View Poll Results: Which team in the top 8 in the East is most likely to drop out of the playoffs

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Thread: Hollinger's Power Ranking has Raps 6th in the East

  1. #1
    Raptors Republic All-Star ezz_bee's Avatar
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    Default Hollinger's Power Ranking has Raps 6th in the East

    I check Hollinger's power rankings a couple times a week just to see whose trending (and not) based on his fully automated statistical rankings.

    Although it doesn't mean much, I'm happy to see the raps in the top half of the league for the first time this season albeit they squeak in at 15.

    Also nice to see that they are currently ranked sixth in the East using his metrics. They are behind (in order of appearance)

    Knicks
    Heat
    Pacers
    Nets
    Bulls

    Just squeaking past the Hawks, Bucks and Celtics.

    I don't think this means that we'll end up with the 6th best record overall, but it does reinforce that we've been playing really well the last month. I still don't think it's likely that we'll make the playoffs as we'd have to have a better record than at least 1 of three teams that are immediatley trailing us in Hollinger's rankings. IF we could sustain our current winning ways then it's certainly possible, however I don't think that's likely because a number of factors have to go the right way. My opinion is cap'd in brackets.

    Anderson has to stay (mostly) hot OR Fields gets back to his preinjury days with the knicks (NOT LIKELY)

    Continue to get good production out of PF/C position (NOT LIKELY), due to injuries, unless bargnani is effective off the bench (IMPROBABLE)

    Continue to get good production from Jose or increased production from Lowry (PROBABLE)

    Demar needs to take it up one more notch offensively, he still disappears to often and for too long (OKC game) for us to challenge the better teams in the league and I think we'll need to beat a few "elite" teams if we want a good enough record for the playoffs. Don't get me wrong, I do think that Demar has progressed this season and I'm happy with his effort and production, but we are still missing players who can manufacture points when things aren't going well or when the opposing teams defense tightens up. Unfortunately, as our SG and primary slasher that responsibility rests mostly on him. (PUSH)

    In order to make the playoffs the raps have to have the mental fortitude to grind it out EVERY game for the next three months, that's a tall order for any team (except maybe the spurs?) and as well as the raps are playing NOW it's just to big of a hole that they are trying to dig themselves out of.

    To be honest I won't be disappointed if they don't make the playoffs, I'd be happy to see them continue to put out the effort and hustle (and trade bargs for something useful) and finish 9th or 10th... but it's still nice to see us in the top half of the league in Hollinger's metric.

    Want to check out Hollinger's rankings yourself? Here are teams 1-15 & 16-30

    This is based on the rankings of Jan. 10th, since they updated daily the information source may no longer be accurate as of Jan. 11th...
    "We only have one rule on this team. What is that rule? E.L.E. That's right's, E.L.E, and what does E.L.E. stand for? EVERYBODY LOVE EVERYBODY. Right there up on the wall, because this isn't just a basketball team, this is a lifestyle. ~ Jackie Moon

  2. #2
    Raptors Republic Rookie RobertArchibald's Avatar
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    You bring up good points but I have to disagree with the DeMar comment and how he needs to step it up a notch and disappeared against OKC. I think he deserves a ton of credit for how much he's already stepped it up offensively this year. To ask more is simply unrealistic. As for the OKC game, he was trying (with zero success) to get his game going but the OKC D was stellar against him. The only thing I would've liked to see him do in that game was try and dish the ball a bit more. OKC was completely focused on him and he's not Kobe-esque in that he can just 'turn it up a notch' and take on all comers.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star ezz_bee's Avatar
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    Quote RobertArchibald wrote: View Post
    You bring up good points but I have to disagree with the DeMar comment and how he needs to step it up a notch and disappeared against OKC. I think he deserves a ton of credit for how much he's already stepped it up offensively this year. To ask more is simply unrealistic. As for the OKC game, he was trying (with zero success) to get his game going but the OKC D was stellar against him. The only thing I would've liked to see him do in that game was try and dish the ball a bit more. OKC was completely focused on him and he's not Kobe-esque in that he can just 'turn it up a notch' and take on all comers.
    I was trying to be critical of Demar or his game and apologize if I gave that impression.

    I don't think Demar needs to step up, I agree that he's progressed this season and I have no issues with how he's playing. I also agree that it is unrealistic to expect more from him.

    What I do think though is that without a guy who can manufacture scores it's going to be very difficult for us to make up the amount of ground what we've lost with our terrible start. This is one of the reasons why I think it is unrealistic to think that we will make the playoffs. We don't have a guy who can manufacture points. Demar is only guy (with maybe the exception of Lowry) he could possibly be that player sooner rather than later. With Demar it may even be next year. Unfortunately, I believe that to make the playoffs we're going to need a guy to manufacture scores this season. I'm not holding Demar accountable I merely stating that my opinion is that if w+x+y don't happen then z won't happen. In this case y=demar kicking it up a notch and z=playoffs.

    But to reiterate, Demar is playing significantly better this year, and we shouldn't realistically expect more from him, and I don't/won't hold him personally responsible if we don't make the playoffs, because I don't think it's realistic to think we will.


