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Thread: Gay to debut for Raptors on Sunday [Post #727]

  1. #221
    Raptors Republic Superstar planetmars's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    This is how much value Calderon has.
    I'm a bit surprised that Memphis wouldn't want him considering he's an expiring. It's a quick way of freeing up a lot of cap space. He would also have an instant connection with M Gasol. Curious as to what Memphis would want from Toronto if they don't want Jose. I hope its Bargnani

  2. #222
    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    This is how much value Calderon has.
    But he has the highest assist:turnover ratio of all time!!!! [sarcasm]
    "I don't lie. I willfully participate in a campaign of misinformation." - Fox Mulder

  3. #223
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    Quote planetmars wrote: View Post
    I'm a bit surprised that Memphis wouldn't want him considering he's an expiring. It's a quick way of freeing up a lot of cap space. He would also have an instant connection with M Gasol. Curious as to what Memphis would want from Toronto if they don't want Jose. I hope its Bargnani
    They don't want anything from toronto other than ED, TR, or JV. Of those only ED better be available.

    Calderon is a good player but his contract is so large on the books that they are then really limited in addressing the hole at starting SF. Backup wings continue to be an issue as well as a lack of 3pt shooting.

    This was always going to have to be a 3 or 4 team trade. Calderon and ED was never and will never cut it for Gay.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
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    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  4. #224
    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    They don't want anything from toronto other than ED, TR, or JV. Of those only ED better be available.

    Calderon is a good player but his contract is so large on the books that they are then really limited in addressing the hole at starting SF. Backup wings continue to be an issue as well as a lack of 3pt shooting.

    This was always going to have to be a 3 or 4 team trade. Calderon and ED was never and will never cut it for Gay.
    What about something like this?

    http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=bk32ux9


    Boston
    - Calderon becomes 1-year rental starting PG
    - Anderson replaces Green as backup SF and provides 3pt shooting
    - Acy provides PF depth on a depleted roster
    - huge financial savings beyond this year, to help them rebuild when they decide to move on from Pierce & Garnett

    Memphis
    - Davis & Sullinger provide good, young, cheap insurance behind Gasol & Randolph
    - Arthur (or maybe even Randolph) becomes expendable to be used in a subsequent trade
    - Green replaces Gay to compete with Pondexter for starting SF
    - save approx. $4.5M this year

    Toronto
    - Gay becomes legit starting SF and #1 scorer
    - still have Bargnani/Amir at PF, Gay/DeRozan/Ross/Fields on the wings and Lowry/Lucas at PG
    - could even trade 1 or 2 2nd round picks to Boston and/or Memphis, if need be, to further sweeten the pot

  5. #225
    Raptors Republic Rookie japetas's Avatar
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    Quote planetmars wrote: View Post
    I'm a bit surprised that Memphis wouldn't want him considering he's an expiring. It's a quick way of freeing up a lot of cap space. He would also have an instant connection with M Gasol. Curious as to what Memphis would want from Toronto if they don't want Jose. I hope its Bargnani
    Memphis wants to contend this season and they already have a solid PG. They need someone who could replace outgoing Gay, so this is a option:
    http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=bdh6jkl (picks could be included)

    And this is more realistic trade scenario:
    http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=bj7poqr (picks could be included)

    EDIT:
    In scenario #1 Davis could land to Boston and Arthur may go nowhere
    Last edited by japetas; Tue Jan 29th, 2013 at 03:00 PM.
    (Sorry for poor English )

  6. #226
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    I think any trade with Memphis needs to take in to consideration:

    1) ability to improve moving forward i.e. cap space and luxury tax thresholds
    2) Hollinger's numbers in the trade machine and PER - seriously.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  7. #227
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    Crisis averted:

    Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA

    As for finding a spot for Calderon, yes, teams have interest in him. Yet how much are they willing to contribute to MEM-TOR in 3-way deal?
    When Woj is reporting, shit is real in my opinion.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  8. #228
    Raptors Republic Superstar BasketballCrush's Avatar
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    I would just let the other teams make the deal.... Gay should stay with Memphis. He gets along well with medical staff there.


    I don't want to trade for a player that has not played 82 games in 3 seasons.

  9. #229
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    Quote BasketballCrush wrote: View Post
    I would just let the other teams make the deal.... Gay should stay with Memphis. He gets along well with medical staff there.


    I don't want to trade for a player that has not played 82 games in 3 seasons.
    You would be hard pressed to find a player who has played in 82 games in 3 seasons considering there were only 66 games last year.... of which Gay played 65.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  10. #230
    Raptors Republic Superstar BasketballCrush's Avatar
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    Gay has long history of injury, pair him with Lowry, and we are on the treadmill. We need someone who can handle the workload.


    I also think you guys are crazy for taking what "Memphis" wants seriously, NO reputable team will give it to them for Gay.
    Last edited by BasketballCrush; Tue Jan 29th, 2013 at 03:11 PM.

  11. #231
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    Quote BasketballCrush wrote: View Post
    Gay has long history of injury, pair him with Lowry, and we are on the treadmill. We need someone who can handle the workload.
    He had one shoulder injury in his entire career!

    C'mon.

    He missed 10 games in 374 prior to his shoulder injury.

    He has missed 3 games since (2 of which were for his grandmother's funeral and the other was one game last year).

