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Thread: Bargniani "we are the worst team in the NBA "

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    Default Bargniani "we are the worst team in the NBA "

    http://www.thescore.com/home/article...eam-in-the-nba

    "Nothing has worked from the beginning of the season. We are pretty much the worst team in the NBA. This summer's moves in the market were made to build a winning team, but we are not winning.

    "We are below all of the expectations. No one is used to playing with anyone. We have won four games: it's a tragic thing. Whatever way you look at it, it is a desperate situation. Since four years ago, we have kept losing. To improve, the only thing we can do is to win, and for now, we have not."
    I guess he can actually express some emotion, even tho its probably detrimental to the team but whatever he has an opinion.

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    A big part of the reason for the Raptors being a bottom feeder falls squarely on his shoulders.

    #tradeBargnani
    "You donít know the Bruno Caboclo......"
    Bruno Caboclo

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    A big part of the reason for the Raptors being a bottom feeder falls squarely on his shoulders.

    #tradeBargnani
    I dont know if it's all him, he's not the guy and never will be to have put all our chips on his shoulders is probably BC's and Casey's fault they should have known that, its their JOB. Ive always thought he would be an excellent 6th man, if you look back in his second season i think was his best year. He would come off the bench and shoot 3's and drive against the other teams much weaker bigs. He's being used wrong IMO yes he has been inconsistent but i believe he cant handle that role of being the MAN and its been proven for the last two years.

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    Quote Top5Pick wrote: View Post
    I dont know if it's all him, he's not the guy and never will be to have put all our chips on his shoulders is probably BC's and Casey's fault they should have known that, its their JOB. Ive always thought he would be an excellent 6th man, if you look back in his second season i think was his best year. He would come off the bench and shoot 3's and drive against the other teams much weaker bigs. He's being used wrong IMO yes he has been inconsistent but i believe he cant handle that role of being the MAN and its been proven for the last two years.
    It is not Casey's or BC's fault he refuses to help defend, rebound, play any sort of consistent defense, pass the ball, or take poor/weak/ill-advised/straight legged shots/numerous shots.

    I defended the guy for years. The defense was merited because he finally showed what he could be. The issue I failed to recognize was he wasn't interested in being great.
    "You donít know the Bruno Caboclo......"
    Bruno Caboclo

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    It is not Casey's or BC's fault he refuses to help defend, rebound, play any sort of consistent defense, pass the ball, or take poor/weak/ill-advised/straight legged shots/numerous shots.

    I defended the guy for years. The defense was merited because he finally showed what he could be. The issue I failed to recognize was he wasn't interested in being great.

    It is their fault Matt if he isnt performing its their job to do something about it whether its bringng him off the bench or benching the meatball, whatever it takes to win ! I think Casey has dropped the ball over and over this year.

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    Default This is really all about BC's Ego !

    It is i mean the guy doesnt want admit he picked the wrong guy, he doesnt want to give up on his prized Euro, the second coming of Dirk Nowitzki ! and Casey bought into to it too claming "thru thick or thin he is on our guy ". It all comes down to egos we all know it should Amir or Ed starting they more athletic and more have better all round Defence than Bargs, they just have the fundementals and instincts to play the system that Casey wants and they showed it last year.

    Which is why our PA has gone up this year Bargs is not rebounding, playing D and hitting shots consistantly but like i said it comes down to egos and those two have let the team by not doing anything about it.

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    Quote Top5Pick wrote: View Post
    It is their fault Matt if he isnt performing its their job to do something about it whether its bringng him off the bench or benching the meatball, whatever it takes to win ! I think Casey has dropped the ball over and over this year.
    So Bargnani has no responsibility? Jeeesh! Management gives him slack for years. Coaches cut him breaks for years. Fans still giving the guy a pass.

    Management and coaches have tried for years to make him put his talent on display. They all deserve blame, no doubt, but for the love of all that is sacred and pure do not give Bargnani a pass. I said originally 'a big part' of the blame. I didn't lay it solely on him but considering Bargnani, Calderon, and BC are the only 3 to be with the franchise for the last 7 years......
    "You donít know the Bruno Caboclo......"
    Bruno Caboclo

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    It is not Casey's or BC's fault he refuses to help defend, rebound, play any sort of consistent defense, pass the ball, or take poor/weak/ill-advised/straight legged shots/numerous shots.