    EDIT: It also isn't fair for me to slam Demar for his OKC performance (and that wasn't my intent) as they absolutely keyed on him defensively. However, I did pick the OKC game because I believe that was a real test to see just how much the raps have turned things around and how talented we are. In order to make the playoffs we are going to have win some games against elite teams, and it will be difficult for the raps to win if Demar get shut down/has an off night, and without winning a few of those games we don't make the playoffs (imho).
    Last edited by ezz_bee; Thu Jan 10th, 2013 at 02:18 PM.
    "We only have one rule on this team. What is that rule? E.L.E. That's right's, E.L.E, and what does E.L.E. stand for? EVERYBODY LOVE EVERYBODY. Right there up on the wall, because this isn't just a basketball team, this is a lifestyle. ~ Jackie Moon

  4. #4
    Raptors Republic Starter Papa Burgundy's Avatar
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    It's not likely that we get good production from the PF/C spots? Hmmm
    And not likely that Anderson plays hot, or Landry?

    I dunno - it's been all about team lately, so I think all that matters is a group of men working hard for a common goal.

    As Jack likes to say in broadcasts - "You can do great things, when no one cares who gets the credit."
    The only way to bag a classy lady is to give her two tickets to the gun show... and see if she likes the goods.

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    Administrator Arsenalist's Avatar
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    Hey, it's good to see the Raptors in the top-half of the league in anything positive. I thought Anderson would've cooled off a while ago, not sure how long he can keep this up. He's actually providing clutch scoring which is insane.

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    Super Moderator ReubenJRD's Avatar
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    Quote RobertArchibald wrote: View Post
    You bring up good points but I have to disagree with the DeMar comment and how he needs to step it up a notch and disappeared against OKC. I think he deserves a ton of credit for how much he's already stepped it up offensively this year. To ask more is simply unrealistic. As for the OKC game, he was trying (with zero success) to get his game going but the OKC D was stellar against him. The only thing I would've liked to see him do in that game was try and dish the ball a bit more. OKC was completely focused on him and he's not Kobe-esque in that he can just 'turn it up a notch' and take on all comers.
    I agree. Demar was just taken out of the game. Whenever Derozan had the ball throughout the game, you always saw a swarm of 2 blue shirts on Derozan. They didn't want him getting going at ALL. Also, OKC was beating the initial defense (Lowry, Calderon) time after time, where Derozan wasn't able to be at his best defensively. Disrupting passing lanes.

    Without another really good scorer on the court/team alike Derozan, it'll be hard for him to get some attention off. Bargnani was supposed to be that guy, Lowry was supposed to help out. So far, they've been weak.

  7. #7
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    Quote ezz_bee wrote: View Post
    I check Hollinger's power rankings a couple times a week just to see whose trending (and not) based on his fully automated statistical rankings.

    Although it doesn't mean much, I'm happy to see the raps in the top half of the league for the first time this season albeit they squeak in at 15.

    Also nice to see that they are currently ranked sixth in the East using his metrics. They are behind (in order of appearance)

    Knicks
    Heat
    Pacers
    Nets
    Bulls

    Just squeaking past the Hawks, Bucks and Celtics.

    I don't think this means that we'll end up with the 6th best record overall, but it does reinforce that we've been playing really well the last month. I still don't think it's likely that we'll make the playoffs as we'd have to have a better record than at least 1 of three teams that are immediatley trailing us in Hollinger's rankings. IF we could sustain our current winning ways then it's certainly possible, however I don't think that's likely because a number of factors have to go the right way. My opinion is cap'd in brackets.

    Anderson has to stay (mostly) hot OR Fields gets back to his preinjury days with the knicks (NOT LIKELY)

    Continue to get good production out of PF/C position (NOT LIKELY), due to injuries, unless bargnani is effective off the bench (IMPROBABLE)

    Continue to get good production from Jose or increased production from Lowry (PROBABLE)

    Demar needs to take it up one more notch offensively, he still disappears to often and for too long (OKC game) for us to challenge the better teams in the league and I think we'll need to beat a few "elite" teams if we want a good enough record for the playoffs. Don't get me wrong, I do think that Demar has progressed this season and I'm happy with his effort and production, but we are still missing players who can manufacture points when things aren't going well or when the opposing teams defense tightens up. Unfortunately, as our SG and primary slasher that responsibility rests mostly on him. (PUSH)

    In order to make the playoffs the raps have to have the mental fortitude to grind it out EVERY game for the next three months, that's a tall order for any team (except maybe the spurs?) and as well as the raps are playing NOW it's just to big of a hole that they are trying to dig themselves out of.

    To be honest I won't be disappointed if they don't make the playoffs, I'd be happy to see them continue to put out the effort and hustle (and trade bargs for something useful) and finish 9th or 10th... but it's still nice to see us in the top half of the league in Hollinger's metric.