    Hey, if you are worried about the future fair enough but there is nothing in his past to make him an injury concern. 1 injury in 7 seasons is pretty impressive for an NBA player.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  12. #232
    Raptors Republic All-Star slaw's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Crisis averted:

    When Woj is reporting, shit is real in my opinion.
    This whole thing is ridiculous. It made sense when you were talking about bringing Nash in and maybe another 2-guard. As it is, it makes no sense. Plus, consider Rudy Gay in all this: he would be leaving a team that could, if things fall right, challenge for the Western Conference playoff crown, to go to a team that won't even make the playoffs. I'm sure we'll get his best basketball....

  13. #233
    Raptors Republic Superstar BasketballCrush's Avatar
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    I remember hearing about concussions... his current FG% is of concern, as is Memphis's interest to shed him off their team. They know him best.

  14. #234
    Raptors Republic All-Star Balls of Steel's Avatar
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    Quote slaw wrote: View Post
    This whole thing is ridiculous. It made sense when you were talking about bringing Nash in and maybe another 2-guard. As it is, it makes no sense. Plus, consider Rudy Gay in all this: he would be leaving a team that could, if things fall right, challenge for the Western Conference playoff crown, to go to a team that won't even make the playoffs. I'm sure we'll get his best basketball....
    Gonna play devil's advocate here. There's 2 more years left in his contract plus this season. He'll be 29 when it's all said and done. He can get one more good contract. Instincts tell me he'll play his a$$ off for the Rap$$$.
    “The saving of our world from pending doom will come, not through the complacent adjustment of the conforming majority, but through the creative maladjustment of a nonconforming minority.” - Martin Luther King

  15. #235
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    Quote slaw wrote: View Post
    This whole thing is ridiculous. It made sense when you were talking about bringing Nash in and maybe another 2-guard. As it is, it makes no sense. Plus, consider Rudy Gay in all this: he would be leaving a team that could, if things fall right, challenge for the Western Conference playoff crown, to go to a team that won't even make the playoffs. I'm sure we'll get his best basketball....
    I'm down with Gay on 2 conditions:

    1) Lowry/TR/JV remains
    2) DeRozan and Bargnani are moved - I'd rather pay Gay $18M for 2 years than Bargnani/DeRozan for 2/4 years.


    To be honest I am not overly enthused by this deal or the rumours. Just talking about what the Twitterverse gives us.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  16. #236
    Raptors Republic Superstar BasketballCrush's Avatar
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    I think his efficiency this year should be a concern. I know that concussions can have long term lasting damage on coordination, it actually gets worse as you get older. This sort of damage could easily show up in the FG% of the player and I am seeing warning signs when I look at the sudden drop this year, and Memphis shopping him.

    The drop in his efficiency worries me. His PER is at 14.4 this year. That would rank him, 9th on our team (behind Alan Anderson).



    I am not prepared to take this chance. Unless the asking price is seriously reduced.
    Last edited by BasketballCrush; Tue Jan 29th, 2013 at 03:43 PM.

  17. #237
    Raptors Republic All-Star slaw's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    I'm down with Gay on 2 conditions:

    1) Lowry/TR/JV remains
    2) DeRozan and Bargnani are moved - I'd rather pay Gay $18M for 2 years than Bargnani/DeRozan for 2/4 years.


    To be honest I am not overly enthused by this deal or the rumours. Just talking about what the Twitterverse gives us.
    Fair enough. I would rather not pay any of them but I guess I would rather pay Rudy Gay than Derozan/Bargs, too.

    I advocated considering a blockbuster this summer, along with trying to sign Nash, as an alternative to a full-on rebuild but I just can't get behind any half-ass plans like this one. To me, if you really want to win now, you have to do something similar to what Boston, Miami, the Knicks, Brooklyn have done recently. You can't just add Rudy Gay and hope for the best, which is what this feels like to me.

  18. #238
    Raptors Republic All-Star Balls of Steel's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    I'm down with Gay on 2 conditions:

    1) Lowry/TR/JV remains
    2) DeRozan and Bargnani are moved - I'd rather pay Gay $18M for 2 years than Bargnani/DeRozan for 2/4 years.


    To be honest I am not overly enthused by this deal or the rumours. Just talking about what the Twitterverse gives us.
    Let's just say that what you're thinking is Twilight Zone-ish similar to my thinking. Scary actually.
    “The saving of our world from pending doom will come, not through the complacent adjustment of the conforming majority, but through the creative maladjustment of a nonconforming minority.” - Martin Luther King

  19. #239
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    Quote BasketballCrush wrote: View Post
    I think his efficiency this year should be a concern. I know that concussions can have long term lasting damage on coordination, it actually gets worse as you get older. This sort of damage could easily show up in the FG% of the player and I am seeing warning signs when I look at the sudden drop this year, and Memphis shopping him.

    The drop in his efficiency worries me. His PER is at 14.4 this year. That would rank him, 9th on our team (behind Alan Anderson).



    I am not prepared to take this chance. Unless the asking price is seriously reduced.
    You mean the concussion he missed one game for?

    And then came back to light up Toronto for 26/11?
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  20. #240
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    Quote slaw wrote: View Post
    Fair enough. I would rather not pay any of them but I guess I would rather pay Rudy Gay than Derozan/Bargs, too.

    I advocated considering a blockbuster this summer, along with trying to sign Nash, as an alternative to a full-on rebuild but I just can't get behind any half-ass plans like this one. To me, if you really want to win now, you have to do something similar to what Boston, Miami, the Knicks, Brooklyn have done recently. You can't just add Rudy Gay and hope for the best, which is what this feels like to me.
    There will be another shoe to drop in the form of an Italian loafer.

    It seems like Colangelo is doing all he can to deliver a final 1-2 punch.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

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