    I defended the guy for years. The defense was merited because he finally showed what he could be. The issue I failed to recognize was he wasn't interested in being great.
    It is at least partly their fault. Certainly BC's. I don't think they ever had a good defensive coach (before). During all his developmental years the organisation hasn't done a good job in development. That's strictly on BC. It's also their fault because they don't need to play him. If he doesn't do enough or didn't do enough in the past they should have acted upon it; e.g. by benching or trading him.

    Like I've mentioned before, even if they have the basketball talent, not all talented players have the mental talent like the great players; some develop it, but most don't. He might be interested to be great, but (in my opinion) he lacks the mental toughness to overcome adversity and play through adversity (when he's tired it shows, when results aren't there it shows). People can blame him all they want for it, but it's going way too far for me to question his character just because he lacks the mental make-up to become a great player (or even a good player). It would be the same to attack Reggie Evans for his lack of skills. It's just silly.

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    Quote Soft Euro wrote: View Post
    It is at least partly their fault. Certainly BC's. I don't think they ever had a good defensive coach (before). During all his developmental years the organisation hasn't done a good job in development. That's strictly on BC. It's also their fault because they don't need to play him. If he doesn't do enough or didn't do enough in the past they should have acted upon it; e.g. by benching or trading him.

    Like I've mentioned before, even if they have the basketball talent, not all talented players have the mental talent like the great players; some develop it, but most don't. He might be interested to be great, but (in my opinion) he lacks the mental toughness to overcome adversity and play through adversity (when he's tired it shows, when results aren't there it shows). People can blame him all they want for it, but it's going way too far for me to question his character just because he lacks the mental make-up to become a great player (or even a good player). It would be the same to attack Reggie Evans for his lack of skills. It's just silly.

    In agreement especially re mental toughness.

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    Quote Brandon wrote: View Post
    "mental make-up"? Jesus Christ, there's a lot of deep thinkin' goin' on here. He's not good. You don't need to attach electrodes and Ghostbusters-type equipment to him to try to figure out the bloody why of it. Does it matter why? Bottom line, he sucks. He doesn't produce. He's gotta go.
    Swoosh

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    Quote Top5Pick wrote: View Post
    I dont know if it's all him, he's not the guy and never will be to have put all our chips on his shoulders is probably BC's and Casey's fault they should have known that, its their JOB. Ive always thought he would be an excellent 6th man, if you look back in his second season i think was his best year. He would come off the bench and shoot 3's and drive against the other teams much weaker bigs. He's being used wrong IMO yes he has been inconsistent but i believe he cant handle that role of being the MAN and its been proven for the last two years.
    His second year was his worst, actually. What blame there is for this team falling short so far is Colangelo's; who's idea do you think it was to up the tempo, to make sure lowry got his shats, to make all the moves that were made, including and especially landry fields, BryCo, the big turnaround has turned into the big miscalculation and cast a shadow on all his previous, and unsuccessful moves, instead of saving him from them.

    What is unfortunate, however, is it only would have taken one win plus the jazz and spurs ot games and the hand wringing wouldn't be nearly as intense, nor would their playoff chances; now, it will obviously be very difficult to stay motivated. What is more unfortunate, there will likely be just as much continuity next year as there has been the last...every year B.C. with Calderon, Kleiza, Anderson, Fields, Bargnani, Lowry, Gray and Johnson in various degrees of limbo and hopefully DeRozan is available but likely won't be going anywhere, ever, so Its TRoss, JV Ed and DD as a core that scares nobody, and instead of dealing from a position of relative strength with a playoff contending team and pieces, Bryan has to sell losers who lose and are sick and tired of losing but still lose on the trade market; the real tragedy of this season, in my opinion, is that it was about that trade for a 3 later in the year, but is getting harder and harder to see happening.

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    Quote Top5Pick wrote: View Post
    I dont know if it's all him, he's not the guy and never will be to have put all our chips on his shoulders is probably BC's and Casey's fault they should have known that, its their JOB. Ive always thought he would be an excellent 6th man, if you look back in his second season i think was his best year. He would come off the bench and shoot 3's and drive against the other teams much weaker bigs. He's being used wrong IMO yes he has been inconsistent but i believe he cant handle that role of being the MAN and its been proven for the last two years.
    http://www.nba.com/playerfile/andrea...eer_stats.html

    Take a look at Bargniani's second season. It was his worst as a pro (though this year is close). I assume you mean his third season but by then he was mostly starting. Bargniani has never been a productive piece off the bench.