    Want to check out Hollinger's rankings yourself? Here are teams 1-15 & 16-30

    This is based on the rankings of Jan. 10th, since they updated daily the information source may no longer be accurate as of Jan. 11th...
    This is really the point. I think that all of the factors you are listing are the same questions that we've had the whole year. We've proven we can do it, but it is a whole other storey to do this for an entire year. Fact is, we still have a ways to go but the biggest opponent we have in winning the games were supposed to is us

  8. #8
    Raptors Republic Rookie big red's Avatar
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    I just want to point out two things quickly. After the Bulls loss last night, Raps move up to 14th from their spot at 15th yesterday. Very interesting indeed.
    Also, I'm pretty sure the Raps made it to 15th on the same list once before, just before their two game losing streak last week. So this is actually their second time reaching the top half.

  9. #9
    Raptors Republic All-Star ezz_bee's Avatar
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    Quote BallaBalla wrote: View Post
    This is really the point. I think that all of the factors you are listing are the same questions that we've had the whole year. We've proven we can do it, but it is a whole other storey to do this for an entire year. Fact is, we still have a ways to go but the biggest opponent we have in winning the games were supposed to is us
    +100,000

    This is a much better explanation of my thought process, then my opening post. I'm not trying to say that the raps aren't playing well enough to make the playoffs, just that it is unlikely that as individuals, and as a team, they can be mentally focused enough over such a long stretch of games, to play like they are for the rest of the season. Even really good teams (with more talent) go through a bad patch of games every once and awhile, and unfortunately for the raps they don't have very much room for errors.
    "We only have one rule on this team. What is that rule? E.L.E. That's right's, E.L.E, and what does E.L.E. stand for? EVERYBODY LOVE EVERYBODY. Right there up on the wall, because this isn't just a basketball team, this is a lifestyle. ~ Jackie Moon

  10. #10
    Raptors Republic All-Star ezz_bee's Avatar
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    Quote big red wrote: View Post
    I just want to point out two things quickly. After the Bulls loss last night, Raps move up to 14th from their spot at 15th yesterday. Very interesting indeed.
    Also, I'm pretty sure the Raps made it to 15th on the same list once before, just before their two game losing streak last week. So this is actually their second time reaching the top half.
    Thanks for the update, I hadn't checked since I started the thread. Also, it is entirely possible that they made it to 15 and dropped back out before I checked in again so thanks for pointing that out.

    I do think that it wouldn't be to much of a stretch for the raps to beat out Philly in the standings, but the real question is can you see them finishing ahead of anyone else?

    In the last edition of Stein's weekly NBA Power Rankings (non-automated and thus "one man's opinion only"), posted Monday, January 7th he had the raps ranked 23rd and had the following to say

    Don't want to overreact to a couple of home losses after the Raps' recent 8-2 revival. Just being realistic when we say, with apologies to Toronto and Detroit, that we're still likely down to the current top eight and Philly in contention for playoff spots in the Leastern Conference.

    (knocking on wood, but)
    IF Toronto beats Charlotte tonight AND Milwaukee on Sunday it'll be interesting to see it Marc changes his tune. If you think the raps have a shot at making the playoffs then Milwaukee is definitely a game to circle on your calendar.

    I'm back in Rwanda which is 7 hours ahead of EST so watching games is difficult, and I probably won't stay up to watch the bobcats (unless I really can't sleep), but I'm psyched that the Milwaukee game is at a Rwanda friendly 8pm my time.

    I'll have to tell the wife that I've got plans for my only night off this week!
    "We only have one rule on this team. What is that rule? E.L.E. That's right's, E.L.E, and what does E.L.E. stand for? EVERYBODY LOVE EVERYBODY. Right there up on the wall, because this isn't just a basketball team, this is a lifestyle. ~ Jackie Moon

  11. #11
    Raptors Republic All-Star ezz_bee's Avatar
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    IF the raps are going to make the playoffs they have to beat Philly and one other team currently in the top 8. One the reasons why I think that Milwaukee is a big game is that I think they are probably one of the more likely teams (if any) to drop out of the top 8. So I decided to start a poll!!! fell free to explain you answers...

    I voted for Milwaukee, but then I think Brooklyn (new coach boost wears off...) followed by Boston. The top five are pretty much a lock in my opinion. For awhile I considered that maybe chicago would drop off without rose, but they haven't done it yet and he's probably back just after the the all-star game which pretty much guarantee's a playoff birth based on where they currently sit.

    I'm interested if there any teams in particular that may be susceptible to a big slump, which we would need in order to sneak through.
    "We only have one rule on this team. What is that rule? E.L.E. That's right's, E.L.E, and what does E.L.E. stand for? EVERYBODY LOVE EVERYBODY. Right there up on the wall, because this isn't just a basketball team, this is a lifestyle. ~ Jackie Moon

  12. #12
    Raptors Republic All-Star ezz_bee's Avatar
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    If you haven't already done so you should check out the wages of wins post that was brought to my attention in another thread. According to their predictions raps END UP 6th in the East ahead of Chicago, Milwaukee, and Boston!

    If Wagesofwins.com had a vote in this poll it would be for the Celtics since they predict they'll end up a staggering 11th! Food for thought
    "We only have one rule on this team. What is that rule? E.L.E. That's right's, E.L.E, and what does E.L.E. stand for? EVERYBODY LOVE EVERYBODY. Right there up on the wall, because this isn't just a basketball team, this is a lifestyle. ~ Jackie Moon

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