will be good, very good, but we are definitely sacrificing good starts, and possibly wins, to get there.
    For interests sake, our top 2 line combinations at +15 and +12 (dis)respectfully are:
    Calderon, DeRozan, Anderson, Bargs, Amir
    Calderon, DeRozan, McGuire, Bargs, Amir

    In fact Amir and Calderon are our best 2-man combination (for +/-) and Amir Johnson is in ALL of our top 6 2-man combos:
    Amir and Calderon
    Amir and Lowry
    Amir and Bargs
    Amir and Ross
    Amir and DeRozan
    Amir and Pietrus

    Can I totally revert my initial thread, show my JV love and ask for Amir to play with JV... that should help JV's plus/minus!

  3. #63
    Raptors Republic Superstar planetmars's Avatar
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    JV struggles I think are a combination of things (not strong enough to cover the post, not NBA ready, etc), but I think the biggest issue is with communication between the bigs namely JV and Bargnani.

    Butch Carter kept repeating on Prime Time this sentiment but it makes sense. You want your two bigs to always communicate with each other, especially on defense. One has to know where the other will be at all times. I think Bargnani is actually a very poor communicator, and JV since he's a rookie (and still hasn't grasped the English language) will have a hard time communicating with Andrea as to where he should be rotating or who he should be covering.

    I thought the Knicks were going to be meh this season, but they have two veterans in Chandler and Thomas that know how to communicate well in the post.

    Amir and Ed in my opinion are the strongest frontcourt on the team. Using Amir with Bargnani or Ed with JV I don't think will result in a good situation either (although I do see JV/Davis being more prone to success than JV/Bargnani at this point).

    I don't think its wrong to put JV on the bench, but he needs to be paired with someone that can communicate clearly with him. For all the talk of getting a stud 3 on the team, I think it's as important to get a PF that can communicate well with JV. I'm not sure who that would be, but this season has taught us one thing for sure, and that Bargnani/JV have very little chemistry.

  4. #64
    Raptors Republic Icon mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Casey said before the game that he toyed with the idea of changing is starting lineup – replacing Jonas Valanciunas with Amir Johnson – but didn’t make a move after closer review of Wednesday’s game in Sacramento.

    :I hinted at possble lineup changes, but again I think that would send the wrong message,” he said. “We want to be patient with our young kid (Valanciunas) and sometimes it’s frustrating. Sometimes he’s frustrated a little bit but he’s growing. As many mistakes as he’s making, he’s also growing.”

    Besides, there was more than enough blame to spread around.

    “That’s why you should always watch the film because he didn’t make as many mistakes as you thought he did,” Casey said. “Even though we gave up 56 points in the paint (agains the Kings), everyone had a little of that from top to bottom.

    “We’re patient with Jonas and we’re going to keep the lineup the same. Again, if we get in trouble we still have Amir and Eddy who are doing an excellent job of bringing energy, athleticism, speed and quickness to the table in case we get in trouble.”

    http://thestar.blogs.com/raptors/201...utah-rout.html
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  5. #65
    Raptors Republic Starter RAPresenting's Avatar
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    Quote The Coach wrote: View Post
    For interests sake, our top 2 line combinations at +15 and +12 (dis)respectfully are:
    Calderon, DeRozan, Anderson, Bargs, Amir
    Calderon, DeRozan, McGuire, Bargs, Amir

    In fact Amir and Calderon are our best 2-man combination (for +/-) and Amir Johnson is in ALL of our top 6 2-man combos:
    Amir and Calderon
    Amir and Lowry
    Amir and Bargs
    Amir and Ross
    Amir and DeRozan
    Amir and Pietrus

    Can I totally revert my initial thread, show my JV love and ask for Amir to play with JV... that should help JV's plus/minus!
    I`m surprised that no one has responded to this. Impressive stuff!

  6. #66
    Raptors Republic Superstar BasketballCrush's Avatar
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    Quote The Coach wrote: View Post
    For interests sake, our top 2 line combinations at +15 and +12 (dis)respectfully are:
    Calderon, DeRozan, Anderson, Bargs, Amir
    Calderon, DeRozan, McGuire, Bargs, Amir

    In fact Amir and Calderon are our best 2-man combination (for +/-) and Amir Johnson is in ALL of our top 6 2-man combos:
    Amir and Calderon
    Amir and Lowry
    Amir and Bargs
    Amir and Ross
    Amir and DeRozan
    Amir and Pietrus

    Can I totally revert my initial thread, show my JV love and ask for Amir to play with JV... that should help JV's plus/minus!
    This is why I like 82games.com for their plus minus. It is a Simple rating and takes into account the team production while the player is on the floor and production while they are off. It also looks at the opposing position and adjust for that. You will find that Amir is on top and Jose is actually better for the team than Lowry (marginly), when D and O are accounted for.


    I am not worried about JV's and TR's Simple rating that much, because they will make mistakes and the first two seasons the team must find a way to incorporate them and give them as much minutes while minimizing pain. Development costs steam.
    Last edited by BasketballCrush; Thu Dec 13th, 2012 at 10:07 PM.

  7. #67
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    Quote BasketballCrush wrote: View Post
    This is why I like 82games.com for their plus minus. It is a Simple rating and takes into account the team production while the player is on the floor and production while they are off. It also looks at the opposing position and adjust for that. You will find that Amir is on top and Jose is actually better for the team than Lowry (marginly), when D and O are accounted for.


    I am not worried about JV's and TR's Simple rating that much, because they will make mistakes and the first two seasons the team must find a way to incorporate them and give them as much minutes while minimizing pain. Development costs steam.
    Thanks for the link... looks like a nice stat. How bad our are SF's in that graphic!?... ugh.

  8. #68
    Raptors Republic Superstar BasketballCrush's Avatar
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    They have a link on the main page and all teams are ranked by position.

    I believe we were 29th out of 30 at SF.

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