    For some people, a bench demotion would serve as motivation, but in Bargs' case I highly doubt that. Anyways, the same flaws are there whether he starts or comes off the bench. Frankly, I don't want a guy that doesn't defend or rebound anywhere in this lineup. Bargniani is not even a potential piece here. Maybe a franchise with better player development can get some useful contribution from him down the road, but that will never happen here.

    The only question now is if we can get rid of his contract without having to give another team a goody to take him on. If nobody wants him, then I think it's amnesty time this off season. Then Colangelo, Gerhardini, and Bargniani can all take a gondola ride into the sunset, and this team can finally move on from our one of the darkest periods in our brief history.

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    Quote pcrombeen wrote: View Post
    http://www.nba.com/playerfile/andrea...eer_stats.html

    Take a look at Bargniani's second season. It was his worst as a pro (though this year is close). I assume you mean his third season but by then he was mostly starting. Bargniani has never been a productive piece off the bench.

    For some people, a bench demotion would serve as motivation, but in Bargs' case I highly doubt that. Anyways, the same flaws are there whether he starts or comes off the bench. Frankly, I don't want a guy that doesn't defend or rebound anywhere in this lineup. Bargniani is not even a potential piece here. Maybe a franchise with better player development can get some useful contribution from him down the road, but that will never happen here.

    The only question now is if we can get rid of his contract without having to give another team a goody to take him on. If nobody wants him, then I think it's amnesty time this off season. Then Colangelo, Gerhardini, and Bargniani can all take a gondola ride into the sunset, and this team can finally move on from our one of the darkest periods in our brief history.
    Yes the third season thanks for the correction ! He started 58/79 and I recall him being more consistent coming off the bench then starting, was like night and day. There's still value for bargs in the market so I don't think amnesty is the way to go yet, Someone else said that it would hurt Bargs coming off the bench, but he has to know its for the teams best interest and hopefully he would take it as motivation because to say it wouldn't, you would have to have insider information to know that he would respond that way.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star ebrian's Avatar
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    The talk about hockey reminds me of Eric Lindros and how he never really wanted the C. They built a team around him and called him a leader when all he wanted to do was play hockey and not have to get involved with all the other stuff. Sometimes players are just suited to play 2nd or 3rd fiddle because they just don't have the leadership qualities. Andrea Bargnani is a scorer, and not an efficient one at that. But nothing in his personality or style of play dictates leadership qualities. Colangelo's failure to grasp this is why this team sucks as much as it does today and all throughout Bargnani's tenure as a Raptor.

    I don't hate Bargnani, I hate Colangelo for believing in him.
    your pal,
    ebrian

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    Quote ebrian wrote: View Post
    The talk about hockey reminds me of Eric Lindros and how he never really wanted the C. They built a team around him and called him a leader when all he wanted to do was play hockey and not have to get involved with all the other stuff. Sometimes players are just suited to play 2nd or 3rd fiddle because they just don't have the leadership qualities. Andrea Bargnani is a scorer, and not an efficient one at that. But nothing in his personality or style of play dictates leadership qualities. Colangelo's failure to grasp this is why this team sucks as much as it does today and all throughout Bargnani's tenure as a Raptor.

    I don't hate Bargnani, I hate Colangelo for believing in him.
    You can polish a turd roll it in glitter and tell me its a fucking diamond, lol i may believe you for a little bit but after a while ill figuere it out, this is pretty much the case here.

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    Quote ebrian wrote: View Post
    I don't hate Bargnani, I hate Colangelo for believing in him.
    Rap of the day IMO!

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    Quote special1 wrote: View Post
    Rap of the day IMO!
    i hate them both.

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    Now they are winning so we keep lottery pick this year!! Yikes!!

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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    A big part of the reason for the Raptors being a bottom feeder falls squarely on his shoulders.

    #tradeBargnani
    I wonder if he gets that?

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    The nice thing about Hockey, is that you can strip your franchise guys of the "C" on their jersey. Doesn't cost you anything, and it sends a clear message to fans and the player in question.

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